Player Features and Ideas Discussion

[Cynic] you shouldn't really be thanking someone for feedback when they just admitted that they don't understand the broader implications [/cynic]

On a more serious note why do the most common ideas people never run for CSM?

The day I can afford the time to commit to doing a proper job of it, I probably will. As it is, as a currently deployed servicemember, it is a lot easier to post on the forums...

For the reasons listed below, the Drones Regions are terrible space if CCP’s goal is actually to allow for many small city-states to own space, rather than having huge coalitions with vast rental empires. Given that, the Drones Regions require more drastic changes than the older parts of New Eden.

Getting into the Drones Regions is currently quite difficult. The regional jumps between the original cluster and the Drones Regions are almost all larger than 5LY and many are larger than 10LY. The Drones Regions are also relatively large and spread out, which means that the eastern edge is even more inaccessible. This makes logistics into the Drones Regions very difficult, unless you control a connection to the rest of New Eden and a chain of systems from your space to that connection. This is bad because it gives alliances wishing to install themselves in the East a huge reason to blue up. They all become mutually dependent on the same connecting systems – once one party gets a stranglehold on those systems, they effectively control who can live deeper in the region. Difficult logistics promotes huge coalitions covering multiple regions.

Some might counter that enabling local manufacturing would remove the need for logistics chains to and from the rest of Eve. This will not work, however, because unless you are surrounded by a huge, friendly coalition, building anything substantial in the depths of such inaccessible space is simply stupid. If you build a nice industrial center, you are pretty much guaranteed to have someone larger come knock over your sandcastle, just because they can. Then, unless they let you evacuate, you are going to lose almost everything trying to get out. When stuck in such inaccessible space, the option is to either bend the knee and kiss the ring, or not build anything substantial.

Additionally, I recognize that Capital Ships can now take gates. That’s wonderful, if you are strong enough. For the average small alliance, however, a Capital Ship moving operation that involves a lot of gate jumps is going to end in fiery death. I would like to see New Eden’s geography adjusted to the point that there were major shortcuts if you took the right gates, but more areas were accessible by jumping into NPC space.

The Drones Regions became huge farming, rental empires due in large part to the geography. It is great space for PVE. Roaming gangs have to make a real effort to pay a visit, chokepoint entrances mean that a scout can see hostiles coming from outside the region very far away, and there is a non-existent hot drop threat. Pretty much the only threats come from wormhole space (and CCP recently made those connections less common). Additionally, even if it was viable to build a home in such inaccessible space, that does not solve the problem of a lack of local content. The Drones Regions are currently a boring place in which to live. Adding some NPC constellations would be a significant shot in the arm for this region, as it brings a whole host of new PVP opportunities to an otherwise stagnant area.

For these reasons, along with some other adjustments, I would turn the following constellations into NPC space:
Etherium Reach (J-78ZG) – midpoint to get into this very large region
Etherium Reach (ICH-B6) – stepping stone deeper into the East
Malpais (PX0-P4) – opens up Malpais and surrounding areas
Oasa (S-Q02B) – opens up Oasa and surrounding areas
The Spire (Z6T6-B) – opens up The Spire and surrounding areas

I would also shorten these jumps to less than 5 LY:
Skarkon –> L4X-1V
LS-JEP –> UDVW-O

I would shorten this jump to less than 10 LY:
Konora –> QBZO-R

So, go back the the system we had where people demanded that the sov system be created lo many years ago? Fix Sov by eliminating it? That seems... a poor choice. The reason noone is taking the space is mostly because noone sees the advantage in owning it who isn't already there. Many of those groups are starting to fall by the wayside too, unless they are big enough to create some sort of renter unit so they can profit off of it.

The OP gets at two points, in an oblique way, that I've been speaking on since the start of my CSM term. First, the population density of Nullsec is such that the extra "distance" created by Phoebe has made it difficult and boring for the parties who might otherwise conflict to reach each other. Its too damn big and there aren't enough people wanting to cram themselves in to that space, despite the assurances by some that as soon as they somehow get rid of big coalitions suddenly there will be some sort of gold rush in null. *eyeroll*. No. There's plenty of space that an entrepreneur could pry loose now if they had an open eye and a willing group, but the facts are they are either too risk averse, or (correctly) don't see that the reward is worth the effort.

There's really only one way of fixing that, and that is to fix the "Why should I hold sov" issue that is at the center of stagnation in null. If you want people to take the risk that they might be blobbed out at any second by their neighbors, the payoff has to be worth losing ihubs or tcus or ships or whatever over and over to defend your little patch. That can be in isk/hr or fun/hr, but right now there's not enough of the two combined to lure many people.

Big entities can, through combinations of renter deals, holding a lot of moons and half a region, or running big reaction farms, etc, manage to make a pretty good living. Small, new entities not so much, despite the very welcome anom buff to what had previously been nearly worthless low negative sec systems.

Some combination of new, interesting group pve opportunities as have been promised in Fozzies blogs before release, new and different resource distribution that might spur conflict, interesting gameplay centered on the new structures MIGHT bring enough people to make nullsec feel crowded again, might not. Otherwise the solution is probably something like what has been proposed here. ACTUALLY shrink nullsec and put in additional null NPC islands or long distance smuggler gates that get people closer to each other and in contact to fight over opportunities.

I still can't help but feel that we'd be better off if Null was so desirable that people would actually fight for it again, instead of going off to live in lowsec like BL/PL/NC. It seems to me that right now most of the people holding it do so more out of habit than desire.

Why should you hold sov? That question is not solvable with mechanics as long as people do not want to have sov. Want as in maintaining an empire. Running missions in High sec because it is easier money making, for instance, goes completely against wanting to hold sov. Another thing is the "I just mine what sells for the best price in Jita and ignore the other things that can make local industry better" because exporting stuff to Jita and make money there instead of at home is easier.

First and foremost, you need to fix the player attitude like this. If you do not fix this, you can put in place whatever mechanic you want, it will not change anything.

Why not some unclaimable sectors that are deserted also as fire breaks to help stop blueing your neighbour.
If your neighbour is right next door, you will often blue them to stop being 1 system away from hostiles.
If they are instead the whole street over with no-one able to move into the inbetween area and live there you don't have as much impetus to live there.
Ala shattered wormholes. Any kind of fluff can be used to explain why no anchorable structures of any kind.

Agree with more little bits of NPC space.
Don't agree with little bits of low sec popping up in null as low sec is Empire sov. Though it does make it easier for people to cash in ESS LP at that point.

i live in npc nullsec and have done sov nullsec aswell, i think the size is fine as it is -1

That's what she said!

Thank you for your contribution to this thread.

Thank you. I appreciate that. I actually trimmed it down a lot before I posted it.

Something about CSM requiring a certain personality type which the 'Common Ideas' people often are not?