These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[AEGIS] Fleet Warp Changes - Please see devblog!

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1421 - 2015-06-16 19:03:54 UTC
Dermeisen wrote:

No it isn't a great point, it a foolish and myopic point - you may be surprised to find that not everyone came to the game with the same aspirations as you, whoever you are. Some people came to this game to give out hugs in signal cartel or to spend weeks gaining the trust of some dude to overturn an alliance or simple to explore the beauty that is Eve. Loads of guys will love the new scout power:

imagine you become the éminence grise, you warp all these mugs to victory or defeat, or perhaps to certain death!

Idea I've just worked out why Bat Country are so into supporting this. lol


Imposing the certainty of tedium for the possibility of emergent game play seems like a rather bad trade-off.
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1422 - 2015-06-16 19:07:39 UTC
Look at all that forumwhine. Lovely! Good idea for a number of reasons; most noticably the involvement of dedicated scouts/tacklers over the "blops your ass" approach. I take it fleetwarp to a member will still be possible, yes?

Now, if somebody could explain me once more, very slowly, why this would "break wormholes" ? People in wormholes can't hit "warp to corp location" for themselves? People don't know how to type "X" in fleet chat or profoundly dislike to listen to comms and warp their own goddamn asses?

Or is it maybe because then you'd have to be IN the corp and not just purple whist staying safely in NPC corps? I don't get the whole fuzz here-- please explain. Warp drive still working as intended, only difference being you have the additional human factor of good vs bad scout, good vs bad warp-your-own. Oh wait! I get it. The notion that the group with the better pilots might win scares you?

Lol. And +1 Fozzie.

While I'm on a roll pissing of people across the globe, can I pitch the idea of a midslot module called the "Remote Cyno Jammer"? Not *that* would really stir up the place "Oh noes! I'll unsub all my 843 accounts at once!!" LOL and LOL. But seriously guys; can CCP do anything without y'all going heads-over-heels about how this would break the game forever? Good idea is good. EvEwiki has a good article on how to engage your warpdrive. Read it.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1423 - 2015-06-16 19:14:53 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

The FC could always do what they do when no-one steps up to logi...


Absolutely. After all, a fleet only ever needs one logi, which could easily be alt-tabbed. Roll


It's easyer to fill 1 scount than 8 logi no?

Well not with whoring drones or guns in high I guess...

Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

It's ok, you will still be euphoric when the FC fleet warp you to his scout, alt or player, before resuming with the CTRL-CLICK F1 fun gameplay.


Then what's the point of making the game any more tedious for the FC and less fun for the poor scout who's now relegated to being a mobile bookmark?


How about you think of your FC and realize he probably does not find it fun to scan everything by himself, provide the warp ins by himself and then direct the fleet all by himself? Is your lazy attitude of not being willing to work for the fleet to work supposed to be a god given right that nobody will ever remove from you?

The reason FC might overload from a change like this is because there are too many lazy people in fleet would would be happy if they could farm KM while afk. When FC start quitting because nobody steps up to support them and just step down themselves and decide to just be F1 grunt, then maybe people will realise they should of stepped up just a little bit once in a while to do the "hard and boring" job of enabling all your friends to have a fight.

The "enablers" in this game do all the work and as soon as some MIGHT get offloaded to the rest of the fleet, it's all tears and rage because the god given right of the lazy leeches might be somewhat reduced...

Shakespeare could not write a bigger tragedy...
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1424 - 2015-06-16 19:38:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Awkward Pi Duolus
Frostys Virpio wrote:


How about you think of your FC and realize he probably does not find it fun to scan everything by himself, provide the warp ins by himself and then direct the fleet all by himself? Is your lazy attitude of not being willing to work for the fleet to work supposed to be a god given right that nobody will ever remove from you?

The reason FC might overload from a change like this is because there are too many lazy people in fleet would would be happy if they could farm KM while afk. When FC start quitting because nobody steps up to support them and just step down themselves and decide to just be F1 grunt, then maybe people will realise they should of stepped up just a little bit once in a while to do the "hard and boring" job of enabling all your friends to have a fight.

The "enablers" in this game do all the work and as soon as some MIGHT get offloaded to the rest of the fleet, it's all tears and rage because the god given right of the lazy leeches might be somewhat reduced...

Shakespeare could not write a bigger tragedy...


I share your indignation, my friend. If my arguments make me seem like a F1-monkey, then lemme correct that saying I fly inties, sabres, SBs and logi - those with specific roles. I couldn't care less about KMs at this point.

BUT! Fleet is full of people trying to get whom into specialized roles is like pulling teeth. A game mechanic change will not entice them to do anything. It will simply mean more work for those that care.

I wouldn't call it a tragedy though, and much less a Shakespearean one at that - people are entitled to their gameplay styles, and I wouldn't presume to dictate their choices. I certainly wouldn't want to make it any more tedious than it already is.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1425 - 2015-06-16 19:41:16 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:


How about you think of your FC and realize he probably does not find it fun to scan everything by himself, provide the warp ins by himself and then direct the fleet all by himself? Is your lazy attitude of not being willing to work for the fleet to work supposed to be a god given right that nobody will ever remove from you?

The reason FC might overload from a change like this is because there are too many lazy people in fleet would would be happy if they could farm KM while afk. When FC start quitting because nobody steps up to support them and just step down themselves and decide to just be F1 grunt, then maybe people will realise they should of stepped up just a little bit once in a while to do the "hard and boring" job of enabling all your friends to have a fight.

The "enablers" in this game do all the work and as soon as some MIGHT get offloaded to the rest of the fleet, it's all tears and rage because the god given right of the lazy leeches might be somewhat reduced...

Shakespeare could not write a bigger tragedy...


I share your indignation, my friend. If my arguments make me seem like a F1-monkey, then lemme correct that saying I fly inties, sabres, SBs and logi - those with specific roles. I couldn't care less about KMs at this point.

BUT! Fleet is full of people trying to get whom into specialized roles is like pulling teeth. A game mechanic change will not entice them to do anything. It will simply mean more work for those that care.

I wouldn't call it a tragedy though, and much less a Shakespearean one at that - people are entitled to their gameplay styles, and I wouldn't presume to dictate their choices. I certainly wouldn't want to make it any more tedious than it already is.


So you are some kind of "defender of the dead weight"?
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1426 - 2015-06-16 19:53:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Awkward Pi Duolus
Frostys Virpio wrote:
So you are some kind of "defender of the dead weight"?


More like, defender of folks who don't want to play this game like it's their second job.

I would not call them dead weight at all. Inactive characters are dead weight. People who PvE all day in null are dead weight. People who wh*re with a logi gun instead of repping are dead weight. Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.

Casual players who just wanna have some fun and make up many, if not most, of the gamers in Eve - not dead weight.

Tying it to the proposed changes, there is nothing there that would force these folks to be the "I was there" guy. There is also nothing in game now that prevents those who wanna be the "I was there" guy, be that guy.

That is what makes this such a vacuous game mechanic change.
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1427 - 2015-06-16 20:00:59 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Look at all that forumwhine. Lovely! Good idea for a number of reasons; most noticably the involvement of dedicated scouts/tacklers over the "blops your ass" approach. I take it fleetwarp to a member will still be possible, yes?

Now, if somebody could explain me once more, very slowly, why this would "break wormholes" ? People in wormholes can't hit "warp to corp location" for themselves? People don't know how to type "X" in fleet chat or profoundly dislike to listen to comms and warp their own goddamn asses?

Or is it maybe because then you'd have to be IN the corp and not just purple whist staying safely in NPC corps? I don't get the whole fuzz here-- please explain. Warp drive still working as intended, only difference being you have the additional human factor of good vs bad scout, good vs bad warp-your-own. Oh wait! I get it. The notion that the group with the better pilots might win scares you?

Lol. And +1 Fozzie.

While I'm on a roll pissing of people across the globe, can I pitch the idea of a midslot module called the "Remote Cyno Jammer"? Not *that* would really stir up the place "Oh noes! I'll unsub all my 843 accounts at once!!" LOL and LOL. But seriously guys; can CCP do anything without y'all going heads-over-heels about how this would break the game forever? Good idea is good. EvEwiki has a good article on how to engage your warpdrive. Read it.


Your post brought a smile to my face :)

Even in a thread with this much emotion and misunderstanding, debate and righteous indignation, constructive criticisms and knee-jerk reactions, your words stand out like a blinding beacon of ignorance.

Dude points out EveWiki.. read the damn 72 pages you lazy muppet Roll
joecuster
Anime Masters
#1428 - 2015-06-16 20:15:08 UTC
This is the best patch ever.
Death to NPSI cancer
Death to f1 monkeys

This game was starting to get too carebear friendly and now people might actually learn how to play the game xaxaxaxaxaxa
Fozzie take all my money. Best day of my life
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#1429 - 2015-06-16 20:20:33 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.
Says the NPC forum alt.
Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
#1430 - 2015-06-16 20:27:07 UTC
joecuster wrote:
Death to NPSI cancer

Whelp, time to buy stock in popcorn companies and Kleenex.

For the Newbies: The 8 Golden Rules - The Magic 14 Skills - Finding the Right Corp - EVE University Wiki
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1431 - 2015-06-16 20:45:00 UTC
Rowells wrote:
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.
Says the NPC forum alt.


THough it was targetted at me then I remembered I participated on 2 kills last week.

OP success
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1432 - 2015-06-16 20:51:26 UTC
Rowells wrote:
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.
Says the NPC forum alt.


Precisely why this toon is in an NPC corp ;)
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1433 - 2015-06-16 20:58:38 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
So you are some kind of "defender of the dead weight"?


More like, defender of folks who don't want to play this game like it's their second job.

I would not call them dead weight at all. Inactive characters are dead weight. People who PvE all day in null are dead weight. People who wh*re with a logi gun instead of repping are dead weight. Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.

Casual players who just wanna have some fun and make up many, if not most, of the gamers in Eve - not dead weight.

Tying it to the proposed changes, there is nothing there that would force these folks to be the "I was there" guy. There is also nothing in game now that prevents those who wanna be the "I was there" guy, be that guy.

That is what makes this such a vacuous game mechanic change.


Your "not dead weight" crowd will still get their fleet warp at the end of the day so their gameplay is not affected. The FC will be able to deal with it as long as his group is willing to train people into the required roles. If they are not willing, I guess they will get defeated by the side who does...
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1434 - 2015-06-16 21:08:53 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Your "not dead weight" crowd will still get their fleet warp at the end of the day so their gameplay is not affected. The FC will be able to deal with it as long as his group is willing to train people into the required roles. If they are not willing, I guess they will get defeated by the side who does...


So.. given that FCs are currently willing to train new scouts anyway, what's the point of this change then?
Jenshae Chiroptera
#1435 - 2015-06-16 21:14:57 UTC
Anger.
Denial.
Attempts to compromise.
Acceptance.

CCP thinks that everyone will get over it and move on to "the next thing to whine about" because all of it is just "people not liking change"

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1436 - 2015-06-16 21:18:17 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Your "not dead weight" crowd will still get their fleet warp at the end of the day so their gameplay is not affected. The FC will be able to deal with it as long as his group is willing to train people into the required roles. If they are not willing, I guess they will get defeated by the side who does...


So.. given that FCs are currently willing to train new scouts anyway, what's the point of this change then?


To stop the FC ship from being the scout in a battle.
joecuster
Anime Masters
#1437 - 2015-06-16 21:21:36 UTC
TIL not having a basic understanding of simple game mechanics = casual
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1438 - 2015-06-16 21:25:34 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
To stop the FC ship from being the scout in a battle.


We covered this red herring already here and here.
Masao Kurata
Perkone
Caldari State
#1439 - 2015-06-16 21:27:09 UTC
So are CCP going to respond to ANY of this, are they posting on reddit instead, tweeting or just ignoring all the legitimate issues with this godawful change?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1440 - 2015-06-16 21:27:14 UTC
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
To stop the FC ship from being the scout in a battle.


We covered this red herring already here and here.


All you did earlier on is show you have no idea how our fleets work.