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a vote on the launcher takes it away from 'my' opinion and moves it towards a subscribers opinion. The fact that new players who have no point of reference to the 'old; icons would (should) vote for the new set, still gives me no worries about what the result of any such vote would be.

okay i'll buy the top of the range hardware, monitor etc etc. It still wouldnt work on 90% scaling and before you try arguing that point with me, I suggest you take it up with CCP who admitted that on 90% the icons are a failure.

There has been a reason why I have not been posting much on the forums lately, and one of the reasons is this:

Please stop embarrassing yourself. If you would have even bothered to look at the statistic, you would have seen a RISE in player count during summer on certain years. Your argument holds no water.

Also, I'm getting really frustrated at the frequency of your righteous-like crusade. What is your goal? You achieve nothing. Everything you say, has been said by others, and mostly debunked as well.

You are not better than Rio Bravo. There have been a lot more useful and constructive posts from people who like the changes. But at least even those admitted that there would have been a better way to go with it.

So what is your goal? Trying to prove us wrong? Then you are missing the point. You only discuss for discussion's sake and that is the worst part of it.

I can put anything you have said since your first post in the topic of the new devblog, and not only turn it against you, but debunk it. Why did I decide against it? because that is not the point. This is not a fight about who is right or who is wrong. This is not about who should play the game in which way.

Anyone can read my posts starting early in this topic. I have never said the changes are gamebreaking for me. I have never said that I cannot adapt. I will have difficulties, and still do have, but I hope in time I can adapt. So why did I comment so much? Simple:

The way CCP has been implementing and approaching this entire thing has been horrendously wrong and bad. They have been treating the issue completely backwards. And this is what it turns down to. For me, this was never about "bring back old icons."
For me it was "why did you do all this so badly?"

So this is a plea to ANYONE who is bashing their skulls together, urging for a fight:
You gain nothing by repeating the same thing over and over again. Look at my posts. I have been trying to bring a new point to the table with each post I did, and those have been a lot.
You gain nothing by sitting there and play the game of clashing opinions. Everyone of you, on either side of the table, is wasting their time.
If you think the icons are a positive change, then that's fine. But if you bash on people and ridicule them who are not fine with the change, then you are making a fool of yourself and are deliberately ignorant and narrow minded.
If you don't like the icons for whatever reason, then simply saying "I hate them" is not useful. Make effort and say why don't like them and maybe what should change. Some did, some didn't.

But to all those who valiantly defend the new icons to no other avail than to defend them, INCLUDING CCP SURGE who basically insulted a sizeable chunk of players, you are missing the point.

The biggest issue was always the implementation of the change. Not the largely ignored feedback from sisi. The lack of preparation to deliver the icons was laughable. You don't bring icons without a proper scaling algorithm or without revamping your overview. CCP saying they were not aware of how many people used 90% scaling (or any kind of scaling) is an excuse. People complained who want to play at high resolutions and look at blurry icons due to upscaling.
CCP knew how bad scaling was across the entire UI pretty much since scaling exists. The infopop in the options even points that out.

If the icons were a beta feature to opt in, then everything would have been a lot less problematic. And this is what made me throw myself so much into this matter. Not just because of the icons, but because of the continued lack of quality that CCP is bringing at an increased pace.

So, to everyone: stop smacking each other. Start to look at the real issues. There are undeniable facts which all sides often keep ignoring.

I strongly suggest to close this topic by now. We have the other devblog one up, and probably should start our own topic where the real issues are being nailed in a factual manner, to create a new, clean basis to work from.

I know your feelings are up and about. And I'm sorry for either side for feeling they have to berate the "opposition".
But you're not helping if you keep smack talking, trolling, hating, baiting and insulting each other.

Keep it civil please.

Thank God it is not

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch"
-- Benjamin Franklin

1. I don't understand your point, unless you consider than russian players are different from other countries or that there aren't playing with the same game mechanics than us. I know that it is frequent that a poll is rejected when his result isn't acceptable, but generally it is to stay blind of the situation. We often do that in France, to keep ourselves blind about the continuous rising of the extreme-right wing (1000 persons isn't enough to represent a country, yeah yeah.. our politicians are very good humorists).

2. Indeed, but that don't mean that the silent majority is happy of this change just because they are silent on the official forum. The poll is a proof of it and was exposed here to counter this argument.

3. and 5. Already answered by previous posts of players here.


I partially agree. I think that the expansions of the last semester of 2013 was the start of the decline process, and recent ones probably amplify it. If you check the newborn graph, we can see that there was a decent amount of new players at end 2013, who probably hide the decline by the new logged players it offered. Until it wasn't enough to hide it starting 02/14...

We can't say that the competitors was the problem. ED was released only at end 2014 and Star Citizen isn't released before 2016, so they can't be the reason.

[EDIT] Corrected because poorly redacted.

Dont misunderstand - the "selfcentered bitches" in my post didnt refer to the people who like or dislike some of the recent changes.
Each of those surely have their valid and personal reasons and many of them debate about the pros and cons and possible solutions/compromises in a most civilized manner in this thread.

I only refered to the thread-trolls, that flaunt their little egos regardless of the damage they bring to such necessary discussions and the cause behind it. They dont care about the game or their fellow players, as long as they can have some personal fun in instigating anger and mischief with however poor arguments or haughty attitudes.

Sadly the ISD doesnt care to shoot them - perhaps because they seem to be the last ones in this thread that still champion the "change above everything" idea .......

The rest of your points was so ..... beyond argumentation, that I´ll just give you the hint to look at the 5 year statistics before rambling about "seasonal" fluctuations - the game is about to hit a 5 year low, even during the much hyped Icarna crisis it looked healthy in comparison. And "looking at the 1 year statistics" doesnt mean there has to be a one year trend - on the contrary, it just allows you to see very clearly that the real dive begins like 6 months ago (very well accompanying some of your quoted changes).
I

Cleanse Serce and Rio Bravo are trolls. Their "traffic" has made up much of the last 10 pages of this thread....without merit. Please don't respond to them.

Lol. We like the Icons. We debated why other people don't like them. Some reasons were sound and I liked their posts, others their reasonings were spurious, inconsistant, illogical, or just plain weird. You have to stick to the issues, avoid labelling people to discredit their position. Not defending your position with fact, but with pesonal attacks can display how weak the position you've taken is...
In other words, if your argument is faulty and you can't 'win them over' with logic or facts, you have to resort to name calling, slander, etc.

As Oscar Wilde once said...'Ridicule is the tribute paid to the genius, by the mediocre.'

Obviously, because not everyone is you. Please, for the love of whatever you worship, stop assuming that because it works for you, it must therefore work exactly the same for everyone else.

Your posts are so narrow-minded it astonishes me. Maybe instead of attacking people for having problems, you maybe stop to have some consideration for people other than yourself. You're the one attacking these people, not the other way around. I'm continually seeing you blame the players who have reported valid troubles, and yet these players are coming back only to reiterate their trouble and what THEIR problems are with these icons, after you attack them.

Please do us all a favour and think what your mother would say to your posts before you put them up.

Honestly, it saddens me that the people who like the icons are the ones who seem to post the MOST negativity in this thread. By and large, the people who don't like the icons are slagging off CCP and the icons. The people who do like the icons are slagging off *the players who don't like the icons". Neither the rude comments to CCP NOR the rude comments to players having visual difficulty are at all ok. You do not help your cause, whatever it is, by insulting others.

The icons that are currently on the overview are NOT WELL DONE. They should NOT have been shipped after the feedback on Sisi. So far, that's been a common ground of agreement from all sides INCLUDING from CCP.

If those of us who have legitimate visual issues with the icons go silent because we've all quit, then CCP won't have any feedback saying what's wrong with them, so they can continue to be improved. If you like the icons, PLEASE continue to post why you like that and what makes them better -- instead of focusing your energies on people who don't like them.

I'm sorry, but Constantine, Cleanse, and Rio -- instead of being civil in your disagreements with the icon haters, you've just made yourselves and your opinions made known not only more negatively but more offensively, and that's why people's hackles are rising against you. Perhaps try civilly disagreeing instead of attacking those who disagree with you, you might find better responses.

Fair critiques.

Simple answer is, if you read back over what I said, is that I have chosen to push for fixes to the icon set in the manner I think (a) has the best chance of coming to pass and (b) I really think needs doing.

I do not serve as a speaker for ALL of you. That would presume that ALL of you agree and that all of you voted (for me or someone else) I stated in the elections that I would take input and choose what measures I would push for with CCP. I will listen to all of you but I am not some blank slate you can write all your messages onto to be passed on to the game devs.

I would point out I AM the guy here, listening to you and pretty much the only one responding. Make of that what you will.

But back to the icons.

Yes, they need to be usable to all player, all usage. Yes, I am asking for that to be fixed, soon. No I did NOT find the recent icon blog insulting but, rather, a human writing to you and most of the angry responses made me wonder how some of you last on this thing called the 'net. I am not saying htfu but try not to be one giant exposed nerve.

I saw a few people with alternate ideas but wonder if they read each others critiques as implementation of those 'five minutes in microsoft paint' ideas tend to be just as bad or, if colour coded, even worse.

Like I said. I am still trying to engage both you and CCP on this subject. But I am not the string and tin cans so you can yell at CCP through me. The good news is that I am not running for CSM XI so you have less than a year left of my useless ass and then you will have the full attention of the other CSM . . . .

good luck with that

m