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Decline in numbers... starting to turn into RAPID!!!

First post
Author
Jill Xelitras
Xeltec services
#4121 - 2016-01-19 19:19:01 UTC
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:

2.(snip) Make regions of space that we can truly explore on our own for fun and via agents.


Are you calling for instances ? Thou shall burn, heretic.



Don't anger the forum gods.

ISD Buldath:

> I Saw, I came, I Frowned, I locked, I posted, and I left.

Admiral Bill Adama
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4122 - 2016-01-19 19:22:07 UTC
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:

2.(snip) Make regions of space that we can truly explore on our own for fun and via agents.


Are you calling for instances ? Thou shall burn, heretic.





lol I'm not i promise don't burn me : (

All I'm saying is this company has a lot of opportunities and an endless amount of content they can provide if they chose to, what I think we need was partially listed above but those are just my opinions and I would really just be happy if we got some thing new haha.

Do you have any suggestions?!
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#4123 - 2016-01-19 19:54:15 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
We provided it, barge kills, the list I gave you showing the mechanics that have changed that reduced the number of targets and made ganking harder, the age of M0o when CCP flet the need to step in, the fact that mining interdictions don't happen anymore, the fact that hulkageddon doesn't happen any more. But naturally you don't want these you want other things that are are not posted yet.
Except as stated before there's 2 main issues there. 1, barges don't constitute the entirety of ganking, and 2, the 08 stats included all ships lost, even to NPCs. All the interdictions and hulkageddon not happening anymore suggests is that gankers shoot different targets. Beign that burn amarr and burn war akkini were bigger than any of the interdictions, it suggest ganking has grown.

baltec1 wrote:
But you just pointed out what I was saying, CCP flet the need to step in back then and not at any point in the last few years. That alone shows it was more dangerous.
Ah, I see, then you misunderstand. What I mean by that is that CCPs stance has changed since then. Back then they were a growing company and more risk averse, but since then they've done things like HTFU, and are less likely to get involved.

baltec1 wrote:
Funded by one guy. Remember the corp you are talking to here.
I know who I'm talking to, so you should know full well how much was made through ganking. Like I said before, burn war akini alone produced 85b in picked up loot.

baltec1 wrote:
I never said it was all down to a lack of ganking. Removal of jetcan shenanigans, stagnation of null, ship imbalances, PvE imbalances, ganking nerfs. All of it has resulted in a much less active game.
So you're saying there's a whole bunch of people that can't handle changes to the game and ragequit, not just gankers?

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Scipio Artelius
Weaponised Vegemite
Flying Dangerous
#4124 - 2016-01-19 20:50:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:

2.(snip) Make regions of space that we can truly explore on our own for fun and via agents.


Are you calling for instances ? Thou shall burn, heretic.





lol I'm not i promise don't burn me : (

All I'm saying is this company has a lot of opportunities and an endless amount of content they can provide if they chose to, what I think we need was partially listed above but those are just my opinions and I would really just be happy if we got some thing new haha.

Do you have any suggestions?!

There are new parts of space coming, with new mechanics, so like you suggest - different from the current high, low, null and WH space. That's all part of the plan with us being able to build stargates.

That should hopefully happen maybe late this year or early next and will finalise what we currently know about the development roadmap.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#4125 - 2016-01-19 21:21:41 UTC
I only check in every so often to add a few notches to my 'how many times two people can have the exact same arguement' tally. Seriously you could condense the last 150 odd pages into about three sentences, two of which are 'no it isnt' and 'yes it is'

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome

Admiral Bill Adama
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4126 - 2016-01-19 21:34:35 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:
Jill Xelitras wrote:
Admiral Bill Adama wrote:

2.(snip) Make regions of space that we can truly explore on our own for fun and via agents.


Are you calling for instances ? Thou shall burn, heretic.





lol I'm not i promise don't burn me : (

All I'm saying is this company has a lot of opportunities and an endless amount of content they can provide if they chose to, what I think we need was partially listed above but those are just my opinions and I would really just be happy if we got some thing new haha.

Do you have any suggestions?!

There are new parts of space coming, with new mechanics, so like you suggest - different from the current high, low, null and WH space. That's all part of the plan with us being able to build stargates.

That should hopefully happen maybe late this year or early next and will finalise what we currently know about the development roadmap.


yay!
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#4127 - 2016-01-20 00:35:14 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
We wiped out 600 miners in less than 2 weeks and shut down all caldari ice mining in high sec space for a month with just our corp back in 2012. Not only did we kill miners by the hundreds we hyper inflated then collapsed the ice market causing hundreds more to lose billions. You cant do that any more.
First off, this is not evidence, it's an anecdote.

Secondly, are you saying that in the recent Burn Amarr didn't do better? Over 200 freighters in a couple of days.

And hey, Tippia, I thought you were on the side of demanding evidence. baltec has made a claim and now needs to back it up with actual evidence, is that not right?


Well the Ice mining thing definitely jiggered with ice and ice product prices


Exhumers BPCs too. I made double digit billions in relatively little time thanks to gank campaigns.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#4128 - 2016-01-20 00:37:58 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
We wiped out 600 miners in less than 2 weeks and shut down all caldari ice mining in high sec space for a month with just our corp back in 2012. Not only did we kill miners by the hundreds we hyper inflated then collapsed the ice market causing hundreds more to lose billions. You cant do that any more.
First off, this is not evidence, it's an anecdote.

Secondly, are you saying that in the recent Burn Amarr didn't do better? Over 200 freighters in a couple of days.

And hey, Tippia, I thought you were on the side of demanding evidence. baltec has made a claim and now needs to back it up with actual evidence, is that not right?


Well the Ice mining thing definitely jiggered with ice and ice product prices


Not to mention the flood of "save us CCP" threads by miners who just couldn't grasp the fact that their own refusal to fit a tank was the only problem. It was a golden age for threadnoughts.


They were partly right, I still recall your totally ridicolous fits you posted, whereas a guy would have had to train forever and spend a lot and end up with a complete garbage fittings that would make him ineffective.

In fact, the end result was CCP (over) buffed them.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#4129 - 2016-01-20 00:45:51 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
It's funny though, because baltec is still dodging the call to prove ganking is less common now than in previous years.

Oh and Tippia, shh.

Malcanis wrote:
Those are just facts, thought. They're nothing to do with the Truth.
By the way, just so it's clear, while I don't agree with the guy that uedama is going to have more losses than null ratters of an entire region (not without a good look at the stats, anyway), he did say "Take an average Saturday", while baltec chose the one saturday when a multiboxing ratter lost 24 carriers in Deklein.



You should NEVER try to argue or even to reply to Tippia.

He's so incredibly trained at sophism, you will NEVER win an argument against him. NEVER.
The fact you are right or wrong is completely irrelevant, you shall lose or be out-flanked by his circle of forum buddies (Baltec being one of them) sharing common goals. In any case, each of them have more time on their hands than 10 of you so you won't even outlast them.

Just ignore them like everyone else (who is not ready to deal with the consequence of dealing with them).
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#4130 - 2016-01-20 01:04:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Alex Drakonov wrote:
Rework HS pvp mechanics, suicide ganks on miners and silly war decs hurt new players without adding any fun for both parties.

Oh and those fitting skills... almost as bad as the old learning skills


Or just remove this silly "sec" concept, other games don't come with this utter crap yet newbies do just fine.

I posted years and years ago a thread detailing how to create scaling "sec", of course it's been ignored and of course 13 years in the game we still are talking about this artificial thing that totally makes EvE uneven.

"Hi sec" exists only because CCP is unable to create mechanics that let people do certain activities without getting killed too often to be worth doing them, unless they join a PvP corp. The "forced guild" concept was GREAT back 10 years ago, these days imo it's a relic. People grew up, playerbase changed, witness the era of the "casual" player.

I totally enjoyed doing mining, freighter convoys and L4 missions in low and null sec with my PvP corp. But years pass, people stop playing, corps die and one day you discover your life got too many responsibilities to still dedicate enough time to entice other players to "cover your ass".

In fact, whereas I agree with some Baltec points about EvE getting more boring etc. etc., imo (as I said since many pages) EvE is suffering from the simple fact that it's more or less "staying EvE" (a VERY good thing for some!) whereas its playerbase is slowly changing and so are their tastes and needs.
One day CCP will have to choose whether to keep the older, fossilized players and not get new blood, or to embrace the new ones and lose the old ones.
It's a lose-lose situation, caused by CCP itself, who lost their golden chance to be the best sci-fi game in every aspect because they chose to lose years in failed pet projects, expecially investing man decades into a proprietary 3D engine whereas everybody else use the excellent existing engines.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#4131 - 2016-01-20 06:48:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
Isnt this a very mature market? Where are these new players you talk about? What do they like to do? Stabbing others with their magical +5 daggers? EvE does not have stabbing unfortunately, and magical +5 daggers.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4132 - 2016-01-20 07:02:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
...of course it's been ignored and of course...


Of course it has. That's what you do with bad ideas, you ignore them.

Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
People grew up, playerbase changed, witness the era of the "casual" player.


The idea that a 'casual' player is a 'grown up' player is hilarious. No, the gamers of today are used to dumbed-down content fed to them on a silver spoon. If EVE ever caters to that, it won't be EVE anymore. This isn't the era of the casual player, it's the era of the entitled one, with unrealistic expectations of what they think they deserve because that's what other developers are giving them. It's done more damage to gaming than anything, including conspiracies of gamers being influenced by violence and shite like that.

Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
One day CCP will have to choose whether to keep the older, fossilized players and not get new blood, or to embrace the new ones and lose the old ones.


No they won't, because despite a large portion of the gaming community being entitled whiners, there are still plenty of them that are getting into gaming and discovering the uniqueness of EVE, and adapting to what it is, and not what they expect. I know because I meet new people to the game almost every day. What do you actually do for new people other than use them as a shield for your own self-entitlement?

Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
...expecially investing man decades into a proprietary 3D engine whereas everybody else use the excellent existing engines.


You mean they tried to innovate and came up with exceptional new technology that only failed in its delivery? Isn't this what you want them to do, try new things? Nothing pleases you, ever, which is probably why CCP ignore you.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#4133 - 2016-01-20 08:24:05 UTC  |  Edited by: sero Hita
Remiel Pollard wrote:


Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
...expecially investing man decades into a proprietary 3D engine whereas everybody else use the excellent existing engines.


You mean they tried to innovate and came up with exceptional new technology that only failed in its delivery? Isn't this what you want them to do, try new things? Nothing pleases you, ever, which is probably why CCP ignore you.


Vaerah, you have to admit he kinda has a point here. When they tried to be inovative they got burned. It is too easy saying they just had bad ideas. Usually only the aftermath will show if it was good or bad.

IMO your main problem with EVE seems to be that they did not make one game where you can play in different modes(EVE, Valkyrie and DUSt in one).

I still have a hard time imagining how they could implement the flying style from ED into EVE, with the server ticks of 1 sec.(FPS games has much faster ticks) in a single shard universe (The other games you mention are not single shard, and the limit of players in each instance are lower). I do not think the technology is there to do what you want right now, because no other game has it. If it was implemented in EVE as we know now, that would make some pretty crappy dogfigthing. If this was to be implemented they would have to completely redo EVE.

Hence I think it is unfair you are annoyed with CCP for not risking their whole business, by investing in something they perhaps cannot handle. You know how that went with their other projects. They might get more free hands now, because they are diversifying into other games now, but this was not possible before. Tbh. a slow bleedout of players is prefered to closing the game from one day to another. just because something looks good on paper it does not mean people will like the implemented version.

"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#4134 - 2016-01-20 13:27:42 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


They were partly right, I still recall your totally ridicolous fits you posted, whereas a guy would have had to train forever and spend a lot and end up with a complete garbage fittings that would make him ineffective.

In fact, the end result was CCP (over) buffed them.


Said fittings cost 14 mil at the time and provided enough tank to withstand 2 arty nados.


But yea, CCP messed up the barge rebalance, they needed more fitting room not a HP buff directly to the hull. That balance pass ended barge ganking as a profitable venture and made mining in highsec a much more boring activity.
ISD Fractal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#4135 - 2016-01-20 18:53:04 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Fractal
Quote:
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I have cleansed the last several pages of this thread for violations of the rules listed above. This thread will now be locked for 36 hours to let cooler heads prevail, at which point you may continue to discuss the topic introduced in the OP. If I have to come back to this thread I will increase the length of the lock until a point where I will lock it indefinitely.

Edit: Deleted more posts and those quoting them for discussing other games, a violation of one of the rules above. I've also deleted a post lacking substance. I will continue to delete any new posts that are in violation of any of the forum rules. Either discuss the topic at hand, civilly, or stay out of this thread.

ISD Fractal

Lieutenant

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#4136 - 2016-01-23 06:20:49 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:

People like this amaze me. Somehow the same Goons I've been killing (across multiple games in fact) for the last 7 years are so terrible that they literally make this poster not play a game he pays for. ... And yet those same Goons are so pathetic that this superior human being (that does not play because of them) sees THEM as the 'crybabies'.

The human ego is the most incredible invention in all the universe as far as I'm concerned.


Awwww, isn't that cute. You ASSume I'm paying for this for a training queue.

I cashed in my isk for plex when they were going for 450k. Once in a while I'll sub for a month, log in 3 or 4 times and let it expire again for 3, 4, 12 months. There was one month I subbed and logged in, wondered why I subbed and didn't play at all.

Last plex I'll bio, unless I do it before then.

So no I haven't paid for anything for at least 4 years.
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#4137 - 2016-01-23 06:27:33 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Arsine Mayhem wrote:


Crybabies backed into a corner, surrounded by NIP's, and still cry.


And yet here you are, crying about them, and calling them the reason you 'don't play' despite having to be subscribed to access the forums. Your doublethink is amazing.


Hmm, doublethink, is that hik talk?

I'm not crying, just stating the facts. So much lame in this game. You ASSume I care enough to cry. Poor baby, go dry your tears.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#4138 - 2016-01-23 10:04:44 UTC
We're all secretly very impressed by how much you don't care about a game you spend so much time posting about.

No, really. You're basically the Fonz of EVE.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Indahmawar Fazmarai
#4139 - 2016-01-23 11:22:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
Now that the thread has been suspended, reanimated, cleaned and groomed, let's keep discussing fun stuff with the PCU!

Admittedly I don't have much new to say until the February peak is gone, so I will just drop a question that's been buzzing around my head for a while.

What happened to PCU in June 2015?

Right after May 31, PCU began dropping like a rock, to the point that 2015 was split into "above year's average" till May and "below year's average" starting June till December.

Here's the year snapshot

And a detail on how it began dropping after May 31 (the last higher peak).

So, what happened? My initial guess was that it was related to Aegisov, but that wasn't implemented until July. Then I thought that maybe it was related to the expiry of 6-month subscriptions not being renewed over the input relaying changes, but, seriously? From 39k online to 34k online? Why did those guys keep loggin in?

So here's the thing. So far remains a little mistery... can anyone come up with theories on what happened in June 2015 so PCU lost 5,000 players in 4 weeks?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#4140 - 2016-01-23 11:46:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Now that the thread has been suspended, reanimated, cleaned and groomed, let's keep discussing fun stuff with the PCU!

Admittedly I don't have much new to say until the February peak is gone, so I will just drop a question that's been buzzing around my head for a while.

What happened to PCU in June 2015?

Right after May 31, PCU began dropping like a rock, to the point that 2015 was split into "above year's average" till May and "below year's average" starting June till December.

Here's the year snapshot

And a detail on how it began dropping after May 31 (the last higher peak).

So, what happened? My initial guess was that it was related to Aegisov, but that wasn't implemented until July. Then I thought that maybe it was related to the expiry of 6-month subscriptions not being renewed over the input relaying changes, but, seriously? From 39k online to 34k online? Why did those guys keep loggin in?

So here's the thing. So far remains a little mistery... can anyone come up with theories on what happened in June 2015 so PCU lost 5,000 players in 4 weeks?


Since you'll just ignore or recast anything anyone says to suit your pre-conceptions, why not stop pretending you're interested in our opinions and tell us yours.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016