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[AEGIS] Fleet Warp Changes - Please see devblog!

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afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1061 - 2015-06-13 12:50:10 UTC  |  Edited by: afkalt
baltec1 wrote:
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Miner Hottie wrote:
kraken11 jensen wrote:
who wanted fleet warp to get removed? (or reduced possibility) someone in csm was pushing for it? or? im not totally sure about this.


One Manfred Sideous of Pandemic Legion, CSM rep and if you want tin foil, CCP Larriakn is formerly Bam Stroker, of Van Demons Demise, a member corp of Pandemic Legion.


It's almost as if currently people are working on mechanics they are familiar with, or have *abused* themselves in the past and see why eve be better off without it. Some rough edges still though.


Which would explain why the GSF reps are also pushing for this. Infact, most of the people who use these mechanics in a big way seem to be fans of the change, the ones who are kicking up a fuss are no name NPC alts and bad pilots who cant think for themselves, terrified at the thought of actually having to play EVE when they play EVE.


And wormholers, since there's more to eve than nullsec and bombs - something oft forgotten

But hey, the WH CSM argued hard, right? They are not happy with the changes so are revisiting them. That's why the OP was posted as such that other over-affected areas were still being looked at. Or not, only after the tyre smoke of the uturn cleared, did that become clear: making it obvious it hadn't been given a second thought much less a care in the world.

Amusingly, no-one is really complaining about the impact in fights, it's about everything else that is crap with it. The scorched earth around what could be and should be a surgical fix.

But I suppose those guys warping alts to missions or gas sites were a demon to be crushed too, right? Lol

Letting people warp to corp BMs would alleviate almost all of this (barring mixed corp fleets, but that's just another advantage to being in the same corp. Alliances need fixed).
S'ombra
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1062 - 2015-06-13 12:51:52 UTC
Just saying that you are hurting WH in an unintended way , but this will get trough either way so ...
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
Insidious.
#1063 - 2015-06-13 12:54:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
baltec1 wrote:
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Miner Hottie wrote:
kraken11 jensen wrote:
who wanted fleet warp to get removed? (or reduced possibility) someone in csm was pushing for it? or? im not totally sure about this.


One Manfred Sideous of Pandemic Legion, CSM rep and if you want tin foil, CCP Larriakn is formerly Bam Stroker, of Van Demons Demise, a member corp of Pandemic Legion.


It's almost as if currently people are working on mechanics they are familiar with, or have *abused* themselves in the past and see why eve be better off without it. Some rough edges still though.


Which would explain why the GSF reps are also pushing for this. Infact, most of the people who use these mechanics in a big way seem to be fans of the change, the ones who are kicking up a fuss are no name NPC alts and bad pilots who cant think for themselves, terrified at the thought of actually having to play EVE when they play EVE.


I'm sure a bunch of never-log-in metagamers are a fan of a change they'll hardly ever have to experience, let's never mind the opinions of those who you know, actually undock every day and fly spaceships...
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1064 - 2015-06-13 13:00:57 UTC
afkalt wrote:


And wormholers, since there's more to eve than nullsec and bombs - something oft forgotten

But hey, the WH CSM argued hard, right? They are not happy with the changes so are revisiting them. That's why the OP was posted as such that other over-affected areas were still being looked at. Or not, only after the tyre smoke of the uturn cleared, did that become clear: making it obvious it hadn't been given a second thought much less a care in the world.

Amusingly, no-one is really complaining about the impact in fights, it's about everything else that is crap with it. The scorched earth around what could be and should be a surgical fix.

But I suppose those guys warping alts to missions or gas sites were a demon to be crushed too, right? Lol

Letting people warp to corp BMs would alleviate almost all of this (barring mixed corp fleets, but that's just another advantage to being in the same corp. Alliances need fixed).


Allowing them to warp to corp bookmarks means nothing changes.

We got along just fine before we had this command for fleets, back when probing took much longer to do. This isn't the doomsday you lot are getting into a flap about. Every single insurmountable problem brought up so far has been solved with just having a scout/warping someone there first.
knobber Jobbler
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1065 - 2015-06-13 13:03:47 UTC
SilentAsTheGrave wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Lurifax wrote:
Slippery pete's online


Slippery Pete's die to literally any other sniper with the same range. Their whole thing is that they have no tank, and don't need it.

"But, but those sniping ships all die to all those bombers... Wait. Because it will no longer be easy mode for bombers, it means battleships and battlecruisers will have a place on the battlefield now. Damn it. My entire argument is crumbling around me. Curses!"


Bomber is still on easy mode as they no longer decloak each other.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1066 - 2015-06-13 13:14:09 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
afkalt wrote:


And wormholers, since there's more to eve than nullsec and bombs - something oft forgotten

But hey, the WH CSM argued hard, right? They are not happy with the changes so are revisiting them. That's why the OP was posted as such that other over-affected areas were still being looked at. Or not, only after the tyre smoke of the uturn cleared, did that become clear: making it obvious it hadn't been given a second thought much less a care in the world.

Amusingly, no-one is really complaining about the impact in fights, it's about everything else that is crap with it. The scorched earth around what could be and should be a surgical fix.

But I suppose those guys warping alts to missions or gas sites were a demon to be crushed too, right? Lol

Letting people warp to corp BMs would alleviate almost all of this (barring mixed corp fleets, but that's just another advantage to being in the same corp. Alliances need fixed).


Allowing them to warp to corp bookmarks means nothing changes.

We got along just fine before we had this command for fleets, back when probing took much longer to do. This isn't the doomsday you lot are getting into a flap about. Every single insurmountable problem brought up so far has been solved with just having a scout/warping someone there first.



Except the extensive propagation lag.

If a corp BM remains valid by the time it propagates in a a fight, the enemy is bad and deserve everything they're going to get.

No-one said insurmountable (except OGB), people are saying bad for quality of life out of fights, indisputably crap for WH dwellers - collateral damage.

People are unhappy because the intended impact has far too much collaterl damage which is utterly apparent that they have given not a single iota of thought to. It's an exceedingly poor way to act.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1067 - 2015-06-13 13:16:21 UTC
afkalt wrote:



Except the extensive propagation lag.


No more so than now.
afkalt wrote:

If a corp BM remains valid by the time it propagates in a a fight, the enemy is bad and deserve everything they're going to get.

No-one said insurmountable (except OGB), people are saying bad for quality of life out of fights, indisputably crap for WH dwellers - collateral damage.

People are unhappy because the intended impact has far too much collaterl damage which is utterly apparent that they have given not a single iota of thought to. It's an exceedingly poor way to act.


Again, taking a scout with you is not the end of the world.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1068 - 2015-06-13 13:17:31 UTC  |  Edited by: afkalt
Well then lets ban fleet warps to gates and stations too, should keep you happy. Scouting is easy.

And anons.

In fact everything which isn't a player and make gates need to be scanned.

Scouting is easy.
Jeanne Tivianne
#1069 - 2015-06-13 13:19:33 UTC
It is going to be a good year to start an independent scouting business.
t0Ny St4rkZ
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1070 - 2015-06-13 13:19:52 UTC
Elizabeth Seven
Nuwa Foundation
Fraternity.
#1071 - 2015-06-13 13:32:30 UTC
who make this idea need to get the **** out of CCP
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1072 - 2015-06-13 13:35:33 UTC
afkalt wrote:
Well then lets ban fleet warps to gates and stations too, should keep you happy. Scouting is easy.

And anons.

In fact everything which isn't a player and make gates need to be scanned.

Scouting is easy.


I would be quite happy to manually fly my ship in fleets given that I do this most of the time anyway.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#1073 - 2015-06-13 13:41:06 UTC
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Miner Hottie wrote:
kraken11 jensen wrote:
who wanted fleet warp to get removed? (or reduced possibility) someone in csm was pushing for it? or? im not totally sure about this.


One Manfred Sideous of Pandemic Legion, CSM rep and if you want tin foil, CCP Larriakn is formerly Bam Stroker, of Van Demons Demise, a member corp of Pandemic Legion.


It's almost as if currently people are working on mechanics they are familiar with, or have *abused* themselves in the past and see why eve be better off without it. Some rough edges still though.


Which would explain why the GSF reps are also pushing for this. Infact, most of the people who use these mechanics in a big way seem to be fans of the change, the ones who are kicking up a fuss are no name NPC alts and bad pilots who cant think for themselves, terrified at the thought of actually having to play EVE when they play EVE.


I'm sure a bunch of never-log-in metagamers are a fan of a change they'll hardly ever have to experience, let's never mind the opinions of those who you know, actually undock every day and fly spaceships...

NCDocked
Jenshae Chiroptera
#1074 - 2015-06-13 13:42:31 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
I think they are trying to force more engagements.
Instead, I believe it will make people more risk adverse.
No longer +1 scouts and risk getting caught in a system but +2 and +3 scouts front and back.

Good thing those things you entosis can be warped to directly
Who cares about that? Stage out of Low Sec or NPC Null space like NC. are doing and control moons from there.
Magic wands are a joke.
FT Diomedes wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Resa Moon wrote:
Proposed changes to fleet warp are idiotic. Eve has enough tedium as is, don't present more. Ridiculous if you feel you have to FORCE players into engaging with the game.

This is an interesting point. Changes which make people want to be engaged would surely be better. I wonder if CCP understands the appeal of blob warfare (I certainly don't but acknowledge that there must be something I'm missing).
The appeal is in winning. ....
The appeal is also helping to beat crazy odds, you find a Titan and some supers dropped on you and make them run or you help hold up paper thing ships because they are flown right and you fit your logi ships right.

There is so much that goes on in a large battle that anchoring and fleet warps help to control.

Unnecessary complexity.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Hemmo Paskiainen
#1075 - 2015-06-13 13:42:40 UTC
Gooooood change!! Welcome Sniper fleets!!

Yaaaaaayyyyy


I missed my 2007 Eagle! Real skills comes back again!!


Awesome1!!!!


Ship lockrage shouldnt be limited to 249km max. If i gimp the fitting sooooo badly, i would like to be able to lock 400km with my eagle pls?

If relativity equals time plus momentum, what equals relativity, if the momentum is minus to the time?
Airi Cho
Dark-Rising
Wrecking Machine.
#1076 - 2015-06-13 13:50:25 UTC
Miner Hottie wrote:
Seeing as I don't have much in the way of drone skills He/She/It didn't do that for me at all. But to really ram the point home for you, when did the FC ever press jump for me? Where was the 'anchor on FC at 500' command? What about the "starburst 2 prop mod cycle" drop down menu?

*crickets chirp*


There is actually a fleet command for anchoring up on the FC ... :)
Jenshae Chiroptera
#1077 - 2015-06-13 13:54:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
baltec1 wrote:
... the ones who are kicking up a fuss are no name NPC alts and bad pilots who cant think for themselves, terrified at the thought of actually having to play EVE when they play EVE.
Yes, disparage and put people down when an idea is complete stupid.
Attack them to try remove their opposition.

How can you play so long and not grasp some really simple things?

There are different ways of playing this game. There are those who love to get in with fast ships, mess about with transversals and feathering, being solo heroes.
While there are those that like to play a more strategic game, forming up a solid wall of heavy tanks and grinding down the enemies.

Tournament style, twitch reflex gaming
or
Army planning and grinding.


CCP are screwing up, they have been reducing the solo and small gang options and now they are taking away the blobs. Soon, we are all going to be forced into a mediocre mid-sized mush inbetween and half the people will constantly hate it or quit.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Miner Hottie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1078 - 2015-06-13 14:00:03 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Miner Hottie wrote:
kraken11 jensen wrote:
who wanted fleet warp to get removed? (or reduced possibility) someone in csm was pushing for it? or? im not totally sure about this.


One Manfred Sideous of Pandemic Legion, CSM rep and if you want tin foil, CCP Larriakn is formerly Bam Stroker, of Van Demons Demise, a member corp of Pandemic Legion.


It's almost as if currently people are working on mechanics they are familiar with, or have *abused* themselves in the past and see why eve be better off without it. Some rough edges still though.


Or would benefit most from it?

It's all about how hot my mining lasers get.
Miner Hottie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1079 - 2015-06-13 14:03:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Miner Hottie
Airi Cho wrote:
Miner Hottie wrote:
Seeing as I don't have much in the way of drone skills He/She/It didn't do that for me at all. But to really ram the point home for you, when did the FC ever press jump for me? Where was the 'anchor on FC at 500' command? What about the "starburst 2 prop mod cycle" drop down menu?

*crickets chirp*


There is actually a fleet command for anchoring up on the FC ... :)


Not actually a command for anchoring. Just making ships reapproach the FC and isn't highly used or very useful.

It's all about how hot my mining lasers get.
White 0rchid
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#1080 - 2015-06-13 14:19:02 UTC
So with this change, you are going to kill off NPSI public fleets (bombers bar etc) and newbro fleets (like some of the ones the uni runs).

Not exactly an ideal solution if you ask me.

I mean, don't ask me, because I don't know what the solution is, but this is not it.