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Ah... so it is. My mistake.

Well these already need a nerf.

Because bonus wording is sometimes... odd...
The Amarr and Caldari Range bonuses are drastically reducing the EWar range to encourage the disruption ship into ranges where it can contribute through its weapons as well; rather than kiting around jamming at near max range with highslots which might as well be empty?



Stab'd De'plexing ships in FW? Enough scram to hold a Venture with a single module?

.... Here is the deal.

They could have bled off a bulk of the bonuses to the existing t2 ewar frigs, vs releasing these. Heck I think they still should.

Dunno I think these need a little more thought and/or conceptualizing.

These concern me a bit.

In a month or two. In the beginning, you are supposed to have fun with them and derp around. That's CCP's development guideline nowadays.

The only one I really paid attention to was the griffin because it's the only one I have experience with.

The short targeting range looks like it's trying to nudge the griffin out of sitting back and jamming at max 80ish km ranges with racial jammers and instead getting into close range brawling.

As a solo ship, I never really felt as though the griffin had a decent chance. The rainbow config was nice but that was more for small fleet support and completely removed the option of having the ability to hold someone down with a point and web. Multi-spectrals were too weak which resulted in missing most jam attempts, and the griffin's DPS wasn't high enough to afford multiple missed jam cycles. So while you could have like, 2 multi-specs, a point, a web, and a prop mod, the lower jam strength with still zero tank meant you were always on the disadvantageous side of the gamble of attempting anything by yourself. These changes seem like they'll result in their having a fighting chance, which considering they'll most definitely cost about 20x-30x more than your standard griffin, I think it's justified.

The small turret bonus looks good. You couldn't really get respectable DPS with the 2 rocket launchers before. It was a contributing factor that coupled with it's zero actual tank and the other ships most likely having one while the griffin's only chance was pure luck from a low-strength jam resulted in griffins more than not rolling snake eyes and blowing up.

I like that 1 missile turret hard point btw. It means I can fit a light missile launcher on it and have it spit out defender missiles negating anywhere from 25-33% incoming dps from other frigates while still having the hybrids rain hell.

But whatever ends up happening, unless it's completely worthless, people are going to complain about it.

People seem to have this selfish idea that they're never suppose to be on the receiving end of bad luck, only the other guy. Only the griffin pilot is suppose to have bad luck. But I dunno, I like the idea of chance. For me, the idea of circumstances out of my control is enticing. But I guess others just can't seem to shake the notion that they're infallible, God's gift, King of the World, whatever it is that makes them so angry whenever they die and enjoy the experience for the experience and not only focus on the end result.

But whatever, immature noobs will be immature noobs.

+1 for GNI

After a nights sleep some summed up thoughts:

Incentivizing EWAR into brawling range is a neat idea and the ships could be able to complement this with additional staying power and damage to validate using them over the standard EWAR frigates.

As they are proposed now they kill any incentive to use any other frigate outside of some very special cases (Worm, Garmur) because they are extremely strong in small fights and offer outright the same (ehp, dmg) in scaled up situations or get a bonus that lend itself to tackling/kiting.

The worst offender is the Griffin as there is literally everything wrong with it. If you want to brawl in a frigate there is nothing better, even if you don't include a racial ECM module. It's also designed that it lives long enough in case you're lucky with your ECCM. But even if it only did 100 dps it would still be a pretty unfun ship to fight.

Why ECM ever made it into that list lies beyond me. If it has to be ECM I'd suggest reducing the range further, because the only way to fight this is to never get within 10km for a second, depending how on the ball the pilot is. ( Good thing it can also fit railguns. ). 2.5km+2.5km looks managable as you literally only need to jam once to win.

Alternatives could be trying weaker fast cycling ECM (interrupting, not completely locking you for 20s)

I like them. They add variety to small roaming gangs as stated. One of the major questions is their market price.

I think that the Maulus Navy and Vigil Fleet will be gatecamp darlings. They both have similar scan resolution to the Keres and Hyena. Imagine that +3 scram strength combined with a 15km+ web. And on top of that they will apply decent damage given their size. Obviously pro solo pilots will enjoy these two as well due to the range dictation.

Reading through all of the comments I think that people are underestimating the Griffin Navy's potential. It will be a really great ship to get a low skill friend or two into for fleet support. It's nice jamming what you tackle. Crucifier Navy will be a nice ship in the hangar to completely nerf some missile boats with the new disruptors. But getting close enough to use it would be bad. That 85% range nerf is a little high. I don't get the design choice, actually.

Powergrid seems about right as well. The CPU and bonuses definitely make these ships very niche. Not something to bring against a T3 destroyer gang but in the right hands could do some work.

Navy Maulus is going to be too strong.

-85% ecm range... ecm with a range of 4km, would you really waste a mid on that?
325 m/s... about the same speed as a merlin
the only bonus on it that anyone can use is 20% dmg bonus. This is a piece of ****, if you want to do ecm get a griffin, or basically any ship that isn't this one. If you want to brawl get a merlin.

The Griffin and the Crucifier are garbage, the vigil and the Maulus are pure cancer. wow balance