EVE Information Portal

lol at the people assuming the low aurum price on extracts will make it cheap to use injectors ignoring the fact almost no one is gonna give away 500 k SP for free they are gonna milk every isk/sp they can in selling the injectors on the open market + the cost of aurum for the extractor. and weather your getting the full 500 k or only 150 k from an injector your still paying for 500 k worth of SP meaning buying a characater on the bazaar is much cheaper if you want more then the 5 mill sp u will get from injects before they become less effective.

tbh this over all isnt gonna be worth much seeing as extraction from what im seeing is gonna leave the skills in your head at 0 that basically removes all interest i had in it lol woulda been nice to delete a few skills but not if they gonna sit at 0 looking like **** :P

also why are the 2 planetary interaction skill except from extraction? those are prolly 2 of the most desirable skills to get rid of lol 0_o

Interesting, how everyone was complaining/crying/ragequitting because this feature would be abused en masse. Now everyone is complaining because the feature will be too expensive to be used en masse. Lol.

Anyway, let's look at some figures, shall we?

We want to calculate the minimum and maximum sustainable range of the price of injectors in terms of the price of PLEX.
(= In the long run, how many injectors does one PLEX buy?)

I assume a moderate gain of 1.8 mil SP per month game time,
and I assume that extractors are bought at discount, 4.3 extractors per PLEX.

The maximum price of injectors is given by skillpoint farming.

If you farm SP, you can sell (1.8 mio SP / month) / (0.5 mio SP / injector) = 3.6 injectors per month.
Thus you have to break 3.6 / 4.3 = 0.84 PLEX into AUR into extractors, and you have to finance 1 day of training time.
So you spend 1.84 PLEX to create 3.6 injectors.

This puts the maximum sustainable price of an injector at about half the price of a PLEX.

If the market price for injectors were short term higher than this threshold, SP farming became viable, and an infinite supply of injectors would be created, keeping the market price below this threshold in the long term.

A reasonable minimum price of injectors is given by free disposal of unwanted skillpoints.

Let's assume people are willing to rip out unwanted skillpoints "for free", but they are not willing to pay premium for the privilege of mutilating their chars. This is a sound assumption at least after an initial release of unwanted skillpoints for cosmetic reasons by the OCD crowd (myself, included).

Then by a similar calculation as above, you still need 0.84 PLEX to create 3.6 injectors, but you don't need that one additional PLEX to finance training time, because you are using up your existing skillpoints.

This puts the minimum sustainable price of an injector at about a quarter of the price of a PLEX.

Arguably, the market price, in the absence of any demand, could go as low as zero, but this is not a likely scenario. People are valuating SP a lot, given the price of a MPTC in comparison to PLEX prices. We might see a dip from mass character sheet clean ups on day one, but that's a one off effect.

So in the long term, the market price of an injector will be between 1/4 and 1/2 of the price of a PLEX.

So much for supply. Now let's look at the demand, the buyers' side.

In the best case (lowest price possible, new player with <5 Mio SP) you get four injectors worth 2 mio SP for the price of one PLEX. This PLEX would have netted you 1.8 mio SP and one month of playtime.

Seems like a 'fair' deal for a newer casual player. It's not great, and one would probably be better off buying a PLEX and activating for game time and training, but it's not a rip off, either. I think CCP nailed this price point.

In the worst case (highest price possible, high SP player) you get two injectors worth 0.3 mio SP for the price of one PLEX. You'll get less than 20% of the SP you would have gained from training, and you also don't get one month of playtime. Bad deal? Probably. A few space rich will still make their dream char, but it will most likely not be a game breaking mass phenomenon.

As for myself, I will probably use my 2.000 complementary AUR I once got to buy two extractors, clean up my character sheet and dump the injectors to whatever the market price is on day one. Then never touch this feature again.

I hear what you are saying but being able to redistribute SP, even just on your own char, at no % loss would destroy the SP system and the need for different skill areas, in terms of race specific skill sets.

Example: You fly a dread to your alliances skill and fitting requirements. Next week they change the dread flavour to another race. In your statement above the player could, at the price of paying CCP for extractors, redisrtibute the SP to another races Dread with no penalty. This mechanic would never be viable in anyway shape or form and would be abused until it hurts no more.

Also, and i have stated this many times, part of the beauty of Eve is your char sheet. Its a history of the gaming decisions you have made through the years. Now there will be the ability to manipulate this. For me this devalues your training decisions to almost nothing simply because all these decisions can be re-written simply by getting your credit card out. (Yes i accept it may not be the best financial decision but the fact is it now is possible..and there lies the problem).

YAY! It's lower than the price i was hoping for. THANKS CCP! Already converted 5 PLEX to 17,500 AUR, just waiting for the patch to hit now.

I think the reason is more related to existing assets that are skill related (implants, PI, clones).

If you look at social skills - I would not call it an exploit to remove them once you have reached your desired (unmodified) standings.

Did not investigate deeper into Corporation management skills - I think extracting Anchoring after setting up a POS is something they will just not look into as it has only marginal effects. The other corporation management skills are interesting of course - what happens if you extract Empire Control and never update your corp?

You are aware that the cheapest subscription plan is to pre-pay for 1 year, at $10 / month, $131.40 (with tax), and that gets you 20 million skillpoints trained the normal way? Most people use the monthly subscription and that's $225 for 20 million SP? So 15 million SP for $100 is what we already pay, just all at once, which I guess is a shock.

You are aware that on the Character Bazaar, a 15 million SP toon will go for 7-8B, which is 6 PLEX = $120?

So how did you expect them to price this new feature? So cheaply that it invalidates the slow training in-game AND the character bazaar?

5 pages back, there's 4-5 people who predicted the price "first", and it's because 1000 Aur is the most common sense prediction. It was the best guess as soon as they announced they were going to do this.

Best part is that the injectors don't cost AUR, just ISK, so the vets with 50-100 TRILLION in their wallets can afford skillpoints easily. As can all the players who currently play "for free", grinding ISK per month to pay for their sub costs. Now just a bit more grinding = accelerated training.

This feature makes it possible to grind harder to advance faster, which, while it may not be a desirable thing to have, is how all the other MMO's operate. You play non-stop and without sleep for a full weekend, you can get a max level character in Diablo3, WoW, SWTOR, etc.

EVE is the only one that blocks you from wasting your time like that... well, no more.

depends on the remap and focus if you stick to a perfect remap with +5's thats 2700 sp per hour which ads up to 23,652,000 of course if lower implants are used or u stray off your remap focus it can be as low as 15 mill for the year.

as for a 15 mill sp char on bazaar it will depend on the focus and what is in demand i seen some go for 15-20 bill cause of focus/good name and standings and some barely break eve cause of poor focus. injectors will prolly even have traders abuse them on the market unless ccp makes a rule against it. since sp you can do as u like with will be of high value. injectors may end up costing more on the market then a char of twice the sp with good focus on bazaar in the end of course only time will tell but its a high likely hood.


@ dibz just being able to 100% move sp to extra chars on same act would be broken and abused by character farmers they would buy crapy cheap chars after trolling the sell its worthless then move the sp to a new char sell for epic profit and repeat so ya that would not work out at all.

If that twitter pic is for real, then like someone else wrote earlier in this thread:

Are you stupidly greedy or greedily stupid ?

1k aur for a single extractor ? Did you fall on your head in the morning ? Didn't the meaning behind the word "micro" register ? Did you hire some marketing "guru" from Gameforge or so ?

That's not even mentioning non-aligining price with aur, which on its own is a primitive trick.

Oh well.

I still can't believe that CCP is doing this. All the promises after the summer of rage, to never sell anyting for AUR that gives a direct advantage over other players, were emtpy talk. CCP makes the game less hardcore every year.

Also, what about all the talk about careful balancing and previsional planning of features .. Has CCP not thought about all the ways skill trading can be abused by rich players/alliances? They can now:

• easily switch doctrines
• instantly replace SP losses from T3s
• lure new players with injectors
• hoard injectors as "gold" item
• instantly use the newest overpowered toys/doctrines (i.e. Ishtar fleets before nerf)
• etc

I liked most of the changes CCP made in the last years but the skill trading feature ... WTF CCP. Could it be that there was a recent change in leadership? Some new producers or managers from EA maybe? Because skill trading looks like a typical EA cash grab.

Oh the irony.

Well, from a supporter's perspective it's kind of sad to see this primitive pricing (both by scale and alignment) they decided for - and automatically explains why they waited up to the almost the last day with actual costs announcement.