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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Proposed Changes Empire Space and some supporting changes

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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#141 - 2015-04-28 12:27:29 UTC
Why would I shoot at people who want to be shot at? They aren't the people who need to be shot, they already know that shooting is good.

The only way people will learn that they like being shot at to begin with is for someone to shoot them. That's what happened to me and it's literally my entire motivation for shooting people in highsec.
Xanthe Alvo
Doomheim
#142 - 2015-04-28 12:44:51 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Oddly enough, that's just about 100% false.

Not so much.


Quote:
No, the problem is that you think you should get to be left alone.

You, and others of your ilk, assume that I'm a carebear, and as with most things, you're wrong. I spend my time in low and null sec if I want to PvP...not ganking newbs in hi-sec.


Quote:
EVE was built on the concept of non consensual PvP. If you don't want to fight, go play Star Trek.

EVE was built on the concept of a sandbox. Non-consensual PvP is a part of that, yes. But your style of play isn't the be all end all in this game. All of you have assumed for years that your style of play is going to somehow awaken the miners and PvEers to a bigger world, and it never happens. It does for some, sure. But not on this "savior of hi-sec" kick most of you are bent on. It's NEVER going to happen. You're not that relevant.


Quote:
I really don't think you do get it. I also think you're arguing for your denial of reality to become reality, and that's just not going to happen.

Yet here we are in yet another "fix hi-sec" thread where risk averse PvPers come to whine about quality of life problems. You are the real carebears of this game.


Quote:

Yeah, because I'm the one playing the game wrong and demanding that my aberrant behavior become the rules, rather than play by the existing rules.

See above.

It's difficult taking anyone in CODE seriously, because ganking miners.
Danalee
A Blessed Bean
Pandemic Horde
#143 - 2015-04-28 12:50:21 UTC
Xanthe Alvo wrote:
The usual trammelite lies, half truths and self serving crap


Forum alt, calm down.

D.

Bear

Proud member of the Somalian Coast Guard Authority

Member and Juror of the Court of Crime and Punishment
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#144 - 2015-04-28 12:51:18 UTC
Xanthe Alvo wrote:

Not so much.


Yeah, so much. Corporation and alliance mechanics are very, very broken.


Quote:

You, and others of your ilk, assume that I'm a carebear, and as with most things, you're wrong. I spend my time in low and null sec if I want to PvP...not ganking newbs in hi-sec.


Sure you do, random NPC alt, sure you do.

Even if that obvious lie was not an obvious lie, carebear is a mentality, and you fit it to a tee.



Quote:

EVE was built on the concept of a sandbox.


Wrong. The people who originally designed EVE Online did so because Ultima Online came up with Trammel, and crippled PvP gameplay.


Quote:
All of you have assumed for years that your style of play is going to somehow awaken the miners and PvEers to a bigger world, and it never happens.


Actually, according to CCP themselves, that is exactly what happens.

You lot don't get to try that bullshit narrative anymore. Conflict is what makes people keep playing, not boring them to death with the pathetic excuse for a Facebook game that is mining.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#145 - 2015-04-28 13:04:10 UTC
and yet... if a merc corp is hired to put the hurt on an indy corp the very same haterage is spewed at them for doing their job as would be at CODE. for doing that thing they do.
They can't fight back! They haz no gunz! Gr33f0rz!
Go to null/low/WH/an interstate rest stop if you want PVP! As this thread is about high sec wars, I recommend dropping fifty cents into a payphone and calling someone in null who gives a flying feck at a rolling donut.
**** gets tiring. Mostly because, well while I understand where it is coming from as a recovering carebear... it's still the wrong view. Yes, you can get fights in low and null, but those are not the only places for violent fun with your fellow capsuleers. Some of us enjoy hijinks in empire space, and not just suicide ganking.

The war system is intrinsically linked to the corp system in high sec. They are two sides of the same coin if you would. We can tweak the wardec side of it all we want, but if we don't do something to adjust the corp side as well then all efforts are likely to fail.

The defenders need some incentive to fight back beyond losing their assets, this is true. Player corps should have benefits that make them worth fighting for to be bluntly honest. Right now they have things available to them that are worth fighting for, but only if they choose to reach out and employ them. With the attention being put on industry and POS mechanics lately I'm kind of hopeful that CCP may give them just the needed impulse to grab onto something and fight to keep it. Give them a reason to defend what is theirs. Give them a reason to want to win.

On the other hand, the 'neener neener neener, I'll just roll corp' **** needs to be addressed as well. Wardec costs went up because 'reasons'... fine. We need to raise the cost of creating a new corporation to match the cost of a wardec. Wars used to cost 2 mil I think, rolling a corp costs about that much. Fast easy fix, new corps cost 50 million to make. Parity achieved in most cases.

Anyways... I need more beer. I've spewed enough of my drivel. Digest, motherbitches!

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Xanthe Alvo
Doomheim
#146 - 2015-04-28 13:18:50 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Wrong. The people who originally designed EVE Online did so because Ultima Online came up with Trammel, and crippled PvP gameplay.


And yet, CCP continues to cater to the carebear. Because subscribers = money. Go figure. It doesn't matter what kind of spin you attempt to put on it, hi-sec war deccing is for risk averse wannabe PvPers. It isn't even PvP at all.
Danalee
A Blessed Bean
Pandemic Horde
#147 - 2015-04-28 13:28:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Danalee
Xanthe Alvo wrote:
hi-sec war deccing is for risk averse wannabe PvPers. It isn't even PvP at all.

Indeed.

It's not PVP, it's more like doing community service by putting nullbears out of their misery.

D.

Bear

Edit: forgot to say, come at me brah, I'll be on the sun at noon.

Proud member of the Somalian Coast Guard Authority

Member and Juror of the Court of Crime and Punishment
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#148 - 2015-04-28 13:33:09 UTC
Xanthe Alvo wrote:

And yet, CCP continues to cater to the carebear. Because subscribers = money. Go figure. It doesn't matter what kind of spin you attempt to put on it, hi-sec war deccing is for risk averse wannabe PvPers. It isn't even PvP at all.



Whose fault is that? Mine, or the people who refuse to fight back? In EVE Online, if you are defenseless, it is no one's fault but your own.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#149 - 2015-04-28 14:05:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Noragen Neirfallas
holy mother of thread derailment

First of all ignore the forum ALT as if it didn't post we of C&P are better then gettign baited by forum ALT's Roll
Second are we really solving anything by filling up 20+ posts with nonsense Lol. Revising OP ATM stay tuned

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#150 - 2015-04-28 15:11:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Estella Osoka
Only way to make carebears fight is to have so it affects their isk. Either gives them more or less.

Perhaps one idea is to make it so that by not fighting you lose faction/npc standing, and receive faction/npc standing by fighting. I say this because a lot of carebears are so concerned about their faction standings.

When you podkill a war target, you get their full bounty payout. None of that 10% crap, but only when at war; and only for player wardecs. Example player A is in a wardec against player B, player A podkills player B, and gets full bounty payout. Considering some of the bounties certain players have, this would be a huge monetary motivator, and make the bounties relevant.

Get CCP to create wardec missions. These would be missions where you have to kill a specific war target or structure. High payout. Only available when wardecced.

That's just me spitballing ideas.
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#151 - 2015-04-28 15:14:35 UTC
Estella Osoka wrote:

When you podkill a war target, you get their full bounty payout. None of that 10% crap, but only when at war; and only for player wardecs. Example player A is in a wardec against player B, player A podkills player B, and gets full bounty payout. Considering some of the bounties certain players have, this would be a huge monetary motivator, and make the bounties relevant.

I would abuse the hell outta this for some of my high bounty toons Big smile. so would others...

good idea tho keep em coming

CoolCool

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Estella Osoka
Cranky Bitches Who PMS
#152 - 2015-04-28 15:37:37 UTC
I guess you could lockdown their assets. For example make it so once you receive notice of the wardec, all POS cannot be unanchored and BPOs/BPCs cannot be stopped or removed. Other operations can still be done, such as reshipping, refitting, fueling, etc. If the aggressor wins, those assets become theirs. Same goes for the defender, so the if the aggressor loses; the defender gets their assets. Think of it as a hostile takeover.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#153 - 2015-04-28 15:52:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Vimsy Vortis
A POS getting taken down without a fight is not necessarily an undesirable outcome. I don't think it's a good idea to have wars affect the functionality of anything. Things should function the sane way when subject to shooting regardless of why they are being shot. POS contents are an issue in other types of space too, lowsec in particular is another area where the safety of the contents is pretty assured.

The only thing a war should do is enable the two involved groups to shoot each other.
Xanthe Alvo
Doomheim
#154 - 2015-04-28 15:59:02 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Whose fault is that? Mine, or the people who refuse to fight back? In EVE Online, if you are defenseless, it is no one's fault but your own.


Doesn't seem like they are defenseless at all. They either avoid you completely by docking up or jumping corp. Hence another hi-sec wardecs are broken whine thread.

"We shoot them and shoot them and shoot them, yet they are still winning the war in hi sec. CCP plox change game mechanics so this is easier for us."
- Bucket O' Tears
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#155 - 2015-04-28 16:08:57 UTC
Xanthe Alvo wrote:
The problem has never been with hi-sec or corporation mechanics.

The problem is risk averse hi-sec "leet PvPers", "gankers", and "merc corps" who can't seem to find content in low or null sec, so they pick on players who would rather just be left alone. They want PvP on their own terms instead of going out and looking for other PvPers who actually want to fight.

Nowhere in EVE is safe, we get it. Everyone gets it. But this is also the last MMO of its kind, a true sandbox. Forcing your playstyle on others via surprise buttsex PvP in hi-sec is for bored nullbears and players who can't PvP their way out of a paper bag.

The only thing broken here is you.


Do you even see how you are contradicting yourself?

Eve isn't safe, and yet you say the only people who make high sec unsafe are 'broken'? By that statement you WANT highsec to be safe, which goes against the fundamental concept of the game.

We shoot people in high sec because WE are the reason highsec isn't safe. WE are what makes highsec unsafe. Without us highsec would be safe and that is unacceptable.

*By we I mean all high sec war dec corps, griefers, scammers, corp thieves, awoxers, mission baiters, gate campers... you name it.*

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#156 - 2015-04-28 16:10:08 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Why would I shoot at people who want to be shot at? They aren't the people who need to be shot, they already know that shooting is good.

The only way people will learn that they like being shot at to begin with is for someone to shoot them. That's what happened to me and it's literally my entire motivation for shooting people in highsec.


Getting blown to pieces was literally the best thing that happened to me in my early Eve career.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#157 - 2015-04-28 16:13:54 UTC
Xanthe Alvo wrote:

EVE was built on the concept of a sandbox. Non-consensual PvP is a part of that, yes. But your style of play isn't the be all end all in this game. All of you have assumed for years that your style of play is going to somehow awaken the miners and PvEers to a bigger world, and it never happens. It does for some, sure. But not on this "savior of hi-sec" kick most of you are bent on. It's NEVER going to happen. You're not that relevant.


It's difficult taking anyone in CODE seriously, because ganking miners.


Wow you completely failed to understand what Code is really about. Take a step back, take a deep breath, read some minerbumping posts, talk to a Code pilot on coms, open your eyes to what Code all about, why we do what we do. I'm not saying you'll agree with us or join us, but you'll understand us. Clearly you currently do not.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#158 - 2015-04-28 16:16:18 UTC
Tengu Grib *Facepalm
Stop replying to the Forum ALT it has no standing in this forum Lol

CoolCool

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#159 - 2015-04-28 16:21:01 UTC
IT'S DONE AGAIN. Plz between trolling the forum ALT (tengu) and you know ship spinning or whatever re read the OP and post 4 and have at it

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin
Xanthe Alvo
Doomheim
#160 - 2015-04-28 16:27:41 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:
Do you even see how you are contradicting yourself?

Eve isn't safe, and yet you say the only people who make high sec unsafe are 'broken'? By that statement you WANT highsec to be safe, which goes against the fundamental concept of the game.

We shoot people in high sec because WE are the reason highsec isn't safe. WE are what makes highsec unsafe. Without us highsec would be safe and that is unacceptable.

*By we I mean all high sec war dec corps, griefers, scammers, corp thieves, awoxers, mission baiters, gate campers... you name it.*

Hi-sec remains safe, despite your efforts. That's the point you guys keep missing. What you're doing, all that you have done and will do in the future, it's all for naught. It changes nothing on the big stage. At best, your efforts are a pimple on the arse of hi-sec activities. There are single players in this game who have so much wealth and influence, they can shift entire markets on a whim. That's power. And it's more power than the lot of you have collectively.

Scammers, corp thieves, awoxers, mission baiters, and gate campers are all part of the meta game. They are playing, and winning at Eve in their own right. Miner bumpers, station huggers and wardeccers are just low skill, risk averse, wannabe PvPers. They're the equivalent of thugs who play the Knockout Game.