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CCP - End Highsec Incursions

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Aquilan Aideron
Wardecs go here
#1541 - 2015-11-28 16:00:49 UTC
Markus Reese wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
[quote=Daniela Doran]but the problem is how badly you null players want them nerfed.

Edit: So what if they are broken. I can't see the harm in one little broken aspect of Eve being this big a problem since it's only run by a very small commute. Even if they are changed the only thing I can see happening is that null alts would find something else to grind isk for other than farming anoms 23/7.


Issue is that it is a negative attribute for new players. It is a closed and disinteresting part of eve gaming and as such, will turn off potential long term subs. In addition, the higher wealth it generates creates a mentality that high value is the norm. I could never afford a T3 doctrine style pvp. If there is SRP, how does the alliance support it? In the end, the higher the wealth, the more exclusive stuff becomes. Eve is a sandbox, there is no new player area. The more exclusive stuff becomes, the more unattainable higher end play is to more entries. That is lost subs.

So, you want EvE to turn into an instant gratification mmo?
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1542 - 2015-11-28 17:16:39 UTC
Daniela Doran wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:
but the problem is how badly you null players want them nerfed.


Are you seriously saying that the truth of their statements doesn't matter, just because of who is saying it?



I only said that because most (if not all) the complaints against hi-sec incursions stems from null sec players. I've been re-reading all the posts in this forums and can clearly see that incursions are broken. But I've yet to read a proper post stating how to fix them without destroying them. And still waiting.........

Edit: So what if they are broken. I can't see the harm in one little broken aspect of Eve being this big a problem since it's only run by a very small commute. Even if they are changed the only thing I can see happening is that null alts would find something else to grind isk for other than farming anoms 23/7.


I don't like your attitude that something you know is broken is ok to leave broken. I heard the EXACT same thing with high sec lvl 5s (CCP acknowledged it was a bug but took 3 years to fix it).

Broken is broken. This broken thing affects people like me because it creates upside down incentives (ie I'm more encouraged to keep an alt in high sec to make safe isk than I am to move that alt to null to help me make isk and defend my ratting space).

And It creates an 'indestructible funnel" of wealth from high sec to null/low sec pilots to use. Income at that level should be attackable without needing a mom popping fleet. Point blank, if you want the kind of isk people get form incursions, you should have to take a risk.

To your credit, and unlike most, at least you did admit they are broken.



I say leave the broken piece alone for now because this broken piece has been instilled into Eve for a long time now. If you remove it forceably then you risk a collapse in unforseen places in Eve. Unless their is a fixed piece already prepared in advance to replace the broken piece, the broken piece should be left alone.

I imagine that Drifter Incursions is this fixed piece CCP is preparing in place of the (broken) Sansha Incursions once the Drifter AI situation has been sorted, just need to be patient.


We've been 'patient' for 6 years.

And "well, people are used to it" was the same excuse people used for high sec lvl 5s. It was really just selfishness on their part, not any love for the game or PVE. There doesn't need to be any kind of replacement for any broken pieces, it needs to be a fix for a broken piece that if it were fixed would tick off MAYBE a couple hundred fat cat privileged entitlement players.

Hell, most of us who actually run incursions would survive a rebalance, it's the fair weather isk hoarder types that would cry.
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1543 - 2015-11-28 17:17:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Markus Reese
Aquilan Aideron wrote:

So, you want EvE to turn into an instant gratification mmo?


Not saying that. I am saying the opposite. That new players should be going into fight and dying lots. Being pawns in the truest sense of the word. A foot-soldier that will die, but a key for properly controlling a battle. Veterans becoming important power figures in a fight so that you have one cap supported by many subcaps. The breakdown of Eve's playerbase should be a curve similar to weapons falloff. A massive number of players, the new people, who represent the basic "instant" gratification of friggies and cruisers. As you go up to the larger T1 hulls and T2, some players have left, so fewer overall at this SP til you get near the top where the multi year veterans are who then command their wings and fleets in key powerful ships, but vulnerable meaning needs the rookies as a front line.


I guess in a way, it is instant gratification, but of a different sort. While they are in the big fights, they are dying and will then be wanting to go through the training for more specialized play and roles. All games are instant gratification, that is what makes them fun and retains players. So I guess in that regards, yes, I want instant gratification, but not instant top tier combat. It should take years and player devotion to an alliance and eve to become somebody of notoriety.

Jenn aSide wrote:
Hell, most of us who actually run incursions would survive a rebalance, it's the fair weather isk hoarder types that would cry.


I would probably come back to the incursions if they became more free flowing and the mentality of the organizations went back to the ol days.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.