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Decline in numbers... starting to turn into RAPID!!!

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Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#2021 - 2015-09-22 15:28:18 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
thats the problem people seem to think they should be spoonfed everything and treat a sandbox like some sort of arena game, something happens that the player doesnt like then it NEEDS to be changed regardless who it affects, so instead of the player adapting to the sandbox these players expect for the sandbox to adapt to them. and thats not the way it works


#1. the above is part of the growing popularity of MOBAs

#2. You can say the above bolded part, and it can be gospel truth, but that matters little to people who think that the world owes them something just for being born.
Thonys Visser
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2022 - 2015-09-22 15:45:33 UTC
Well first of all, i still like the game:

But i think the bottom line is : Money
it would be nice to have 2 account for the price of the current one account
that would help greatly to improve the figures (perhaps it tickles the old members to give it a go again)
also advertising on TV would help i have never seen them (ccp) on the TV over here (i do see w.o.t sometimes )

a 2 account billing for 3 months is just about 70 euros and that is about 300 euros a year
and thats just the bottle neck for a year playing eve ... 300 euro's

this game is for the wealthy now a days so a lot leave (specialy if you look at games like wot, warthunder, wows, exc.)

if you look at SC you pay only once and thats it ...

EVE and subscription is a outdated form of marketing and business model (some of us like it this way, but a lot see other games for a much cheaper price
and sure their always will be a hard core player base
i have a lot of friends (who like this game)but they have a problem with the price of the game

i find that rather sad it has to be that way...

every body likes it ,but a lot need that 300 euro s for food, their children, or a haircut for their wife

So the bottom line is money

On the other hand ccp has not reached his critical line it seems, otherwise they would intervene with a advertising campaign
so their will be no down pricing in the near future i assume
and for the down pricing well thats a pitty
Because i like it when there are a lot of players in the game, and not outside the game

their always will be a hard core player base .....but for how long...
other games are on the horizon and much cheaper to.

The question will be, how loyal is this player base ...for that price......
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#2023 - 2015-09-22 15:49:31 UTC
Thonys Visser wrote:
Well first of all, i still like the game:

But i think the bottom line is : Money
it would be nice to have 2 account for the price of the current one account
that would help greatly to improve the figures (perhaps it tickles the old members to give it a go again)
also advertising on TV would help i have never seen them (ccp) on the TV over here (i do see w.o.t sometimes )

a 2 account billing for 3 months is just about 70 euros and that is about 300 euros a year
and thats just the bottle neck for a year playing eve ... 300 euro's

this game is for the wealthy now a days so a lot leave (specialy if you look at games like wot, warthunder, wows, exc.)

if you look at SC you pay only once and thats it ...

EVE and subscription is a outdated form of marketing and business model (some of us like it this way, but a lot see other games for a much cheaper price
and sure their always will be a hard core player base
i have a lot of friends (who like this game)but they have a problem with the price of the game

i find that rather sad it has to be that way...

every body likes it ,but a lot need that 300 euro s for food, their children, or a haircut for their wife

So the bottom line is money

On the other hand ccp has not reached his critical line it seems, otherwise they would intervene with a advertising campaign
so their will be no down pricing in the near future i assume
and for the down pricing well thats a pitty
Because i like it when there are a lot of players in the game, and not outside the game

their always will be a hard core player base .....but for how long...
other games are on the horizon and much cheaper to.

The question will be, how loyal is this player base ...for that price......


who cares about price, its entertainment, i spend more in the pub in 1 night to fund a year of eve and all i get from that is 1 good night and a 3 day hangover

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#2024 - 2015-09-22 15:56:32 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Except they aren't.
Of course they are.
They've spotted a tiny detail in the overarching structure of the game, focused in on it and said “this shall be my play style, just as in X”, gleefully ignoring the larger context in which that tiny detail exists. They then get all pissy about how blowing this detail out of proportion does not actually create the X-experience they assumed, even though it would be pretty silly to make that assumption if you looked at it in its actual context… a context that isn't being ingored, by the way.

Ignoring the context and complaining about how their assumptions are not fulfilled is pretty idiotic.

Quote:
They are people that were perfectly fine playing the game, and many even still are, but watching everyone else getting gameplay improvements while they get shat on is less than fun, so they want to put their opinions forward
In that case, they're also idiots for not paying attention to the gameplay improvements they're getting.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#2025 - 2015-09-22 16:06:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Thonys Visser wrote:
if you look at SC you pay only once and thats it ...
Then you wait 3 years for it to be released while RSI attempt to milk you for every penny they can get.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#2026 - 2015-09-22 16:18:50 UTC
Thonys Visser wrote:
Well first of all, i still like the game:

But i think the bottom line is : Money
it would be nice to have 2 account for the price of the current one account
that would help greatly to improve the figures (perhaps it tickles the old members to give it a go again)



Or they can fix the game so that it isn't "Needed" to have two accounts. I think many of you underestimate the sheer volume of solo account peeps in eve and how the mentality that "need" multiple accounts drives people off.

Reduce sub cost, just means less money from me. I still won't open a second account. I only use Markus, and only ever will. I have no incentive nor will i find additional accounts add to my game experience. It would probably detract from it. The fact that this character has such value has kept me in eve longer. If I had two characters trained different ways, I most assuredly would not have any interest in continuing play.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
Commander Spurty
#2027 - 2015-09-22 18:14:46 UTC
wahooo .. broke 100 pages.

Be back for 200th page broken (which can't happen if the game is in rapid decent).

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#2028 - 2015-09-22 18:29:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Dersen Lowery
Part of the problem is that the question of what's killing the game is more of a litmus test for individual posters. There are correlations, but there are lots of correlations.

One could plausibly argue that CCP should go back to not listening to players and not fixing anything, because while they were doing fire-and-forget development and warring on the impossible, the game grew, and as soon as they turned around and started listening to the players they started going downhill. I'm not saying that's true, I'm saying that's the danger of looking for correlations when so many things have happened at once, not just in EVE, but in the broader game industry.

In 2010, who was worried about the future of MMOs?

I think the return of expansions is a reasonable attempt to help. Even though I recognize that CCP really had no choice but to Fix All The Things on the most aggressive timeline they could afford, I'm sure it's been disruptive to players. The people it would be most disruptive to are the low-information players--i.e., most of them--who woke up one morning to find out that they can't undock in their favorite ship because the fitting changed. I realize that the fast-paced changes aren't going away, but at least the big ones are being announced with a great big advance notice now.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#2029 - 2015-09-22 18:29:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Jenn aSide wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
And yet most of the mechanics around these are the same as ever. The same fits that used to work still work and the tricks worked out several years ago still work in exactly the same way.
And because the game is so big, many 'tricks' don't get used or get forgotten etc.

Last week I mentioned on the missions and complexes forum about how I set my (FoF missile) Gila's drones to assist my mach, turn on the Gila's AB and set the Gila to orbit it's own drones, turning that ship into a 3rd autonomous 'mega' drone (as well as a point defense battery against NPc frigs. People were like "WTF, why didn't I think of that!

The week before last I actually experimented with Defender missiles and Smartbombs against NPC citadel Torps in DED plexes.
Using infrequently used mechanics isn't new. Some randoms going "wow, didn;t think of that" doesn't mean a damn thing. In fact it's more amusing that you are falling back to what are almost deprecated features because nothing new has been added in their field.

Jenn aSide wrote:
See that Lucas, SAND BOX PVE right that. CCP hasn't ignored me, they've buffed my experience (RAPID LIGHT DEFENDERS BRO). But you can't understand it, because you are clinging to a false narrative, one based on your own self interest (in realizing some 'vision' of EVE that doesn't exist and can't).
You don;t even know what my interest is. If CCP did a lot of the changes I'd like to see, most of my playstyle would be nerfed to hell, since half the problem is that EVEs too easy. Unlike you, I'm just not blind to the fact that it's easy for PvP players too just because they get killboard stats against industrials..

Jenn aSide wrote:
I'm not getting into a circular argument with you because I advise others not to which is why I'll end my part here. But Lucas Kell, I'm telling you, your issue is you and your incompatible preferences (and inability to leave EVE alone despite the fact that it's dissapointed you). I will never get your type, because I think in the long run it's easier to learn about yourself than it is to rage against what others (like CCP) are doing.
I've been here since the beginning of time and I'll be here right up to the point that you and your buddies destroy it.


Jenn aSide wrote:
A lion is a Lion. The ONLY thing important to a Gazelle should be the fact that it can eat you.
This makes the process behind a lot of your opinions much clearer. You can't understand that PvP players vary and also require balance.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#2030 - 2015-09-22 18:37:46 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Except they aren't.
Of course they are.
They've spotted a tiny detail in the overarching structure of the game, focused in on it and said “this shall be my play style, just as in X”, gleefully ignoring the larger context in which that tiny detail exists. They then get all pissy about how blowing this detail out of proportion does not actually create the X-experience they assumed, even though it would be pretty silly to make that assumption if you looked at it in its actual context… a context that isn't being ingored, by the way.
You're wrong. You're picking out a couple of people and generalising, so everyone else must be the same way.

Tippia wrote:
In that case, they're also idiots for not paying attention to the gameplay improvements they're getting.
Except they aren't, because whenever a suggestion is made to improve their gameplay, trolls like yourself descend on the post and turn it into a shitstorm until they removed or drastically reduce any changes they were going to make. Social groups were suggested to bring more people into NPSI and even that got rageposted away because they wouldn't simultaneously ban people from NPC corps so they could be picked off getting their spectre fleet ship out of a hub.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#2031 - 2015-09-22 18:48:36 UTC
The rest is the standard Lucas Kell BS that he's done for years , Like i said, I'm not getting in to that. you have some serious problem that turns intelligence into something not that intelligent, but hey, it's your life.

But I will say something about this part.

Lucas Kell wrote:
I've been here since the beginning of time and I'll be here right up to the point that you and your buddies destroy it.


That part is rich. "My buddies"? Like who? PVErs (real ones that don't beg for ccp help, not the fake forum complaining types). People who understand that this is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?

EVE isn't going anywhere (and it will be people like me, who actually like it, keeping it alive, along with several deluded hates how don't like it and keep paying for it. btw Thanks for that PLEX Lucas Kell).

But if it does 'die' because some of us advocate that a game we already like retain it's quality rather than selling out to the all mighty dollar of the unwashed non-EVE masses you represent, well So be it. If being an actual good game makes it die, silly humans didn't deserve EVE in the 1st damn place.

As for you being here, like i said it's you time and/or money to waste on something that never lived up to your unreasonable expectations and never will (or can). It's dumb as hell, but hey, smart isn't a requirement for life (if it were there would be very short lines at every super market).
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#2032 - 2015-09-22 18:54:21 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
That part is rich. "My buddies"? Like who? PVErs (real ones that don't beg for ccp help, not the fake forum complaining types). People who understand that this is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?
No, your buddies as in the toxic part of this community that feel that only they should be allowed to play and anyone not playing exactly like them should leave (after you repeatedly insult them because you're seeming incapable of a reasonable discussion without it being because the opposing party is in some way deficient).

Jenn aSide wrote:
EVE isn't going anywhere (and it will be people like me, who actually like it, keeping it alive, along with several deluded hates how don't like it and keep paying for it. btw Thanks for that PLEX Lucas Kell).
Mate, CCP aren't going to keep it up forever. The population will only drop so low before they decide to move on.

Jenn aSide wrote:
As for you being here, like i said it's you time and/or money to waste on something that never lived up to your unreasonable expectations and never will (or can). It's dumb as hell, but hey, smart isn't a requirement for life (if it were there would be very short lines at every super market).
EVE has been fun through the years and still is now, it's just not as entertaining as it could or even should be. Thre's really no grey area with you, is there? If I don;t absolutely love EVE then I must absolutely hate it, that's the only way you can comprehend it. Sadly, it's wrong.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#2033 - 2015-09-22 18:58:12 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


That part is rich. "My buddies"? Like who? PVErs (real ones that don't beg for ccp help, not the fake forum complaining types). People who understand that this is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?




Null-sec anom milk farmers who want their own play style buffed over the detriment of any other play style because of some ingrained hatred of high-sec back when uncle carebear touched him somewhere.

The holier than thou approach to feeling superior to all others in the game and thinking they are the warden to their own prison fiefdom.

You talk about people feeling entitled and wanting to be spoon fed, but we can barely hear you with that silver plated spork that CCP stuck in your mouth after you complained about the number of sanctums and havens you had.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#2034 - 2015-09-22 19:16:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Lucas Kell wrote:
is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?
No, your buddies as in the toxic part of this community that feel that only they should be allowed to play and anyone not playing exactly like them should leave (after you repeatedly insult them because you're seeming incapable of a reasonable discussion without it being because the opposing party is in some way deficient).[/quote]

This is the problem with being a liar, you think everything is a lie.

The "play my way" thing is stupid and you should know that. I've never told anyone to play like me. Go a head and link the post where I have told someone "you should do nothing but run anomalies, sometimes taking a break with incursions and lvl 5 missions and a little bit of pvp with your buddies".

Telling people to take responsibility to their play style and enjoyment in this sandbox (and reminding them that if they are incompatible with sandbox play, leaving is an option) is not saying "play like me". Telling people What EVE is (a pvp game) and that pvprs will come at you all the time so be careful is not saying "play like me". Telling people to stop trying to run to mommie (ccp) to try to get people nerfed because you don't like them (ie what YOU do) is not saying "play like me".

As for 'insults' son, you haven't heard an insult from me, and if you think you have you must be from one of them panzy PC type places where feelings are easily hurt.. Find yourself on Comms with me one day, THEN you might here one, but mostly it will be laughter at the sound of you actually speaking your beliefs out loud.


Quote:
Mate, CCP aren't going to keep it up forever. The population will only drop so low before they decide to move on.


Firstly, I'm not your mate, hommie.

Secondly, I say Good. Better this experiment in freedom die honorably that see it perverted into something people like you would enjoy.

Quote:
EVE has been fun through the years and still is now, it's just not as entertaining as it could or even should be.


You should finish that sentence with the words "To ME". To most of the rest of us, it's very fun, hell to me personally it's unreasonably fun, it's kept my attention for 8 years, to the point where when I'm at work tonight, I will probably be thinking about fits I want to try.

This is again an example of your lack of willingness to look inside rather than out. The problem is you (which is why you like Elite better), not EVE Online.

Quote:

Thre's really no grey area with you, is there? If I don;t absolutely love EVE then I must absolutely hate it, that's the only way you can comprehend it. Sadly, it's wrong.


Look at your own posting, all criticism of EVE, no joy found anywhere. No talk that i can see about what is awesome about EVE, about what ships you like, about what awesome things you've learned. You're simply a hater.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#2035 - 2015-09-22 19:19:53 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


That part is rich. "My buddies"? Like who? PVErs (real ones that don't beg for ccp help, not the fake forum complaining types). People who understand that this is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?




Null-sec anom milk farmers who want their own play style buffed over the detriment of any other play style because of some ingrained hatred of high-sec back when uncle carebear touched him somewhere.

The holier than thou approach to feeling superior to all others in the game and thinking they are the warden to their own prison fiefdom.

You talk about people feeling entitled and wanting to be spoon fed, but we can barely hear you with that silver plated spork that CCP stuck in your mouth after you complained about the number of sanctums and havens you had.


On que, here is the other one. Birds of a feather.

We get it, you don't like null sec. Too bad. If you feel inferior, it's not my fault.

And who wants anything buffed, if you had an honest bone in your body you would have actually researched my opinion before talking.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#2036 - 2015-09-22 19:20:20 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


The "play my way" thing is stupid and you should know that. I've never told anyone to play like me. Go a head and link the post where I have told someone "you should do nothing but run anomalies, sometimes taking a break with incursions and lvl 5 missions and a little bit of pvp with your buddies".



What is the difference between telling people how to play and telling people how not to play?

These forums are littered with your posts of how people are "playing Eve Wrong"

If that isn't trying to shape their behavior to the way YOU want, I don't know what is.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#2037 - 2015-09-22 19:22:47 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


That part is rich. "My buddies"? Like who? PVErs (real ones that don't beg for ccp help, not the fake forum complaining types). People who understand that this is a pass time and want it to retain some quality despite what you 'water it down for the masses' types want? Those buddies?




Null-sec anom milk farmers who want their own play style buffed over the detriment of any other play style because of some ingrained hatred of high-sec back when uncle carebear touched him somewhere.

The holier than thou approach to feeling superior to all others in the game and thinking they are the warden to their own prison fiefdom.

You talk about people feeling entitled and wanting to be spoon fed, but we can barely hear you with that silver plated spork that CCP stuck in your mouth after you complained about the number of sanctums and havens you had.


On que, here is the other one. Birds of a feather.

We get it, you don't like null sec. Too bad. If you feel inferior, it's not my fault.

And who wants anything buffed, if you had an honest bone in your body you would have actually researched my opinion before talking.



I don't understand why you think it helps your position to belittle people and lump them into a mythical group that doesn't exist.

I live in a wormhole, so yeah I feel a little superior to those with local intel.

"Anoms were basicalyl press-ganged into being the center of the Dominion Sov system's military upgrades, and while I am a constant anom farmer, anoms are horrible for this. "

That was right from your post. You are a Anom farmer, but you want something better than anoms for farming. You also want high-sec nerfed to the point where null-sec is the only isk generation area in the game...

You are a one-trick pony.

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#2038 - 2015-09-22 19:23:37 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Thonys Visser wrote:
if you look at SC you pay only once and thats it ...
Then you wait 3 years for it to be released while RSI attempt to milk you for every penny they can get.


And that's if they finally finish it and release it.
Market McSelling Alt
Doomheim
#2039 - 2015-09-22 19:24:30 UTC
Estella Osoka wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Thonys Visser wrote:
if you look at SC you pay only once and thats it ...
Then you wait 3 years for it to be released while RSI attempt to milk you for every penny they can get.


And that's if they finally finish it and release it.



Their ship spinning is already superior to Eve's ship spinning... so

They win Lol

CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.

40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#2040 - 2015-09-22 19:24:59 UTC
Market McSelling Alt wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


The "play my way" thing is stupid and you should know that. I've never told anyone to play like me. Go a head and link the post where I have told someone "you should do nothing but run anomalies, sometimes taking a break with incursions and lvl 5 missions and a little bit of pvp with your buddies".



What is the difference between telling people how to play and telling people how not to play?

These forums are littered with your posts of how people are "playing Eve Wrong"

If that isn't trying to shape their behavior to the way YOU want, I don't know what is.



That you don't understand is not hard to believe.

So you think telling someone "hey dude, you should tank your ship or maybe mine in a defensive group because CODE exists, and if you don't take precautions, you only have your self to blame, this is EVE" is somehow wrong?

The people I tell that too think they are entitled to safety. I'm not telling people to play my way, i'm say "recognize the reality of your own situation and choices".

It seems that for both you and Kell, the mere ideas of self awareness and personal responsibly are foreign concepts. That makes your way of thinking utterly foriegn (and stupid) to me.