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Dev blog: Reworking Capital Ships: And thus it begins!

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HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#261 - 2015-10-25 20:02:28 UTC
You know, the cruel irony here is that the phoenix will be the only dread to outshine its marauder equivalent in the role I think is being pushed.

Why did they nerf the weakest dread? It matters not; the RCML shall cure all.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#262 - 2015-10-25 20:11:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Arthur Aihaken
CCP Masterplan wrote:
  • Technically there's no reason why we couldn't apply the resistance mechanics to any type of ship once it is implemented. However for now it will be one of the exclusive perks of capitals.
    • Battleships could really use some TLC, so please consider extending these to Battleships in the near future. And please don't nerf capital missiles anymore than they already have...

    I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
    Soldarius
    Dreddit
    Test Alliance Please Ignore
    #263 - 2015-10-25 20:16:22 UTC
    Force Auxillary Caps -
    more capital ships. But more specialized rather jack of all trades and master of most. Good idea. Also gives more things for cap pilots to train towards. I am excited to see what you have planned for this new role.

    No more EWAR immunity -
    This is so awesome! I've been a proponent of exactly this for years. So very glad to see it happening. However, I see no reason to make titans quite so easy to tackle. IIRC, a focused-point HIC has a 100 warp core disruption strength. So give Titans a 100pt warp core strength. Big ships, big stats.

    No more refitting under fire - Good choice. I support this. But, just running your triage or siege module should not grant a weapons timer. Firing weapons should generate a weapons timer. Remote reps could generate a weapons timer. Just sitting with your triage running.... well.... bait I guess.

    EWAR Resistance: For caps, this is perfect. Just what is needed. This could also be applied to subcaps. But it would have to be very carefully balanced to avoid completely nullifying EWAR in those cases.

    New and rebalanced capital modules. Cool. Another good idea. Will High-Angle weapon batteries be equivalent to Rapid launchers in purpose and general usage?

    And that new fighter management mock-up looks really sweet. Can we get that for carriers and sub-caps, too?

    Fighter abilities seems like a lot of technical overhead. Some of the effects listed would probably be either OP or just weird to have on fighters. MJD? Why would they not have an MWD? Some abilities are just things they should never go without. Bombs on fighters is a very bad idea. Can we not just stick with racial variants having racial benefits?

    Nice work on the control scheme, tactical overlay, and camera control. Can I presume that will be the end of the 100km Look At distance limit? Please say so.

    New Doomsdays: omg yes. Sickle will be oh so sweet when it sweeps through a fleet and wrecks all the things. Will it discriminate between friendlies and enemies? Because i fnot, that would really be great. IT would penalize poor targetting and reward good targeting. Cap Overload looks like it can be pretty awesome. Big AoE centered on the firing ship. Maybe call it Hammer of Thor? Hand of God... hue. Ok I'll just warp back. Pike: ok. Cool.

    More projected EWAR. Ok I'm down with that.

    Overall, I like what I'm reading.

    http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
    Sizeof Void
    Ninja Suicide Squadron
    #264 - 2015-10-25 20:26:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Sizeof Void
    How about adding a new class of weapons, which are designed to be used by sub-capitals, against capital ships only?

    These anti-cap-ship weapons would be ineffective against sub-cap ships, and consume a lot of power - perhaps even draining the ship's capacitor completely after each round of shots - thus, making ships which are equipped for anti-cap-ship work much more vulnerable to counter-attack by normally-fitted sub-cap ships.

    There could be such weapons for each class of sub-cap ships, even down to the lowly frigs. This would allow even relative noobs to seriously participate in taking down a super-cap. Note: I'm not suggesting that a single frig should be able to take down a Titan, but, perhaps a hundred of them should be able to do so, if specifically equipped with anti-cap-ship weapons.

    This would also give capital ships more reason to fit those new anti-sub-cap weapons, and makes sub-cap support for caps even more essential..

    Note: Designing such anti-cap weapons now, as part of the Captial expansion, rather than later down the line, will make balancing the new cap specs easier. As long as there is a designed counter to overwhelming cap HP, you won't need to compromise the numbers as far downwarrds.
    Querns
    Science and Trade Institute
    Caldari State
    #265 - 2015-10-25 20:30:21 UTC
    Sizeof Void wrote:
    How about adding a new class of weapons, which are designed to be used by sub-capitals, against capital ships only?

    These anti-cap-ship weapons would be ineffective against sub-cap ships, and consume a lot of power - perhaps even draining the ship's capacitor completely after each round of shots - thus, making ships which are equipped for anti-cap-ship work much more vulnerable to counter-attack by normally-fitted sub-cap ships.

    There could be such weapons for each class of sub-cap ships, even down to the lowly frigs. This would allow even relative noobs to seriously participate in taking down a super-cap. Note: I'm not suggesting that a single frig should be able to take down a Titan, but, perhaps a hundred of them should be able to do so, if specifically equipped with anti-cap-ship weapons.

    This would also give capital ships more reason to fit those new anti-sub-cap weapons, and makes sub-cap support for caps even more essential..

    Most ships can already be fitted with modules that kill capital ships, though you'll need to train skills in the Gunnery and Missiles skill groups to use them.

    This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
    Mr Floydy
    Questionable Ethics.
    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
    #266 - 2015-10-25 20:31:38 UTC
    Seen a few posts worrying about the Capital RR transition between Carriers to Force Auxiliaries... I'm not keen on the turning carriers into FAs during a downtime, but I also don't want to see the game without Capital RR whilst people build them...

    CCP - Any chance of a phased overlap? Where the Force Auxiliaries are released but Carriers remain as they are for a week or so to give people a chance to move from one to the other?
    oohthey ioh
    Doomheim
    #267 - 2015-10-25 20:35:42 UTC
    Do something thing witht eh old doomdays to, keep them simple like they are now but something more fun other then lock and shoot.
    Aesir Terona
    Fukushima Daiichi Electric Power Co.
    #268 - 2015-10-25 20:39:01 UTC
    Mr Floydy wrote:
    Aesir Terona wrote:

    Thanks for the giant "Screw you" to everyone who trained triage II. Completely uprooting the the triage carrier pilot will go over grand.

    Maybe you should read the blog before posting rubbish.
    Triage modules will be fitted to the Force Auxiliary. They will replace the Logistics Carrier.


    ITT - people jumping to conclusions and solid proof you can't please everyone.

    I didn't train for a goddamn Force Auxiliary

    either way, it ends up nerfing all capitals more for the sake of making more "options", which, following CCP's record at balancing, means one thing will be outstandingly good, and the other two will languish in disuse because CCP isn't very smart.
    Soleil Fournier
    Fliet Pizza Delivery
    Of Essence
    #269 - 2015-10-25 20:42:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Soleil Fournier
    As a long time super pilot I am excited for these changes and support the direction were heading for capitals as a whole.

    I would like to see the super special weapons include buffs for friendly fleets, not just debuffs for enemy fleets. I.E. an ability that raises friendly ewar resistance in a specific area of space. (OR a fleet bonus like titans have now that raises fleet ewar resistance).
    Tiana Makarov
    The Scope
    Gallente Federation
    #270 - 2015-10-25 20:54:24 UTC
    As a player who is training for their first dread/carrier, is it actually worth it now with even more skills added and and less utility?
    Just seems like everytime i train for something it gets nerfed and now even longer training times...

    Skill que online ;p
    Terranid Meester
    Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
    #271 - 2015-10-25 20:55:34 UTC
    This is all cool for capital pilots but what does it mean for sub-capital pilots?

    This seems to only reinforce proliferation of capitals and super capitals, so how will sub-capitals, in particular battleships be able to compete once titans are the new battleships? Will null alliances make prioritising capital pilots over sub-capital pilots a reality so that those who choose to only fly sub-caps be made into second class citizens?
    Velarra
    #272 - 2015-10-25 20:56:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Velarra
    I read that you intend to decouple the camera from a ship the deploys fighters/bombers/drones etc mmm?

    If you mess too much with the camera controls and how they pan & move the players' viewpoint for this feature, and start making people sick and nauseous....Caps will not be all that appealing for everyone debating whether or not to train for them who may or may not be rather motion sickness susceptible.

    In general, you really should keep the 180 rule ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/180-degree_rule ) in mind, and hopefully the lessons CCP is learning while developing VR games for the occulus VR toys. Primarily as constant and repeated camera movements that disorient the viewer, eventually make people sick.
    Terranid Meester
    Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
    #273 - 2015-10-25 20:58:44 UTC
    Sizeof Void wrote:
    How about adding a new class of weapons, which are designed to be used by sub-capitals, against capital ships only?


    Drifter doomsdays for battleships, allow battleships to use cynos and add a hic like sphere warp disruption module for battleships maybe? I hope the next ship class CCP look at next will BE battleships.
    Querns
    Science and Trade Institute
    Caldari State
    #274 - 2015-10-25 21:05:35 UTC
    Velarra wrote:
    I read that you intend to decouple the camera from a ship the deploys fighters/bombers/drones etc mmm?

    If you mess too much with the camera controls and how they pan & move the players' viewpoint for this feature, and start making people sick and nauseous....Caps will not be all that appealing for everyone debating whether or not to train for them who may or may not be rather motion sickness susceptible.

    In general, you really should keep the 180 rule ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/180-degree_rule ) in mind, and hopefully the lessons CCP is learning while developing VR games for the occulus VR toys. Primarily as constant and repeated camera movements that disorient the viewer, eventually make people sick.

    I believe that the new camera views were optional. Useful, perhaps, but not required.

    This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
    Soleil Fournier
    Fliet Pizza Delivery
    Of Essence
    #275 - 2015-10-25 21:11:13 UTC
    What will happen to Drone Control Units? The +1 fighter will be worthless with the transition to squadrons.
    TrouserDeagle
    Beyond Divinity Inc
    Shadow Cartel
    #276 - 2015-10-25 21:13:47 UTC
    Terranid Meester wrote:
    This is all cool for capital pilots but what does it mean for sub-capital pilots?

    This seems to only reinforce proliferation of capitals and super capitals, so how will sub-capitals, in particular battleships be able to compete once titans are the new battleships? Will null alliances make prioritising capital pilots over sub-capital pilots a reality so that those who choose to only fly sub-caps be made into second class citizens?


    all ECM all the time

    or damps and tracking disruptors if they adjust the stacking so they can be useful with the ewar resistance.
    Mr Floydy
    Questionable Ethics.
    Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
    #277 - 2015-10-25 21:15:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Floydy
    Soleil Fournier wrote:
    What will happen to Drone Control Units? The +1 fighter will be worthless with the transition to squadrons.

    Who knows right now. It might be an extra squadron, it might be extra fighters in a squadron.

    I'd really not worry about it right now. It's unlikely to get turned into a bit of carbon and dumped into the cargo of your ship ;)
    Soleil Fournier
    Fliet Pizza Delivery
    Of Essence
    #278 - 2015-10-25 21:16:08 UTC
    Terranid Meester wrote:
    This is all cool for capital pilots but what does it mean for sub-capital pilots?

    This seems to only reinforce proliferation of capitals and super capitals, so how will sub-capitals, in particular battleships be able to compete once titans are the new battleships? Will null alliances make prioritising capital pilots over sub-capital pilots a reality so that those who choose to only fly sub-caps be made into second class citizens?


    Null alliances will need subcaps for the command node part of the sov ystem. Caps won't be hunting those down due to their lack of mobility. Both subcaps and capitals will be important in nullsec.
    TheMercenaryKing
    Collapsed Out
    Pandemic Legion
    #279 - 2015-10-25 21:33:09 UTC
    I would absolutely love it if you redesigned dreads to have 6-8 guns. And as for the 1-2k damage in siege (if i read correctly) on those subcap targeting turrets, it is not worth it.. 3-4k would be reasonable due to cost/damage scaling as many battleships can reach 1.5k dps and the highest is around 2.4k.
    Harvey James
    The Sengoku Legacy
    #280 - 2015-10-25 21:43:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Harvey James
    Arden Elenduil wrote:
    The question I have is, will you let them into highsec (to assault those pesky large and XL citadels)


    very against capitals ever getting into highsec, so will supercapitals get a seperate skillbook from carrier as you've previously admitted should have been the case all along?, since you're adding the new capital auxilary one

    T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

    ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

    Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using