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Adaptive hardeners?
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Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#21 - 2016-01-03 22:05:24 UTC
Memphis Baas wrote:
Atomic Atty wrote:
My conclusion is that they are still useless.


As they've been trying to say, useless = "absolutely no use whatsoever," and only a Sith deals in absolutes.

So, either wrong forum or there's a use for them somewhere.


I can definitely see PvP use for them on capitals. But in large groups, its generally much more effective to just refit hardeners during the fight in those fleets.

For subcap PvP, its a little sliver of utility at the cost of several disadvantages.

For PvE, you know whats going to be shot at you so it is in all cases a lazy bandaid.
Atomic Atty
Tax Evasion Obviously
#22 - 2016-01-03 22:59:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Atomic Atty
Memphis Baas wrote:
Atomic Atty wrote:
My conclusion is that they are still useless.


As they've been trying to say, useless = "absolutely no use whatsoever," and only a Sith deals in absolutes.

So, either wrong forum or there's a use for them somewhere.

It's bad practice to quote someone without letting them finish their sentence, especially if the rest of the sentence weakens your complaint about it. My use of the word useless is definitely fueled by the dark side though. This module makes me angry, and the word useless if intended to be offensive! Lol
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#23 - 2016-01-04 01:47:17 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:

I can definitely see PvP use for them on capitals. But in large groups, its generally much more effective to just refit hardeners during the fight in those fleets.

For subcap PvP, its a little sliver of utility at the cost of several disadvantages.

For PvE, you know whats going to be shot at you so it is in all cases a lazy bandaid.

1. Some sites you don't know what's going to be shot at you. Some have variety.
2. PvP risk, setting all your resists for PvE is what makes people 'helpless' when they get caught by a PvPer, who is usually set to take advantage of the resist holes that fitting for the standard rats in the area make.
3. Running multiple sites, for example exploration without docking.
4. No combat refitting with a weapons timer soon.
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#24 - 2016-01-04 13:17:54 UTC
Atomic Atty wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
As above though. I wouldn't use it in pvp. It has a pretty major drawback. The module measures the type of damage incoming and how often; it does NOT measure the amount. So if someone drops EM drones on your face, your reactive will crank up the EM because you're getting hit by EM 5 times every 4 seconds. Leaving your explosive open for the 5k volley of explosive from the 1400s.


Is this true? I think I recall something like this being the issue ages ago. Why have they not fixed this? Clearly if you are going to have a module adapt to resist, it should adapt to resist the type doing the highest dps.

Thanks for all of the discussion. My conclusion is that they are still useless, unless you try desperately to build an entire fit around them on just the right ship for a very specific and uninteresting or even unnecessary purpose. This module should just be pruned out. I van see their difficulty with it. If they make it decent, it could violently disrupt the use of every other resist module, and I think that generally resist modules, as they are, are well balanced in terms of slot consumption and combat effect.


Personally I don't mind this being the case because if you notice your opponent is using a RAH, it's a good counter.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
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