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Dev Blog: Exploring The Character Bazaar & Skill Trading

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General Lootit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4861 - 2015-10-25 08:13:56 UTC  |  Edited by: General Lootit
Tess Rain, in case if you reading this, thank you for your support through past pages.

Main source of concerns and side effects

Typical loyal customer with eleventy accounts
Gully Alex Foyle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4862 - 2015-10-25 08:34:01 UTC
ColdBeauty wrote:
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
ColdBeauty wrote:
* Rich Veterans pushing the price out of reach of new guys because of diminishing returns causing them to buy up vast amounts of TSPs.

* New players that can't afford R/L cash and unable to effectively grind enough isk for TSPs seeing their rich in R/L peers advance to more fun stuff more quickly.

* Renters being asked to stump up SPs by nullsec powerblocks.

* FOTM becoming even more of an issue as TSPs allow instant access to whatever new cancerous crap everyone wants to fly.

* T3s becoming even more ubiquitous and obsoleting more ships as TSPs will render SP penalty for ship loss redundant.

Just a couple off top of my head
You'll always be able to make your own for 1/4 PLEX + extractors. There is literally no way prices will raise above that.

More SP doesn't mean more fun. What is peers, since almost everybody starts on their own? Also, who cares?

Renters pay ISK or SP, it will be the exact same thing since they'll be interchangable.

Why is FOTM an issue? Ships are cancerous when they're unbalenced, not when a number of people choose to fly them.

LOL at SP loss actually limiting T3 use.


Look, you're free to not like this proposal, but what you write are sloppy predictions that simply will not happen. Wait and see if you don't believe me.



These are not predictions, they are possible outcomes, and it seems you are the one using a crystal ball...

Quote:
that simply will not happen


You cannot possibly state that with confidence, to do so is at best naivety, at worst complete hubris.
Ok, a very small part of what you wrote is opinion, which I concede cannot be flatly proven right or wrong (e.g. how the majority of new players will react to the possibility to spend $ on PLEX to get ISK to buy SP).


But the majority of your post is just misinformed:

. No way SP prices will rise above 1/4 PLEX + Extractor, this is simple market logic

. SP packets can be bought for ISK. There's no reason for space landlords to ask for SP packets instead of ISK, since ISK can buy them both SP packets and anything else that is freely traded in Jita. ISK will always be a better rental fee than SP packets.

. FOTM is a balance issue, sames as T3s. SP makes no difference. Certain ships being significantly more effective than others is a problem because it limits variety and interesting gameplay. The solution is balancing the ships, not having SP or ISK barriers (slightly) limiting player choice of ships


Hope it's clearer now.

Make space glamorous! Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
Jared Khanar
#4863 - 2015-10-25 08:37:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Jared Khanar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZSCaswtcsA

The eve vegas 2015 keynote.
A lot of informations about citadels and how they will be used, fitted, etc. (7:35 - 21:54)
I´m waiting for the moment new skills to operate this structures and their new introduced modules may get announced.
Sadly i noticed no informations on skills in the keynote. But some time ago a devblog stated "we will introduce new modules because we don´t want to mess with the modules for ships" or something like that, if i remember right. it would absolutly make sense to introduce new skills then, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPbMwne4X1Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIms0J9-qSY

really good changes that may drag a lot of players into the game
eve - mmorpg becomes mmortsg - +1

well, if there will be new skills for all this, noone will be able to use the content immediately, so the sp trading proposal tries to provide something absolutly necessary - and cash in on that.

A a lot of bigger alliances may need to rearange the skills of their alts. Or create new one´s as there will be no characters skilled as needed in the character bazaar. It will be a race Roll
Capitals may also become a "big thing" again. If eve does not get something like this, new players would have to wait a long time until they might be able to play what they came for.
(If eve becomes more rts like this could potentially increase the quantity of alts someone likes to play / manage.)

All these consequences for demand, supply, sp-package prices, marketmanipulations and the general motivation to spend cash for gameplay ... the sky is the limit Big smile

Again: CCP, please do not connect fixes for problems / gamemechanics or the abillity to enjoy a specific content to revenue income. Please do not introduce gamebreaking or non-vanity items in the eve store, as you promised.

*waiting for the next devblogs*

Economic Services

trading spacepixels
Dave Stark
#4864 - 2015-10-25 09:29:47 UTC
Sgt Ocker wrote:
CCP has an amazing track record for getting it wrong.


you are aware you're talking about a company that created a game that has survived for over 12 years (i think we're at 12 years now aren't we?), that doesn't happen by accident.
Levi Belvar
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#4865 - 2015-10-25 09:54:05 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
CCP has an amazing track record for getting it wrong.


you are aware you're talking about a company that created a game that has survived for over 12 years (i think we're at 12 years now aren't we?), that doesn't happen by accident.


Yes thats very true, and still had a good retention ratio until incarna, so that points to theres nothing at all wrong with the game but the decisions that changed the game at that point.

Changing the goalposts always has unforseen circumstances and CCP has made some monumental ****ups in that department.

“Stupidity and wisdom meet in the same centre of sentiment and resolution, in the suffering of human accidents.”
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#4866 - 2015-10-25 10:10:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeremiah Saken
CCP Terminus wrote:
Roughly 70 characters are traded per day, not per month. Something like 25000 a year give or take.

Some more data:
- Most traded characters are 50 million SP or lower.
- A good portion of trades are to newer players (measured by new customers not just new accounts).

So where are they? Good portion of trades are to newer players, 25k total is not small numer here. EvE should be constantly growing, it's the opposite. I don't think SP is a problem here.

Edit: I just starting to watch EvE Vegas keynote. First 2 min and I'm already sure this will hit TQ, maybe in some other form that presented but SP trading will be a fact. If Seagull is talking something about "there are lot's of details to get right here" it's done deal.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Don ZOLA
Omniscient Order
#4867 - 2015-10-25 10:18:41 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:

Answer this one then.

When are you gonna resign from CCP?


Lol so mad.

Also ccp seagull said this feature is imprtant to the future of the future of eve yesterday at eve vegas. Give it up lads, it's happening.


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.

There are 2 rules in a successful life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know
Dave Stark
#4868 - 2015-10-25 10:21:01 UTC
Don ZOLA wrote:
They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust


funny, seagull said the exact opposite.
Don ZOLA
Omniscient Order
#4869 - 2015-10-25 10:39:43 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:
They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust


funny, seagull said the exact opposite.


Funny, lack of their posting here says opposite to that.

There are 2 rules in a successful life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know
General Lootit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4870 - 2015-10-25 10:40:36 UTC  |  Edited by: General Lootit
Don ZOLA wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:

Answer this one then.

When are you gonna resign from CCP?


Lol so mad.

Also ccp seagull said this feature is imprtant to the future of the future of eve yesterday at eve vegas. Give it up lads, it's happening.


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.


We all praying but god leaves us. Do you know why? thats why
"What a bunch of whiners. This is gonna suck up my whole life." Bruce Almighty

P.S. Today is day to make some noise =)

Main source of concerns and side effects

Typical loyal customer with eleventy accounts
Don ZOLA
Omniscient Order
#4871 - 2015-10-25 10:42:04 UTC
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:

Answer this one then.

When are you gonna resign from CCP?


Lol so mad.

Also ccp seagull said this feature is imprtant to the future of the future of eve yesterday at eve vegas. Give it up lads, it's happening.


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.


We all praying but god leaves us. Do you know why? thats why

P.S. Today is day to make some noise =)


How is that different from any of previous days for you? :D

There are 2 rules in a successful life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know
Kaivar Lancer
Doomheim
#4872 - 2015-10-25 10:42:32 UTC
Down with socialism! Let the SP market be free!
General Lootit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4873 - 2015-10-25 10:45:16 UTC
Don ZOLA wrote:
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Daniela Doran wrote:

Answer this one then.

When are you gonna resign from CCP?


Lol so mad.

Also ccp seagull said this feature is imprtant to the future of the future of eve yesterday at eve vegas. Give it up lads, it's happening.


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.


We all praying but god leaves us. Do you know why? thats why

P.S. Today is day to make some noise =)


How is that different from any of previous days for you? :D

Less arguments and more fun. Big smile

Main source of concerns and side effects

Typical loyal customer with eleventy accounts
Don ZOLA
Omniscient Order
#4874 - 2015-10-25 10:47:18 UTC
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.


We all praying but god leaves us. Do you know why? thats why

P.S. Today is day to make some noise =)


How is that different from any of previous days for you? :D

Less arguments and more fun. Big smile


He would need to have arguments in the first place for that. And I am sure he had plenty of his own fun with trolling :)

There are 2 rules in a successful life: 1. Don't tell people everything you know
General Lootit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4875 - 2015-10-25 10:53:50 UTC
Don ZOLA wrote:
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:
General Lootit wrote:
Don ZOLA wrote:


Of course it is happening, it was clear from the start by the lack of the communication of CCP with players here. They did not want to discuss about it and to see what to adjust, they have decided on it and they do not care what players have to say :shocker:.

Ah well, guess the players will send the message via subscriptions.


We all praying but god leaves us. Do you know why? thats why

P.S. Today is day to make some noise =)


How is that different from any of previous days for you? :D

Less arguments and more fun. Big smile


He would need to have arguments in the first place for that. And I am sure he had plenty of his own fun with trolling :)

I spoke for myselfe and not for "him". But watching vets vs noobs should be funny also.

Main source of concerns and side effects

Typical loyal customer with eleventy accounts
Dave Stark
#4876 - 2015-10-25 10:54:35 UTC
i still find it funny how it's "trolling" to disagree with him and point out the flaws in his argument. honestly not sure he understands what a troll is.
General Lootit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4877 - 2015-10-25 10:55:34 UTC
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#4878 - 2015-10-25 10:58:22 UTC
CCP Terminus wrote:
If it was a done deal we'd have put the dev blog out when it was going to be shipped. The whole point of the dev blog is to gather feedback and assess.

The whole point of this dev blog was "how" it should be implemented not "if". Be more precise next time, it was done deal all the time.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Dror
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#4879 - 2015-10-25 10:59:36 UTC
Don ZOLA wrote:
General Lootit wrote:
Most importatnt value is blown ship within first month and not "integrate within society". I joined small corp but I'm still soloing(for real). So in what group am I? Data need to be interpreted.


That is your opinion. I think that in MMO games, socialization and integration have quite bigger aspect than the ship which is inevitably going to explode :)

Do you have any concrete reason to say this, especially any research?

"SP is helpful for the game?" Here's all of the research on motivation -- it says the opposite! What purpose does it serve, then? Starter corps are non-competitive. Sov is unchallenged. "Fix sov!" you say? Remove SP.
Levi Belvar
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#4880 - 2015-10-25 11:03:17 UTC
General Lootit wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
what a troll is.

1) He must be green

One who purposely and deliberately (that purpose usually being self-amusement) starts an argument in a manner which attacks others on a forum without in any way listening to

the arguments proposed by his or her peers. He will spark of such an argument via the use of ad hominem attacks, with no substance or relevence to back them up as well as straw man arguments, which he uses to simply avoid addressing the essence of the issue.

Тот, кто намеренно и сознательно ( что цель , как правило, быть самостоятельной развлечений ) начинает аргумент в манере, которая атакует других на форуме без какого-либо прослушивания

аргументы , предложенные своих сверстников. Он вызовет такой аргумент через использование рассчитанный на предубеждения нападений , без вещества или relevence , чтобы поддержать их , а также

соломы мужчина аргументы , которые он использует, чтобы просто избежать решения сути вопроса .

If find that strawman part rather fitting for another on here too Blink

“Stupidity and wisdom meet in the same centre of sentiment and resolution, in the suffering of human accidents.”