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Carnyx release - General feedback

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Kione Keikira
Perkone
Caldari State
#561 - 2015-06-03 03:14:02 UTC
CCP Surge wrote:
Also to address some of the concerns voiced, our overall aim was not to change the old icons just for the sake of something new or because we thought they weren't working, but to provide better granularity and at-a-glance awareness of the objects on grid.

But change is tough and we are definitely keeping an eye on your feedback in all channels as we had been during testing on Singularity for the past while. This relatively small icons swap isn't an end-all-be-all "tough luck" change we're aiming to saddle the playerbase with.

For now a few things

  • I urge patience. There are dozens of new icons to learn, and it might take the brain a while to untangle the new "messy blob" at first. Post back in a few days and share if they've changed your game for better or worse after you've gotten a little more comfortable identifying them. We'll be keeping an eye on this post initial-reaction feedback closely.
  • Check out this image to help learn your icons: http://images.contentful.com/kvd74o0q2fjg/4Hgu1BcYAE22wgokiKeYO4/4001f1c3132cc7749d9d25ec8851798e/NewOvervieBracket-IconsImage.jpg?w=1920&fm=jpg&q=85
  • While “deconstructive feedback” is cathartic in some ways I am sure, it’s likely not going to help get your point across. We are looking for specific feedback: What specifically don't you like about the new icons? Can you share an in-game story or experience which backs up your conclusions? It's the kind of feedback that's most useful to us when making calls on these types of things.
  • We've taken seriously the calls to include a "use classic bracket icons" option. Originally we thought having two sets of icons in the client might just cause confusion and miscommunication among players, and tough learning/teaching decisions for newbros as well as vets welcoming them in. However these concerns might be overblown, especially in regards to little bracket icons. In any case its definitely a debate worth having.


Thanks for reading!


There is one problem with the current icons, the fact that they're right in the middle of the ship which means there is always something obscured. Sometimes it's not too much of a problem, but when you're trying to see which way a ship is travelling at a glance it is rather difficult when all I can see is an icon. I suggest you keep the faint 4 corners around the object / ship but offset the icon to the lower right so it doesn't obscure the actual object. Kind of a halfway point between the new icons and the old brackets. Another nice feature would to have the 4 corners expand as the ship gets closer, so nothing is ever obscured and you have a sense of distance without having to look at the overview.

Regarding the actual icons themselves rather than their placement, what happened to these?
http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/66945/1/ORVAR_1.png
They look a lot more polished and representative than the current icons which seem too simple and a little mismatched.

Master of being misunderstood.

Tyranis Marcus
Bloody Heathens
#562 - 2015-06-03 03:19:12 UTC
So there was a lot of talk elsewhere, and previously, about taking color out of the UI because we distinguish things faster by shape. (Hence, the new neocom icons, etc.) Now, we have this new set of overview icons which force us to rely on color much more. The shape distinctions between players and rats, for example, are minimal. Does this mean we should expect our best reaction times to be slower across the board when dealing with the overview in space? Not a good move. Besides, the old icons were intuitive. I didn't really have to learn them. They were basic and easy. Nothing to memorize, no learning curve, just bam. Instantly useable for a new player. Which brings up another issue. Over the past year or two we've seen a lot of changes here and there geared at making the new player learning curve less steep and more accessible, and even at making some things more streamlined for older players. Well, these new icons also work against that effort, taking things back in the new direction. Expect some frustration, and I'd bet ultimately, a lower percentage of subs from trial players. Seriously.

I'll give the new icons some time, but my first impression is that I don't like them. Maybe after some time to get used to them, I'll like them better. I do see the value in being able to distinguish between a frigate and a destroyer, for example, at a glance. We'll see.

Do not run. We are your friends.

Circumstantial Evidence
#563 - 2015-06-03 03:23:18 UTC
Dartholemus wrote:
I recommend everyone open a support ticket for icons - it's clearly a glitch.
I read this as sarcasm, but for the literal minded: Support will refer tickets back to the forums, and close them. A waste of everyone's time.


CCP Surge: 90% scaling is invaluable for maximizing vertical text info, especially the number of items in the overview list without scrolling. Although, as screen resolutions push higher toward "Quad HD," it will be used less. You must have data on player's settings. I hope you will / can pre-render a set at 90%.

I agree that supporting two systems will be a pain. FC's will have to know both icon sets, because pilots in their fleets could be using both.

Giving Color options for icons would be great.
Giving back control of UI color schemes, would also be great.

Not taking over the camera, to ram my eyes through each gate jump would also be great, but now I'm going firmly off topic. Its cool to look at the first few times, but that "wow factor" I remember from the Fanfest video presentation, wore off after the first week it was introduced. If I don't need to see space, I take all long trips on the map screen. I think the gate jump animation should be more like the in-system warp tunnel effect, that doesn't take over your camera viewpoint.

For players complaining about drone icons: its very helpful to create overview tabs / bracket profiles, so you only see them when you need to see them. In large fleet fights, drones are usually taken off overview and in-space brackets, to preserve client FPS, and cut down on screen clutter.
Spc One
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#564 - 2015-06-03 03:24:51 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
FC's will have to know both icon sets, because pilots in their fleets could be using both.

Well if FC broadcasts a target people will see it no matter what icon set is used.
Cool
Arzi Reece
Deep Inside Your Hole
#565 - 2015-06-03 03:28:10 UTC
Gabriel Ironfist wrote:
Arzi Reece wrote:
Can't Launch the game....Great


I think this is one of the most constructive comment CCP got for this Release...

On the launcher, under settings there is a " Run Repair tool" Option m8. Try that out. 99.9% it solves problems....


Repair tool doesnt work at all. It crashes my launcher. I tried downloading the new launcher and it wont download even 1 Mb.
Box That Beat
HIgh Sec Care Bears
Brothers of Tangra
#566 - 2015-06-03 03:28:51 UTC
lol rat wrecks look like roids... what a mess ....... GREAT WORK ccp make a mess for all... And thanks for the controled response of well wait and see do ur self a favor and fire the people that did this mess
Box That Beat
HIgh Sec Care Bears
Brothers of Tangra
#567 - 2015-06-03 03:30:13 UTC
Arzi Reece wrote:
Gabriel Ironfist wrote:
Arzi Reece wrote:
Can't Launch the game....Great


I think this is one of the most constructive comment CCP got for this Release...

On the launcher, under settings there is a " Run Repair tool" Option m8. Try that out. 99.9% it solves problems....


Repair tool doesnt work at all. It crashes my launcher. I tried downloading the new launcher and it wont download even 1 Mb.





Thought it was just my computer doing this.... been having problem for a week now
Proxay
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#568 - 2015-06-03 03:32:31 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
.

For players complaining about drone icons: its very helpful to create overview tabs / bracket profiles, so you only see them when you need to see them. In large fleet fights, drones are usually taken off overview and in-space brackets, to preserve client FPS, and cut down on screen clutter.


You make it sound like this is a non issue. Think about what you're advocating here:
"If you can't tell things apart at a glance, set everything on separate overview tabs and flick between them during PvP"

This is a ridiculous notion and completely apologist for the terrible design. It worked fine before, now it doesn't, we should not have to work around icons being obtuse.

Also eve PvP extends beyond fleet fights. Every fight I am in I need to see players, drones, wrecks and NPCs, at all times, without switching brackets. Bracket switching is not tenable when fighting in the smallgang meta, you'll miss something critical and die.

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RuriHoshino
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#569 - 2015-06-03 03:47:04 UTC
So CCP, like most artists, have created something that they love, but that no one can use or understand.
Kiera Oramara
Roadkill Limited
#570 - 2015-06-03 03:48:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Kiera Oramara
ok how can i get the old ones back ? This new ones is WAY to messy :(


HOTFIX them back plz
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#571 - 2015-06-03 03:49:48 UTC
CCP Surge wrote:
............

Anyone else think a custom "icon color" would be a good option to expose to aid in situational awareness?

I think all NPCs should have some color, other than white. Red is already used for hostiles. Maybe yellow for NPCs that are not hostile, but you should not attack, like CONCORD, or customs officers? Green for ones that are friendly?

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Frozen fanfiction

Tyranis Marcus
Bloody Heathens
#572 - 2015-06-03 03:51:17 UTC
Well, at least the new marauder skins are freaking cool.

Do not run. We are your friends.

Abraxcis Caine
The Forsakened Few
We Forsakened Few
#573 - 2015-06-03 03:51:30 UTC
Yay for Serp skins!!! Black is back. Thanks for listening CCP.
Souiginto
Best Kept Dunked
#574 - 2015-06-03 03:58:10 UTC
1. new Icons are terrible - old overview was perfectly fine + they look like they got created in MS Paint

I think "Deal with it but we might (probably not) consider your feedback in a couple weeks" just cements the current stance CCP takes by forcing unwanted, unnecessary changes onto the players and this is definitely not the way a company that wants to keep their paying customers should go.

2. ship thumbnails in Hangar are way too bright/overexposed

3. good job on most of the effects/shaders - some of the SKINs look really sweet now, kinda disappointed in the Aliastra one tho
Ahed Sten
#575 - 2015-06-03 03:59:51 UTC
Lots of whining going on about the new icons. Not surprised.

The old icon system had been in place for a decade. If CCP expected anything BUT vast quantities of tears following the change they're either stupid or naive, and they're neither stupid nor naive.

Calm down and take a breather. You will get used to the new icons with time.
Joana Allier
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#576 - 2015-06-03 04:00:37 UTC
CCP, I appreciate the effort, very nice stuff, but, please for the love of god, don't give us some 1900's pixel-ed icons... this is a space ship game, futuristic.... and yet we get this pixel-ed crap that looks like it was made in 1998 version of paint. I like all of the rest of the game changes, (WOOT for ceptor burning 30 jumps just to chase off a wh gang entosesing one of our stations). but please, please give us some icons that looks sorta futuristic.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#577 - 2015-06-03 04:01:38 UTC
CCP Surge wrote:
I'm also curious to hear more from, and maybe wasn't aware of how many users played with a 90% downscaled UI (as opposed to scaling up for accessibility reasons.) What are your reasons for doing so?

To cram everything I need on the screen.

The EVE UI has always been huge. You need space for the overview with all the required columns for PvP, you need to find a place for the fleet window, drones window, locked targets, HUD, chat windows, local, notification widget, cargo (for boosters etc) and after all that you still want to be able to see a decent amount of the space scene.

Now I use a 6 screen setup, so I do have the option of spanning EVE across multiple screens, but that means sacrificing the option to run as many visible clients... and I don't think it should be necessary to have two screens per client just to get a good EVE UI.

The only good option I have found is to play in 90% UI scaling. I activated that feature when it was first introduced, cried hallelujah, then didn't look back...

...until someone decided to make the overview terrible at 90% UI scaling because of reasons.
Skye McDonald
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#578 - 2015-06-03 04:15:22 UTC
Well done CCP! You have managed to take a huge step backwards with your "new and improved" overview icons. I really do not understand your logic for the change. Extremely disappointing! A few pluses and a gigantic minus. Time for a Hotfix for the icons.
Heavy Hauler
Blueprint Haus
Blades of Grass
#579 - 2015-06-03 04:18:29 UTC
CCP Surge wrote:
What specifically don't you like about the new icons?

Very simple:
I scout and look at a fleet gate camping with drones out.
All i sees is a huge ball of very similar icons because drones are especially at high resolutions or on laptops very hard do differentiate from ships.

What would help from my point of view is when drones look very different from ships. The other icons are ok for me.
Nick Xander
NX Industry Technologies
#580 - 2015-06-03 04:21:23 UTC
Would give my first impression if I could get past Login Complete, processing bulk data.....several re-logs and a reboot of the PC and 2 hours later still can't get in.....

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