Player Features and Ideas Discussion

This is a good change.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess, from some comments that CCP Rise made last(?) summer, that CCP wants to avoid touching the existing career agents as much as possible, because it's all archaic hand-built special-snowflake code that's a huge pain to update.



There are skills that require other skills, too. I was rudely reminded of this when I started an alt, got Drones, trained it to 1 so I could use the 1 drone her current ship supported, found out I needed Light Drone Operation, got that, and then found out that it required Drones III.

It's a small delay, a matter of hours, but in a way that just makes it more infuriating. It's why I'm glad they're including higher-tier skills like Salvaging and Thermodynamics.

i really like the idea to help out new players, honestly i think this will go a long way but i want to raise the stakes a bit by giving them a one time reward on a finished career path lets say 150k unallocated SP

why? simpel because you give them a reason to do the tutorials and by the time they are done with that they get a reward (always nice) and have more knowledge of the game so they can spend the points wisely and how they see fit. ofcourse those points can only be rewarded once per character.

i dont see any reasons to exclude people from the one reward on career path so everybody should be able to do so. If CCP thinks otherwise i am fine with that too

Not exactly. The SP grant here is because the early hours of the game are going to involve a large portion of 'hunt the skillbook', along with 'I'd love to do that Mr/Mrs Career Agent, only I need to wait another 30 min for Industry I to finish'.

With luck though, your prediction that more and more skills will be removed will come true.

i definitely think they should do something for the newer chars that missed out on this because they started before that. i think they MUST do this, not for me i passes the 100 mil SP so i am good :) but yeah i feel your post

This looks really good. Thank you for taking the time to fix this issue.

The only issue I can see is that missiles get a small fraction of the SP that gunnery does. Gunnery gets many of the support skills trained to level one and sometimes level two. Missiles only get one skill to level one. This is especially annoying because missiles take far longer to train than turrets. Is this across the board, or is this because the character example is Amarr and doesn't really use missiles? Will Caldari characters get more missile SP than gunnery SP?

wouldnt it be more fair to just inject all the missing skills directly for everyone rather than give newly created characters free 350k sp? what about the newbie that is a month old instead of 2 weeks?

that way people dont get free 350k sp which is enough to get a free 24h old cyno toon and everyone will get the default skills now which means that some skillbooks could be removed from market ect.

Why does having skills you may not use but spent no time or effort on constitute an issue? The goal here is to give some basic capabilities, not have a free early specialty.

Also, how does having extra skills on your skill sheet restrict you as a player in any way? How does having more abilities than you might use cause your activities to be less player driven? You literally have more options as a player rather than restrictions due to skill limits.

CCP doesn't chose the skills you want, only those you start with. You chose the skills you want by training them. The your hauler has gunnery skills doesn't in any way reduce the ability to haul, nor does it restrict the ability to improve you hauling through training.

Starting skills are there to provide a baseline capability, not provide free specialization. That's what skill training is for.

Correct up to here...

...but wrong here. The starting skills are, as stated prior, a baseline of capabilities, designed for all players and thus take into account each end. The weren't designed more for one player than another because at the point these skills are given a player is likely to lack certainty on their direction.

Further, your plea towards player choice is ironic because it obligates players to take the NPC driven NPE in order to receive their SP. That's not player freedom. A player shouldn't be obligated to do the starter missions more than is already suggested or risk missing out on a big part of their starting package. The player driven aspect starts at the first login, not after the tutorials are done.

Lastly, these skills, once more, are a baseline. They are the point where players should start. Not lower, and not higher in certain capacities either. That's what skill training is for.

Learn what meaningful player choice is then come back and talk about it. Learn the difference between a sandbox opening and a necessary tutorial. Learn about the truth of the NPE and recall how ill equipped you were when entering the game to fathom exactly what you needed to train next and thus how useless free SP would have been.

Further, maybe you should understand there is no real lost choice in this, only choices gained earlier. The ability for vets to "choose" to not have a skill in their skillsheets is nothing compared to new players having the ability to chose more activities the moment they log in regardless of what or where they do it.

But mostly learn the history of the game and realize that we've always had a static set of skills at character creation, even in the times of Eve's greatest growth and realize you premise has no basis in fact.