EVE General Discussion

Okay so now it's established that someone feels like he's big brother ...
... and needs to protect people from their own responsibilities.

That fits very well to the rest.

I, for one, am all for teaching people instead of protecting them from themselves ...
... and I have faith that a shift away from telling people to tank ...
... towards telling people to be combat ready ...
... is actually a good thing.


Anyone making a thread in F&I that goes towards more self responsiblity for miners has my vote.

(hint hint)

Well you know jack about mining and ganking, it really shows.

Big difference between teaching and permanently feeding people to the wolves.

What the hell are you talking about, you can't even get player names correct.

Nope, he can have what he wants as long as CCP work on that with the coveter and hulk, they are the fleet mining ships and that is fine. I keep saying it and baltec1 keeps going on about the base ehp of the Skiff.

Go and read what CCP did when they balanced these ships. And then see how people use them. And its not friendly advice, its totally incorrect condescending advice from someone who has no clue.

Nope, I will not agree with that statement, so far its just getting them on SISI, the real changes have not yet been detailed and if you think any of these changes so far shown are hurtful in anyway I have to question your knowledge further. They are incomplete and not the final ones, but having two strip miner slots on all ships is great, adding a low to the hulk is great and increasing the yeidl on mining lasars is also great, so it gets rid of that stupid 150% bonus on a single mining laser.

The twin mining lasers on the Skiff is something I like.

So far I like what I see, but anyone who has been in this game knows that the initial pass on SIS normally means nothing and is subject to change. So stop giving advice and making grandiose statements showing a lack of basic knowledge and that is friendly advice.

It does when you can beat them. If fleeting up is too risky for you then don't. Fit a solo skiff, or fit up a tanked hulk with warp core stabs. There key thing is that there is a lot of options under my plan that you simply do not have with what is on sisi. And your very specific issue doesn't exist outside of highsec.

Such a little drama queen sol, don't agree with the strongest rational pragmatic proposal, by one of the most experienced in this field - Dracvlad.

Typical play the troll card again. Do you use the card on your mum upstairs.

From the catastrophic point before the previous balance pass this current setup was a huge success, it gave people options to get in a ship with a meaningful tank and yet it also enabled people to make choices on yield and on ease of use and on mining bonuses. Yeah it is not perfect, but its very much on the right track.

CODE and their flunkies seem to be active and killing people who fit for yield in the lessor tanked ships and even those in the higher tanked ships who have fitted for yield, while people who want a tank to be hard to kill can do that.

I went from refusing to mine because all of the ships had the tank of a wet paper bag to being able to get in a ship that enabled me to be hard to kill and that is a huge success.

In ice systems CODE have been successful so that people are tending to use Skiffs and Procurers, but it was amazing to watch the lazy entitled CODE players go on about everyone using Skiffs and Procurers in the systems that they kept ganking people and yet where I mine where CODE fear to tread I see Hulks, Macs Retreivers and most amazingly of all a coveter, but that was a Goon, much to my amusement.

So CCP are on the right track, as I keep pointing out they have to have a ship that can take the Kusions plus three dual boxers in terms of a tank. The Skiff as it is does that with a tank fitted to it, not the max tank but not far off it.

Your suggestions for 0.0 mining are interesting, however the coveter and hulk need to be adjusted better for that and they need a lot of work. You just have a boner in terms of the skiffs base EHP, it offends you and it colours your whole thinking. There will be people in hisec who will do what you suggested, but the solo players that want to be hard to kill deserve to have the Skiff, period.

Try reading the rest of it.

Batlec1, one issue I've not seen you address in your proposal is the problem that, if you give Barges and Exhumers more fitting options in return for lowered base stats, and *if* you allow (and I'm not sure you would) them to reach the same levels of tankiness the Procurer and Skiff do now through modules, these modules now become lootable. That would add to the profitability of suicide ganks and giving gankers even more incentive to go after vessels that through the very nature of their usage (having to sit still for hours on end) can never hope to enter fair combat against similarly-valued opponents.

Unless, of course, that is your hidden agenda: get the primary gank-proof barge and exhumer nerfed, and increase ganker payouts...

It's the same problem with faction mining modules: even if I were willing to risk several hundred million isk worth of modules to my exhumer, I would only be providing the next ganker a rich buffet in my wreck, attracting them like bears to honey. And thus those modules go entirely unused.

While I'm out and about faction mining modules: why are ORE Ice Harvesters longer-ranged versions of T2 Ice Harvesters, but ORE Stripminers only longer-ranged versions of T1 Stripminers?