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Boost to Sansha ships - jump fatigue reduction
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Anthar Thebess
#1 - 2015-07-10 12:57:37 UTC
When you compare Sansha ships to any other you will notice one important thing.
They are bad for PVP.
AB bonus is useless in today's battlefield, and this will not change any time soon.

Proposal like you see is simple - sansha ships get additional bonus , jump fatigue reduction.
This will not affect their pvp quality on the field, but may prove tempting to use by some of the groups.

This bonus can vary depending on class , but i suggest to make a flat one : 50% fatigue reduction , as this way all sansha ships could move at similar speed.

QA:

Q: Will this not be abused by large groups to move pilots using jump bridges and titans?
A: I think not, T2 haulers / bombers / t1 indy ships will still be more viable , and allow for faster movement.

Q: Will this not create unbeatable fleets jumping fast around jump bridge networks ?
A: No, as there is no sansha based logi ship. So wherever this ships will go , logistic ships will be to slow to follow.

Q: Why Sansha?
A: Because they have awesome spiky ships, that are the most useless ones in terms of PVP.
They don't warp fast , don't have bonus to webs, neuts, cannot fit covert cloak , or are not totally OP like mordus ships.
From lore perspective , sansha have long standing operations in WH space , and assimilated so many bright minds .....

Q: Sansha have faction super carrier, will this bonus will not unbalance this ship?
A : This is the tricky part. Plan is only for subcapitals, yet granting the same ability to revenant can be deadly for this ships.
They will allow faster movement , allow to hotdrop targets at longer ranges, but at the same time make them very exposed.
Revenants will be perfect solo capital hunting ships, but this will also make revenant lose mails more often.


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Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2 - 2015-07-10 13:03:04 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:

From lore perspective , sansha have long standing operations in WH space , and assimilated so many bright minds .....





Don't **** around with jump fatigue and instead, work on what you just mentioned. Make them for example and a modifier to their effective mass when jumping a WH.
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#3 - 2015-07-10 13:30:36 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Don't **** around with jump fatigue and instead, work on what you just mentioned. Make them for example and a modifier to their effective mass when jumping a WH.

This ^^^^

Just another I hate jump fatigue it needs to go away post thinly disguised.
If Sanahs's ships are under represented in PvP perhaps that is intended, the right ship for the right job, not all ships are good for every purpose in game and all that kind of comments.
Anthar Thebess
#4 - 2015-07-10 14:25:19 UTC
I don't think that CCP goal was to make Sansha ships useless in PVP , well player actually did this as people use cruiser hulls differently , and AB based cruiser fits, don't fall even near to laser boats.

This will not change , as ab laser boats are useless tbh :D

Why Jump Fatigue - as this might make those ships appealing to someone , it will not brake the balance , as logistic ships will be main issue.
Putting % percentage on jump fatigue than indy ship have blocks those ships from escort role .

I really want to see those "spiked bastards" used in something other than nightmares in the incursion sites.

Sansha ships where bad before big rebalance of faction ships, and are bad after this change.
In current form they will never be used , as they cannot compete most of the navy cruisers , and some T1 cruisers , while having bigger price tag.

In terms of laser boats sister cruiser outmatches them few times , not even mentioning the mordus hull.

Those ships need some role , even niche one that they can be good in small scale gang.
Yes Cynabal don't have one , but it warp fast , so cynabal group will always be viable as moving fast between the systems will be always very important.

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Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2015-07-10 14:26:51 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
When you compare Sansha ships to any other you will notice one important thing.
They are bad for PVP.
AB bonus is useless in today's battlefield, and this will not change any time soon.

Proposal like you see is simple - sansha ships get additional bonus , jump fatigue reduction.
This will not affect their pvp quality on the field, but may prove tempting to use by some of the groups.

This bonus can vary depending on class , but i suggest to make a flat one : 50% fatigue reduction , as this way all sansha ships could move at similar speed.

QA:

Q: Will this not be abused by large groups to move pilots using jump bridges and titans?
A: I think not, T2 haulers / bombers / t1 indy ships will still be more viable , and allow for faster movement.

Q: Will this not create unbeatable fleets jumping fast around jump bridge networks ?
A: No, as there is no sansha based logi ship. So wherever this ships will go , logistic ships will be to slow to follow.

Q: Why Sansha?
A: Because they have awesome spiky ships, that are the most useless ones in terms of PVP.
They don't warp fast , don't have bonus to webs, neuts, cannot fit covert cloak , or are not totally OP like mordus ships.
From lore perspective , sansha have long standing operations in WH space , and assimilated so many bright minds .....

Q: Sansha have faction super carrier, will this bonus will not unbalance this ship?
A : This is the tricky part. Plan is only for subcapitals, yet granting the same ability to revenant can be deadly for this ships.
They will allow faster movement , allow to hotdrop targets at longer ranges, but at the same time make them very exposed.
Revenants will be perfect solo capital hunting ships, but this will also make revenant lose mails more often.




Would be okay with that if you remove all turrets from the ship and make it an indu, than it can get 90% reduction.

But really why? Do you really think that players would hunt solo in a rev ? Really ?

A simple no from me.

-1
FireFrenzy
Cynosural Samurai
#6 - 2015-07-10 20:35:04 UTC
Working as intended....

And I've seen Nightmare Fleet, and the smaller ones are well liked solo/smallgang boats
Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2015-07-10 21:02:49 UTC
Lorewise I support this, as Sansha ships are supposed to be based on advanced technology that allows them to generate their own wormholes.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#8 - 2015-07-10 23:46:46 UTC
Maybe it's just Chessur and I but I think that the True Sansha ships have never been in a better state than after the Apocryha nerf.

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Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#9 - 2015-07-11 00:48:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Samillian
Where does this idea come from that Sansha ships are bad in PvP? I often see Succubus and Phantasms used as very effective solo ships, just because a hull isn't useful on a Null battlefield doesn't mean it is useless in PvP just that it isn't suited for that PvP role.

This may come as a surprise to you OP but there is a lot more to EvE and PvP in EvE than just Null.

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FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#10 - 2015-07-11 03:52:03 UTC
I see Phantasm's used fairly often as solo/small gang ships.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.