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Carnyx release - General feedback

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Senarian Tyme
Serenity Rising LLC
Controlled Chaos
#1741 - 2015-06-17 03:03:06 UTC
CCP,

This is sadly a case of too little far too late. If you had responded like this initially you might have had a shot, but at this point, people have started to head out the door in disgust over yet another blatant case of CCP not caring about customer opinion. This isn't some metagame related issue either tied to the petty politics which hit a given segment of the player base, this is core game functionality that impacted everyone every time they undocked.

All four of my accounts were canceled, two have already expired and it will be a long time (if ever) before I fire everything up again.

If you really want to make amends you need to:
1. Swallow your pride (reinsert after each following step)
2. Admit the idea was well intended but horribly implemented.
3. Admit you were wrong to ignore test server feedback.
4. Admit you were wrong to force a knowingly broken (ie defective) product onto paying customers.
5. Admit you were wrong to ignore feedback after the release.
6. Admit you were wrong to be so slow in any form of response even after you finally realized there was an issue.
7. Admit you are wrong to try to continue to force us down this path with a long and drawn out incremental minor fix and twitch approach.
8. And to prove you are sincere: Refund players for the broken time they got tricked into funding for your failed and knowingly broken beta test (i.e. the # of days from the time accounts were canceled until the accounts finally expired. or at the very least give them that many days back onto their accounts after you eventually fix this issue.)

I will check in a few more times (but will be unable to post) to see what the almighty Dev Blog has to say. Suffice to say that if that doesn't have a proper fix action identified I will not bother checking in anymore, and I will only find out about any eventual change from any friends who happen to stick around, if any do.

GL and GH everyone.
Carrie-Anne Moss
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1742 - 2015-06-17 03:05:11 UTC
As much as i hste hate HATE the new icons,

Ima gona say they have been and will continue to be worth it.
Worth what?

Seeing ccp so totally fail yet again.

Remember the articles on Icelanders and studies of they bwing masculine and argumentative and stubborn.
Likw durring summer of rage and greed is good?

I remember reading psychology articles and people from iceland honestly saying its a CULTURE thing. Thats just how their culture is i guess.


Its like admitting you were wrong is a punishment worth than death or anything else ever.


Somehow walking around with egg on your face and being mocked is kosher though???

Guys you goofed up, no biggie. Listen to us, learn for next time.
This can be saved, (bearly)
MavnGoose
Valkyrie.
#1743 - 2015-06-17 03:46:32 UTC
In life the biggest cause of relationship failures is one party not listening to the others needs, or willing to compromise towards their wants so everyone can be happy. When this occurs it is trrribly sad as the other person is left to either A) end that relationship, deal with the pain and look to build a healthy relationship with someone else or B) continue to perservere putting up with the pain exertion and frustration of dealing with expectations not met.

Im sorry CCP but yourr not listening to our needs or willing to compromise towards our wants (option for either set of icons durrrr). So in that light this relationship is no longer healthy, I can see nothing but pain and frustration with little reward in our future. I must end this relationship and move on, I deserve better and I don't feel you love me anymore, you just love the idea of us. I hope with time, you can forgive me for leaving and we can just remember the good times we shared.

I wont forget you,

Mavn.

P.S Star Citizen Im free this friday wanna come over and watch netflix?
Jeven HouseBenyo
Vanity Thy Name Is
#1744 - 2015-06-17 03:49:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeven HouseBenyo
-Segment removed, since it's point was made.-

+=+=+=+

Now back to actual constructive commenting.

If it's such a massive deal to roll them back, then just put an option to use the old icons. That is already in place for the Map. Come on, split the difference, let the spreadsheet numbers from that point give your Honest feedback in their uses, and work from there. That way those of the 'old guard icons' have their toys, those of the 'shiny new icons' can keep them and be happy. Furious posting falls off, suggestions become less rage and more constructive, you stand a chance of getting back some of those already un-subbed and those about to become inactive accounts.

With this kind of irritation already in place, do you Really want to push through all of the Sov changes when there's so much at the basic level still in need of help? Like that Beta Map, the Notification Tab that's still buggy, the Launcher that is unreliable, etc.?

As I have stated, I don't want to leave. But I won't subject myself to physical pain (thin costly lenses in the glasses only go so far) for A Game.

Please CCP, just give the frikken option to choose which set we can use, and save the larger trouble coming down the pipe if this is the attitude you plan to take until another Summer of Rage and Incarna 2.0 explodes in your faces. There's probably a bit of a culture difference from here in the States to life on Iceland. Sorry, that won't fly at this point of the threadnaught. Everyone has Kender Oops! in their ideas. This is one of them. The only harm and foul is your unwillingness to admit to it and give us, your customers, that choice on icons.

>Jeven

Minny boat flyer, unofficial squeaky wheel.

'Game Ethics and Morality Monitor' I remember promises.

Snark at 11-24/7/365.25. Overshare? Yup.

Yes it's my fault. And if you don't staap it I'll do it again. ;-P

No you can't has my stuffs OR my SPs.
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1745 - 2015-06-17 04:23:36 UTC
Just a quick note to observe that the new icons are as painful as they were initially.

Between this, the neocon and the map.. I don't know which is worse =/
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1746 - 2015-06-17 04:40:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Rio Bravo
You guys tear up like this in game too? I like what they did...I don't see fail, I just hear whine. Easy to complain. Much cry....maybe your computers are old. No point in trying to debate/comment on this Carnyx thread any more...

-1 response poster

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
ISD Decoy
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#1747 - 2015-06-17 04:53:58 UTC
Quote:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not conductive to the community spirit that CCP promotes. As such, this kind of behavior will not be tolerated.

5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.

27. Off-topic posting is prohibited.

Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued to the off-topic poster.

I have removed a couple posts and those quoting them. Please stay on topic, refrain from inciting troll responses, and keep personal attacks out of the feedback. Thanks!

ISD Decoy

Captain

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department
Di Mulle
#1748 - 2015-06-17 09:56:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Di Mulle
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
]
Rio Bravo wrote:


I don't post for likes. I post when I see people being wierd. People unsubbing and so forth over icons is weird. The whole violin solo of 'please keep EvE wheel chair accessible', is kind of weird too. If you don't have the health to play EvE, maybe take a pottery class and leave our game alone. The 'developers' have to 'develop' the game to keep it young, fresh, and more vibrant as time goes on...maybe get a new pop bottle prescription if it helps you identify ships better. This is not a game made for the vision or comprehension impared. So when I snark, it's in defence of the people who bring us the game, against the people who treat design and dev hours like it's nothing. I am just sick of pouting, conniption birds, tantrums, and kermit flailing over icons. Thought humor might work to demonstrate the absurdity, but maybe the Adderall and Ritalin inhibits people getting the irony, idk...

I keep smiling! Big smile


You know things are bad when the fanbois have to come out to white knight CCP's obviously broken stuff


People like that one usually are not fanboys of CCP, or CocaCola, or something like that. They are fanboys of themselves.

All that rant (pretty insulting, but that is the purpose, actually) is a way to say "I am so cooool, you need to know that".
<<Insert some waste of screen space here>>
DexterShark
Trask Industries
#1749 - 2015-06-17 10:25:21 UTC  |  Edited by: DexterShark
CCP Claymore wrote:
Quote:

are you going to reinstate the old icons, even if only as a temporary measure?


The simple answer at the moment is no.

Without going into too much detail as the blog will cover it, we have ideas to simplify the current system from the feedback on this thread and discussions from the CSM.


This is weak.

I can write the Dev Blog you need for you:-

"Hello fellow capsuleers!

In the recent Carnyx release we launched a new set of overview icons which have generated a lot of feedback from the community, and we appreciate the constructive and honest nature of much of that feedback.

Having reviewed the feature now it is live, and discussed it at length with the CSM, it is clear to us on the team that the goals for these icons - clearer, more consistent and more meaningful icons that show at a glance what is in space - have not been met, and the feature has fallen short of the high standards we set for our work.

We are therefore reverting the new icons back to the original icons and looking at this again with a fresh pair of eyes.

Thanks to everyone who gave us such valuable and constructive feedback throughout this process, both on SiSi and on TQ, and we hope to be able to revisit this topic again in the future when we feel we have a stronger vision for what we want to achieve in this core aspect of the game.

Fly safe."
Natya Mebelle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1750 - 2015-06-17 10:34:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Natya Mebelle
I don't want to be in CCP's shoes right now. The push from the increased update pace that has been going on for a year now and the pull from the players is certainly not helping to make a day in the office very relaxed. I could very well understand they feel like "whatever we do, it is wrong, so why bother." It could also very well be that all decisions are being blamed back on the development team by the management, when said management has been disregarding the complaints from the players and developer teams alike. So what should we do here? Is there a solution for the future?

If I look into the gaming industry, and if I listen to what other people say who are more experienced and knowledgeable than I am, it seems that many companies have become blind to the power of the customer, and follow arbitrary trends and statistics more than what their community does. Every game that tries to chain their players to them is failing in the long run. It seems to me that many developers in the industry are still stuck in the "a consumer can only play one game" mentality.
But this is wrong. There are people enjoying to play multiple games, and are discouraged to continue playing a game which pushes out more changes, updates and events than they can or want to keep up with. An example of this was Guild Wars 2 when they started with the living story updates. They lost a lot of players due to not being able to keep these events replayable for those who could not keep up with it.
Gaming today is so popular, that the most income a company gets is usually from those "casual" players. Those who log in just for an evening or so. Not usually those who spend a majority of their day inside the game. "Casuals" are not bad players. In fact, I've seen many "Casual" players who blow all those 24/7 ones out of the water without much effort. I fail to see how "Casual" was ever related to "Bad". It only means "Not often online".

The "one game per customer" mentality is ESPECIALLY wrong for Eve online, where there are people who log into the game only to chat while playing other games.
I would not be surprised if the concurrent player counter drops significantly if CCP integrates chat into evegate or to a third party program like Pidgin.

So what CAN we do together, CCP?

Narrow down the gap between developers and players. Be more inclusive of your playerbase and not treat them like uneducated defects. Integrate an ingame feedback tool. Integrate game-wide surveys which can be DELAYED and being answered later. If you force them at "right now, or never" you will disgruntle people again. This is the ONLY way to get sufficient information out of your playerbase. The ones who play your game. The ones who pay your bills.
Include resourceful and bright players for helping you shape the game to a better world by giving them rewards for their high quality work. This works wonders in other companies.

Do something about your CSM. They are not only NOT accessible in the game, but their contributions and activity seems to go unnoticed. So what are they good for? What difference do they make? What parts of the game do they represent again? Aren't they the spokespersons and pillars of community that I would go to if I have a serious concern about a certain thing? I honestly cannot tell.

Sit down and have a talk with the bad apples in your company who are on an ego-trip. Special snowflakes who cannot accept their work and effort being not good enough need to get a reality check. I do not ask to fire anyone, I ask that people get a grip. Developers and Management alike. But this also includes the players too. There have been pretty nasty thing said to CCP which were totally uncalled for. Being factual and pointing out issues is enough. Adding insults does not make these statements any better.

Most of CCP's intentions for the direction of the game are really good which makes it really painful to see when they take a totally backwards approach. I know you love Eve, and we love Eve too.

Here is a thing though:
Eve started out with trailblazing success because it was a good game. As it's popularity grew, it became a lot more obvious how CCP had to develop content FOR the players and change entire aspects of the game BECAUSE it was growing so big.

Without those wonderful players who shaped the world so often, there is no Eve any more.
So who do you want to develop for? The players. This includes you. You are players too. But not everything a player wants to see is going to work.

Get closer with your players. It's getting dark.


And now to get something else off my chest:
Rio Bravo wrote:
People unsubbing and so forth over icons is weird. The whole violin solo of 'please keep EvE wheel chair accessible', is kind of weird too. If you don't have the health to play EvE, maybe take a pottery class and leave our game alone. The 'developers' have to 'develop' the game to keep it young, fresh, and more vibrant as time goes on...maybe get a new pop bottle prescription if it helps you identify ships better. This is not a game made for the vision or comprehension impared.
This is the most disgustingly arrogant, insulting and narrowminded post I have seen in years. I wonder why this has not been pruned by ISD Decoy.

I will not quote you the people who are not vision impaired and not "old" and still have problems with the icons for obvious reasons. You do a good job ignoring that because you do not want to see it. It is boggling my mind how you can disregard so much fact based feedback.

Dear Rio Bravo, if you do not understand other people's reasons by reading this topic and refuse to ask the right questions, then it seems very obvious in how isolated you must be living in your Youniverse. I feel sorry for you.

... I wish there were spoiler tags in the forum.
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1751 - 2015-06-17 11:18:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Rio Bravo
Went and cried in the shower after my last post, my space family said things that hurt me. I just don't like when people try persuade people to keep EvE the same as it was in 2006, just cuz it suits them...I don't want CCP to only get the extreme forum bullies posting their suggestions. Carnyx was needed, the icons ARE great. Look forward to full NEW sov system, the NEW Gallente Tac Destroyer, NEW Rorqual dynamics, NEW ore distribution and utilization, and a host of other things that CCP has promised...You might not get them when you want them, but if they decided they were a positive thing at the round table, they will be implemented at the time they think best. The launcher has had some problems, they are smoothing them out. Yes, I am a fan boi, because I like what they have created, that's why I subscribe. Positive feedback is also feedback!

Roll

EDIT: Still haven't been into an unknown WH...

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
DemetRYS
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1752 - 2015-06-17 11:57:26 UTC  |  Edited by: DemetRYS
Rio Bravo wrote:
Carnyx was needed, the icons ARE great.


I am glad you like them, now would you mind explaining why they should be forced on the rest of us who don't?

The solution is simple: CCP just needs to allow us to opt out of the new icons and use the old ones. Then you can keep the new ones and we can keep the old ones. Unfortunately CCP has nothing but contempt for the wishes of its paying customers and we are forced to use the new ones or just not play.

For heaven's sake, its 2015, why can't a PC game support multiple icon sets, its not like they are difficult to implement. By modern standards we should have the option of loading and mapping our own custom icons. CCP take note, you want to impress us with icons, let us use our own and then nobody has a reason to complain.

Edit: Formal feature suggestion to CCP: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5826293#post5826293
Would appreciate comments, suggestions and support as this may be a viable solution.
Natya Mebelle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1753 - 2015-06-17 12:20:03 UTC
So I cut out all things that are not relevant or useful and this is what is left to comment on for a healthy discussion. Now your post looks more like something that could be talked about.

Rio Bravo wrote:
1) I don't want CCP to only get the extreme forum bullies posting their suggestions.

2) If they decided they were a positive thing at the round table, they will be implemented at the time they think best.

3) The launcher has had some problems, they are smoothing them out.

4) Yes, I am a fan boi, because I like what they have created, that's why I subscribe.

5) Positive feedback is also feedback!
1) The extreme forum bullies are a vast minority, if even present, in this topic. Or rather, let me rephrase that: There are more people trying to bully and naysay the people who bring well reasoned critique than otherwise. Which includes you.

2) Good intentions are not enough to create a good product. Every company relies on feedback to improve their products. Not just the video game industry.

3) The launcher has issues since the launcher exists, this is why a good number of people bypass the launcher completely. The launcher has even more problems since Download on Demand happened.

4) Not everyone buying and liking a product is a fanboy or a fangirl. The negative association with these words comes from those people ignoring the bad things and only look at the good things. Usually they are also very rude and dismissive of anyone who does not share their collective opinion.
Many people in this topic have voiced their concerns in a very objective and reasonable fashion. Good points and good intentions have been pointed out by those very people too.
The implementation and course of action has received negative reception. For a reason.

5) Yes, positive feedback is feedback c: Nobody here challenges and beats upon positive feedback. But the attitude some people bring while trying to reason their "positive feedback" is left wanting.

I do not question if you read the topic, I give you the benefit of doubt and hope that you have. I DO question if you have comprehended what people said, how they said it, and if you were capable of understanding the concerns and problems, and I question your ability to put this critique into an objective perspective.

See? It is very easy to have a neutral exchange without resorting to baseless accusations and slandering others c:
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1754 - 2015-06-17 13:26:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Rio Bravo
6) I cry in the shower.

Viva Carnyx! The launcher will rise again!

*\o/*

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#1755 - 2015-06-17 13:47:01 UTC
Rio Bravo wrote:
Went and cried in the shower after my last post, my space family said things that hurt me. I just don't like when people try persuade people to keep EvE the same as it was in 2006, just cuz it suits them...I don't want CCP to only get the extreme forum bullies posting their suggestions. Carnyx was needed, the icons ARE great. Look forward to full NEW sov system, the NEW Gallente Tac Destroyer, NEW Rorqual dynamics, NEW ore distribution and utilization, and a host of other things that CCP has promised...You might not get them when you want them, but if they decided they were a positive thing at the round table, they will be implemented at the time they think best. The launcher has had some problems, they are smoothing them out. Yes, I am a fan boi, because I like what they have created, that's why I subscribe. Positive feedback is also feedback!

Roll

EDIT: Still haven't been into an unknown WH...

Don't know how it was in 2006, I didn't start playing until 2007, I am not and never have been averse to change that is valid and add something usable to the game.
The ONLY reason Camyx was needed is because not long ago CCP decided it was easier to release unfinished, untested things into the game every 6 weeks than take the time to fully test and implement good and valid changes less frequently. Quarterly would have been a far better option.

I am glad you let us all know, those who have been loyal to and loved Eve for many years, who have less than perfect eyesight, are not supposed to play anymore. We are not important because Eve has to change.
I agree Eve has to improve to compete in an ever growing market but is alienating parts of its existing player base really the right way to go?

I do note - You have been an avid proponent of the new icons but nowhere have you stated what you like about them. Why for you is something Devs state is not working as intended "great" ?
And what I really want you to answer - Why am I as part of a minority group, no longer allowed to play a game I love so another minority group in Eve can have pretty icons. CCP have completely disregarded a known minority group who play the game to cater (almost exclusively) to another minority group.


BTW; "the icons ARE great", is not feedback. Especially when the developers have already come out quite publicly and said they are not great, they are not working as intended and we are "trying" to fix them.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1756 - 2015-06-17 13:51:22 UTC
Would it be possible to make icons semi-transparent unless we select them or they yellow box / aggress us?

It would make it easier to see the field, and also make relevant icons/things stand out in a meaningful way.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Natya Mebelle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1757 - 2015-06-17 14:08:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Natya Mebelle
Case and proof how https://updates.eveonline.com/ is being flimsily filled with content. This one is very recent:

updates.eveonline.com wrote:
Lai Dai's famed Tech II variant of the Caldari Caracal has be reimagined with a unique hull design. The upgrade also allows the ship to take advantage of the latest shader and texture updates.
First: typo pointed out.

Second: You received negative feedback for bringing the new Caracal Hull but NOT provide the slight variations to the Cerberus hull. You also received negative feedback when you brought the Moa redesign first without adding the little details on the Onyx and Eagle. What would have been so bad to delay this a little and ship the new Cerberus hull with the Caracal hull? This would show you put quality and consistency over quantity.

I cannot believe they were BOTH not ready in time. If they were, then this is an alarming state. But it sounds more like you are putting in half-finished content in order to keep filling your patch notes just to make them look good. Another indicator of how such a huge speed increase in patch pace is negatively affecting you. People think you don't get things done in time. And we're still hoping to read more about your past ideas to give tech2 hulls more distinctions over tech1 hulls.


Sgt Ocker wrote:
And what I really want you to answer - Why am I as part of a minority group, no longer allowed to play a game I love so another minority group in Eve can have pretty icons. CCP have completely disregarded a known minority group who play the game to cater (almost exclusively) to another minority group.

BTW; "the icons ARE great", is not feedback. Especially when the developers have already come out quite publicly and said they are not great, they are not working as intended and we are "trying" to fix them.


I wouldn't say we're talking about a minority group who dislikes the icons c: Even when I just look into the game chats and completely disregard the forum. Even most people who say they like the icons admit there are flaws in their implementation.

Second one is quoted for truth :D
And I could not resist:

Natya Mebelle wrote:
I'm curious how many more posts of you will follow where you thoroughly continue to embarrass yourself? I would be placing bets but... that would be just as wasteful as placing bounties.

Rio Bravo wrote:
6) I cry in the shower.

Viva Carnyx! The launcher will rise again!

*\o/*
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#1758 - 2015-06-17 14:46:36 UTC
Natya Mebelle wrote:
Case and proof how https://updates.eveonline.com/ is being flimsily filled with content. This one is very recent:

updates.eveonline.com wrote:
Lai Dai's famed Tech II variant of the Caldari Caracal has be reimagined with a unique hull design. The upgrade also allows the ship to take advantage of the latest shader and texture updates.
First: typo pointed out.

Second: You received negative feedback for bringing the new Caracal Hull but NOT provide the slight variations to the Cerberus hull. You also received negative feedback when you brought the Moa redesign first without adding the little details on the Onyx and Eagle. What would have been so bad to delay this a little and ship the new Cerberus hull with the Caracal hull? This would show you put quality and consistency over quantity.

I cannot believe they were BOTH not ready in time. If they were, then this is an alarming state. But it sounds more like you are putting in half-finished content in order to keep filling your patch notes just to make them look good. Another indicator of how such a huge speed increase in patch pace is negatively affecting you. People think you don't get things done in time. And we're still hoping to read more about your past ideas to give tech2 hulls more distinctions over tech1 hulls.


Sgt Ocker wrote:
And what I really want you to answer - Why am I as part of a minority group, no longer allowed to play a game I love so another minority group in Eve can have pretty icons. CCP have completely disregarded a known minority group who play the game to cater (almost exclusively) to another minority group.

BTW; "the icons ARE great", is not feedback. Especially when the developers have already come out quite publicly and said they are not great, they are not working as intended and we are "trying" to fix them.


I wouldn't say we're talking about a minority group who dislikes the icons c: Even when I just look into the game chats and completely disregard the forum. Even most people who say they like the icons admit there are flaws in their implementation.

Second one is quoted for truth :D
And I could not resist:

Natya Mebelle wrote:
I'm curious how many more posts of you will follow where you thoroughly continue to embarrass yourself? I would be placing bets but... that would be just as wasteful as placing bounties.

Rio Bravo wrote:
6) I cry in the shower.

Viva Carnyx! The launcher will rise again!

*\o/*

For clarification - I was referring to the group (like me) with less than perfect vision. I know many others dislike these icons for very different reasons.
I really could not tell you if I like the new icons or not - They are just blurry, mostly unidentifiable shapes to me.

I used to enjoy being a plus one scout, now I find I am next to useless as it takes me so long to identify targets.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Rio Bravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1759 - 2015-06-17 15:14:54 UTC
Before we had 'Big red cross, Medium red cross, and Little red cross'...and generic brackets in space, that told you nothing at all. Now we have frigs, elite frigs, cruisers, battle cruisers, battleships, industrials, capital industrials, drones, empty wrecks, full wrecks, corpses, etc, etc...Much EASIER to quickly identify ships quickly, especially with large fleets, imo. Just set type column dominant, or fool around with overview filter settings tweaked the way you want. The Icons tell you way MORE than the simple variety of 3 red crosses we used to have. Heard a suggestion that maybe a PNG rendering of icons might prevent rasterizing, could help with scaling...

That said, I don't know what monitors your using or what, on my screen they come in good resolution wise. If your having vision trouble, don't scale to 90%. Might be a hardware problem, idk, but on my 3 year old googler, all the icons are perfect for me. Perhaps its a body part hardware problem, in which case I would make a post on an optomotrists forum as well as on an EvE Online one. Maybe their service department can do something for your vision. Comprehension wise, people who are having trouble thinking about all the new red shiny things on their screens should ask their parents to get them a Maplestory or Minecraft account and play that instead.

Hope I am not hurting peoples feelings, just explaining my view of the new icons. I suggest fitting your emotions with a T2 feelings hardener for the extra resists to tank through my posts.

Viva Icons!

+1 CCP

“You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. I dig.”  - Clint Eastwood, misquote.
Natya Mebelle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1760 - 2015-06-17 15:21:48 UTC
Sgt Ocker wrote:
For clarification - I was referring to the group (like me) with less than perfect vision. I know many others dislike these icons for very different reasons.
My bad for misreading!
I still would not know how many people play Eve with bad eyesight. Maybe they are not that much of a minority group c: I mean, I don't know the chances if they are a majority of the players. But in any case, the group of eve players with less than perfect vision is for sure a significant one. A "big" enough "minority" that can not or should not be "safely disregarded" by any means c:
I would even be bold enough to say that there are less colourblind people than people with "regular" bad eyesight. That still does not make red-green colourblind people a small enough percentage to disregard.
And then we have the group of people with either smaller screens, or those who intentionally use 90% scaling even on large screens to have more space available, who still suffer from the icon issue.

Oh dear... I just wanted to say sorry for misreading, and ended up analyzing the issues with the icons involuntarily again :D It comes so natural already. But I guess this serves as a good reminder how many different reasons of why the icons don't work so well COMBINED are likely to be the majority of players who show discontent for the new icons, for whatever reasons.