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FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#1721 - 2016-04-15 14:14:09 UTC
Honestly, folks, the only way to have a chance of having CCP listen is to complain about this publicly. On Facebook, on Twitter, at Fanfest, etc.

Up until this idea was posted, I was honestly having as much fun as I have ever had in Eve. We're in the middle of an epic war, with literally thousands of players on each side doing everything they can to win, and CCP has to plant the seeds to make me hate this game.

I've thought about Eve every day for over nine years. I've played every day that I could possibly get to a computer. Eve is not just a game. It is a social experiment. Well, daily chores don't have a place in a social experiment. You log in to be part of the experiment. Not to get some ******* cake, because you pressed a ******* button.

Quote:
It’s very important to note here that this means all the skillpoints available to buy on the market in EVE will have originated on other characters where they were trained at the normal rate.


I am really glad I am not going to Fanfest. The more I think about this, the more enraged I am.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Shakira Akira
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1722 - 2016-04-15 14:23:09 UTC
Erihn Sabrovich wrote:


CCP has to care about ALL OF ITS CUSTOMERS, not only about the older one... They look at stats and comments from ALL players and ponder the whole thing.


They could have ended with decaying SP (after X time without connexion, you'd start to lose SP) but they didn't... They were even going to give the same amount of SP to every players and not a decreasing return like you can see with injectors.



Except if you look at the trend in the video game industry, you will notice that games are leaning towards the instant gratification vice long term planning and forethought.. THE VERY REASON that the game EvE managed to survive because people that didn't want to play the kiddy games came to play here instead, where your actions really mattered.
Andrew Coperian
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1723 - 2016-04-15 14:29:21 UTC
TheInternet TweepsOnline TheInternet wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
If you look at Citadel feature list you should not have any concerns about our commitment to the EVE sandbox and the hardcore nature of our game.


Right, because magically teleporting everyone's stuff to the nearest lowsec station every time a citadel dies is SUPER HARDCORE, CCP Rise. Pirate Who could possibly have doubts?


YES!!!!! My thoughts exactly. Ridiculous...
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#1724 - 2016-04-15 14:32:42 UTC
they dont have to care too much about older players as they are the easier players to keep, its newer players they need to keep who dont have anything to lose if they quit the game, tbh im at a stage where ive invested too much time and money into the game to just quit, its something i would really need to think twice about. if i was a 2 month old player then id just unsub and move onto the next game.

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#1725 - 2016-04-15 14:34:07 UTC
Shakira Akira wrote:
Erihn Sabrovich wrote:


CCP has to care about ALL OF ITS CUSTOMERS, not only about the older one... They look at stats and comments from ALL players and ponder the whole thing.


They could have ended with decaying SP (after X time without connexion, you'd start to lose SP) but they didn't... They were even going to give the same amount of SP to every players and not a decreasing return like you can see with injectors.



Except if you look at the trend in the video game industry, you will notice that games are leaning towards the instant gratification vice long term planning and forethought.. THE VERY REASON that the game EvE managed to survive because people that didn't want to play the kiddy games came to play here instead, where your actions really mattered.



With some of the temper tantrums in this thread some of them should go back to kids games.

How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#1726 - 2016-04-15 14:37:38 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
Shakira Akira wrote:
Erihn Sabrovich wrote:


CCP has to care about ALL OF ITS CUSTOMERS, not only about the older one... They look at stats and comments from ALL players and ponder the whole thing.


They could have ended with decaying SP (after X time without connexion, you'd start to lose SP) but they didn't... They were even going to give the same amount of SP to every players and not a decreasing return like you can see with injectors.



Except if you look at the trend in the video game industry, you will notice that games are leaning towards the instant gratification vice long term planning and forethought.. THE VERY REASON that the game EvE managed to survive because people that didn't want to play the kiddy games came to play here instead, where your actions really mattered.



With some of the temper tantrums in this thread some of them should go back to kids games.

How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.


CCP loves forum pvp and and they are loving the tears, pretty simple

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Tisiphone Dira
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1727 - 2016-04-15 15:14:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Tisiphone Dira
if I wanted to grind sp, I'd grind isk to buy injectors.

And this 'go kill a belt rat' think is completely the wrong way to go about doing something that's already inherently awful

If you MUST have a daily requirement for sp, have it be 'go agress another player in some way' which is a MUCH better way of doing this, it would get people engaging with one-other, even if it's only to game the system (lol rookie ship duels), that is then also ripe for 'shenanigans and tomfoolery'. WIN-WIN-WIN. CCP gets its desired daily log-ins for (reward), it makes the players (those without alts at least) engage with one another somehow, and it has a distinctly eve-flavoured twist to it compared to WoW.

There once was a ganker named tisi

A stunningly beautiful missy

To gank a gross miner

There is nothing finer, cept when they get all pissy
Khan Wrenth
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1728 - 2016-04-15 15:24:02 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.

The Devs are the living embodiment of "HTFU". They fly around in frigates with 100% resists because they earned it. Really. You can Phased Plasma L, but you can't phase a Dev. They're super chill, very friendly, and very forgiving of the dumb things people sometimes say under the cloak of the internet.

Besides, in this power dynamic, they are essentially the Dr. Manhattan to our being basically everyone else in that movie. Do you get upset at ants that may or may not swarm at your feet or occasionally crawl onto your shoe?

Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1729 - 2016-04-15 15:27:22 UTC
Khan Wrenth wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:
How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.

The Devs are the living embodiment of "HTFU". They fly around in frigates with 100% resists because they earned it. Really. You can Phased Plasma L, but you can't phase a Dev. They're super chill, very friendly, and very forgiving of the dumb things people sometimes say under the cloak of the internet.

Besides, in this power dynamic, they are essentially the Dr. Manhattan to our being basically everyone else in that movie. Do you get upset at ants that may or may not swarm at your feet or occasionally crawl onto your shoe?


It would be so hilarious of for just one day, the player really had to live by the HTFU rule on the forum. This thread would be down to like 19 post if that.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1730 - 2016-04-15 15:33:40 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
they dont have to care too much about older players as they are the easier players to keep, its newer players they need to keep who dont have anything to lose if they quit the game, tbh im at a stage where ive invested too much time and money into the game to just quit, its something i would really need to think twice about. if i was a 2 month old player then id just unsub and move onto the next game.


This is something people forget about often. The time you already invested in a game act as an anchor against your departure. This can been seen for example in the long line of fantasy MMO that labeled themselves as wowkillers who presented nearly the same product with some better points. The playerbase is not as mobile as some people think it is. A lot of people would not even be able to "pack up and leave" which is why the un-sub threat don't matter as much as they could because in at least a large amount of case, the player never quit or come back later because he feel bad for abandoning X years of his gaming life.
Arline Kley
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#1731 - 2016-04-15 16:29:50 UTC
So.. daily missions. Yet another nail in the difficultly coffin that EVE has been undergoing for the last few years, some of it much needed, others a little more troubling.

EVE is a rarity in the gaming world - you permanently lose something when it goes boom. That doesn't happen a lot in other MMO's; you might lose time, but time is what you are already sinking into the game so you've not really lost anything as you still have everything you had when you died.

Adding in daily missions where SP is giving out is a dangerous idea. Bonus ISK / Faction standings? I can live with. Not SP. You've historically tried to limit people creating massive amounts of alts merely for afk scouting/cyno purposes, which is a good thing - however this is now just another opening to get people to create them again.

And what about us older players? The ones that had to toil hard for our skill points (I will openly admit I was part of the 900k SP era) over time, when we actually lost skill points and had to regain them? Do we get a nice big lump sump of SP to all those days that we missed out on this potential SP source?

Of course we won't - that wouldn't be fair to the new guys would it.

I'm a little.. tired.. of CCP treating new players with fluffiness. Its not becoming of the game that I, and many others, have come to expect. It would be better that they experience the cold and harsh galaxy that we have had to endure, rather than having things which are supposed to be a long term goal spoon-fed to them.

Please - for the love of the Amarrian God, don't implement this feature within the game as is. It is inheriently wrong to hand out SP's for literally nothing.

"For it was said they had become like those peculiar demons, which dwell in matter but in whom no light may be found." - Father Grigori, Ravens 3:57
Igniskhin
Fortis Fortuna Adiuvatt
#1732 - 2016-04-15 16:40:18 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Igniskhin wrote:

reward them for getting into PVP in a .4 system
mine out a roid rock
build a frigate
get on a kill mail with 200 other player
ship spin 400 times
complete a 60 jump trip with 20K m3 cargo
get blown up by NPC sentry turrets (come on, you know you've had it happen to you as well)
kill (or lose) 3 ships in pvp in 24 hours
bump a freighter for 5 minutes
ninja loot something with out getting destroyed
get the pod, get the pod!



So out fo your list, I got

Kill your alt in .4
Mine even if you don't want to so it's as stupid as the rat
Build a frigate which is also just as stupid as the rat if you are not an indy guy. Hell even for them it might be a pain if they have no free production slots.
Those killmails rarer than you probably imagine (this character you post on never gopt on one)
AFK play really need to be rewarded?
jumping abck and forth the same gate in a pair of system at the ass-end of the galaxy is really much more interesting than killing a rat.
Let's sacrifice a rookie ship because why not?
Let em kill my alt 2 more time after the first one time for the first point
Can't trigger this as CCP's code does not know who is bumping and who is getting bumped.
Imma ninja loot from my alt
Imma pod my alt.

Holy **** man that was soooooooooo much better than the stupid rat idea. I really think you should post more of those idea.



CCP knows full well that we as players like to fist **** their game in ways we weren't meant to. here just one story from around the same time you created that character http://www.engadget.com/2012/06/22/eve-players-abuse-faction-warfare-to-produce-trillions-of-isk/

or this one from around the time i started playing http://www.engadget.com/2008/12/11/rumored-four-year-multi-trillion-isk-exploit-in-eve-online/

and many, many, many more...

I dont care for dailies, on that we agree, but if CCP is going to force feed us content they might as well try and encourage players to do something they haven't done before.

lastly, I only have 2 counter points to your list.

1. I know how rare 200+ kill mails are, but why are we going to make things simple (i also meant 20, not 200 but i know that means you have 21 players or 1 ice belt farmer with 21 accounts to shoot an alt)

2. I dont know if you've noticed or not, but ship spinning in station has an actual counter now that appears bottom center and counts the amount of times you actively spin the camera around the ship so its not an AFK activity. CCP implemented some time around the "show them the door" incarna fiasco
Fish Slapper
Land of Confusion
#1733 - 2016-04-15 17:03:36 UTC
How about some random mechanism of bonus skillpoints for things players already do, not just some specified daily task. E.g., explorers opening a can sometimes get "you have just been awarded xxx skillpoints", or miners mining, or pvp activity, or anything. That way people can play the game the way they want and have an incentive to play more.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1734 - 2016-04-15 17:10:20 UTC
Fish Slapper wrote:
How about some random mechanism of bonus skillpoints for things players already do, not just some specified daily task. E.g., explorers opening a can sometimes get "you have just been awarded xxx skillpoints", or miners mining, or pvp activity, or anything. That way people can play the game the way they want and have an incentive to play more.


If it's random and not locked like a daily, it will not generate more log-ins which is their stated goal and will also be farmable by just doing the activity over and over again.
Axhind
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
#1735 - 2016-04-15 17:34:35 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Khan Wrenth wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:
How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.

The Devs are the living embodiment of "HTFU". They fly around in frigates with 100% resists because they earned it. Really. You can Phased Plasma L, but you can't phase a Dev. They're super chill, very friendly, and very forgiving of the dumb things people sometimes say under the cloak of the internet.

Besides, in this power dynamic, they are essentially the Dr. Manhattan to our being basically everyone else in that movie. Do you get upset at ants that may or may not swarm at your feet or occasionally crawl onto your shoe?


It would be so hilarious of for just one day, the player really had to live by the HTFU rule on the forum. This thread would be down to like 19 post if that.


Ah yes. The feedback would so much more valuable if everyone was pathetic and had a psychological need to suck up to the devs. That would be super useful. Just like dreddit.

Idea with feedback is to see opposing views. Of course, part of the idea is to also consider them but I guess that's too much to ask from today's CCP that seems to operate along the lines of "players should be happy we let them pay and if they complain it only means they are playing our game the wrong way".

I would here by like to thank CCP for being so incredible nice and taking my money every month as there are clearly no others on the planet that would like to have it.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1736 - 2016-04-15 18:42:23 UTC
Tisiphone Dira wrote:
if I wanted to grind sp, I'd grind isk to buy injectors.

And this 'go kill a belt rat' think is completely the wrong way to go about doing something that's already inherently awful

If you MUST have a daily requirement for sp, have it be 'go agress another player in some way' which is a MUCH better way of doing this, it would get people engaging with one-other, even if it's only to game the system (lol rookie ship duels), that is then also ripe for 'shenanigans and tomfoolery'. WIN-WIN-WIN. CCP gets its desired daily log-ins for (reward), it makes the players (those without alts at least) engage with one another somehow, and it has a distinctly eve-flavoured twist to it compared to WoW.


so if they must do it it needs to fit into how you already find enjoyment in eve


thats no better

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Shallanna Yassavi
qwertz corp
#1737 - 2016-04-15 19:10:05 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
Honestly, folks, the only way to have a chance of having CCP listen is to complain about this publicly. On Facebook, on Twitter, at Fanfest, etc.

Up until this idea was posted, I was honestly having as much fun as I have ever had in Eve. We're in the middle of an epic war, with literally thousands of players on each side doing everything they can to win, and CCP has to plant the seeds to make me hate this game.

I've thought about Eve every day for over nine years. I've played every day that I could possibly get to a computer. Eve is not just a game. It is a social experiment. Well, daily chores don't have a place in a social experiment. You log in to be part of the experiment. Not to get some ******* cake, because you pressed a ******* button.

Quote:
It’s very important to note here that this means all the skillpoints available to buy on the market in EVE will have originated on other characters where they were trained at the normal rate.


I am really glad I am not going to Fanfest. The more I think about this, the more enraged I am.

You could always come as zombies. Crumble up some chips and cheetohs all over your clothes, spill a couple of drinks on them, constantly moan something about "Just... one... more... Daily."

A signature :o
Terranid Meester
Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
#1738 - 2016-04-15 19:15:28 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:

How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.


I don't know about you but we are not going back to the USSR.

The devs who have planned this deserve every bit of bile directed at them for this abomination.
I hope people at fanfest will tell them exactly what they think of dailies. If its announced on stage I hope it
is accompanied by a large dose of booing.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#1739 - 2016-04-15 20:25:36 UTC
Terranid Meester wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

How some haven't got at the least a lengthy forum ban is beyond me after the abuse they are giving out towards the devs.


I don't know about you but we are not going back to the USSR.

The devs who have planned this deserve every bit of bile directed at them for this abomination.
I hope people at fanfest will tell them exactly what they think of dailies. If its announced on stage I hope it
is accompanied by a large dose of booing.


also to be fair when you look at the threads like NPC tax change or the fatigue change this one has been pretty civil.

now sad thing is it's do to people accepting that no matter what this is going to be put in followed by more and more. rather than being mad they are defeated with pleas to ccp rather than rants.

(sure there have been some but not as many)

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#1740 - 2016-04-15 21:04:38 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
CCP Rise wrote:
We are taking your feedback seriously and if we don't make any changes before release we will absolutely be following up shortly after release with changes based on feedback and behavior.


Mate, are you out of your bloody mind? This is garbage reasoning, you know very well that people will start participating in the opportunity once it gets released because not doing so is too punishing, yet you're going to take that as a metric of the feature being successful?


Congratulations, your application for the role of Senior Brand Development Manager has been successful.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016