Player Features and Ideas Discussion

You used a word from a rhetoric class. All further discussion is unnecessary.

X ATM092 is that you? (j/k X)

So basically you (Piter) "don't want it" and that's why all your arguments and comments about this topic.

You could stay a frig pilot with 50m SP and don't ever remap them. But there are many others who would like to use such tool or option which is very similar to atributes remap we already have.

A total SP remap for characters older than 2009 + another for those who completely **** things up.

+2 mil SP for the 2009, +4 mil SP for 2010. +6 mil SP for 2012, +8 mil SP for 2013, +10mil for 2014 and the final insult to bitter vets... 2015 and 2016 toons start with 15 million SP allocated along similar career paths that older characters were able to choose.

remove all attribute implants and boost SP/H.

Maybe let 2004/05 players remap their SP across multiple alts.

But buying an SP remap... everyone should benefit, not just a few with the RL money or space-rich.

Not sure exactly why resetting SP is coming up as the main topic, but probably because it's a close update from what already is.


Beyond that idea, the benefits of SP updating are clear:

• Probable increased sub retention from fresh characters

This is the basis. Starting with 50k SP, low ship stats and performance, a bunch of arbitrary locks (inb4 lore) on a sandbox (that's probably pretty simply balanced around just ISK or availability of resources).. is a negative-reinforcement experience ("here's a limit, here's getting out of the limit"), but without a reward that matches the negativity of poor play (or literally not playing, for fresh skills). Spoiler alert: the game is fun enough without training as a main mechanic, because gameplay; but the relevant idea thereof is if the server infrastructure is even strong enough for an influx of characters, upon the notion of sandbox boundlessness.

In other words, matching the energy of a fresh experience is helpul: why smiling comes from feeling good, and good feelings come from smiling. It's a feedback loop, but finding ship fits and flight theory is at best rewarded with some 20-50% less in possible performance for nothing.

• There's no balance system for SP (for low stats)

If low SP is rewarded with advanced industrial output; that undermines the market.. etc.


SP training is an unrewarding experience, and so ineffective at promoting gameplay that it's probably a main reason for any unsub trends. It's non-interactive and promotes station sitting (probably negatively impacting market prices, both because of .01ing and less action).

The above is your theory. Nothing more.

My theory is that some new players can't adjust to seeing themselves as a ship, and want instead to be a walking swinging humanoid pixel warrior.

Which is right?

WE DON"T KNOW.

But you have not proven a reason why this game should become another clone of all the other games like WoW. Many people who have been playing this game for a long time love the differences that this game has been built around. Personally I am disappointed with the removal of racial attributes, when a rebalance would have been better. I also don't agree with the removal of clone costs. And I really hope they never do away with attributes.

But none of those fundamentally alters the skill system the way the remapping of sp would. If remapping of sp were allowed into this game it would no longer be about choices. Then there will be arguments that the time based nature of sp accumulation must go. I do not want this game to devolve into an xp repetitive action grind based skill system.

My first character was made in 2006. This character was made in 2012. None of them can match the accumulated skills of a 2003 character. But they don't have to. Level 5 in specs is as good as any character can get. Younger characters make choices in what to max out just as older characters did. After about a year or two in the game, the main advantage older characters have is breadth of skill, not depth.

Eve has always been about carefully considered meaningful decisions. Introducing skill remapping would take away the carfully considered part. And I really think you would no longer have any pride in your character. It would just be another fad of the month ship chaser, awaiting the inevitable nerf of the fotm, and then respeccing into whatever would become the next fotm, rinse and repeat. And new players would be at an even worse place in that game.

All you folks asking for skill respecs would not be satisfied even with them. You would still find a skill disadvantage as against older players. So next you would be asking for plex for sp packs. At that point the entire skill system would be meaningless.

Piter Bakunin's posts are spot on as to why skill respeccing is no good and not needed. And you really should accept that the game is different, and enjoy that difference.

edit - and please read the op. the only reason this thread exists is as a dump for skill system whines by new players with no appreciation for this game. Because various WoW centric new players with an I want it now attitude have over many years polluted these forums with many threads about buying skills or remapping skills. None have convinced the majority of the player base, the CSM, or CCP that a change to the skill system is a good thing.

Conservatives whinnings as usual follows to anything new and not comfortable changes, improvements etc. So i wouldn't worry to much about ut casue as it mentioned the racial attibutes removal was not supported, clone cost upgrade was not supported, skill learning atributes removal was not supported. So looks liek we have two last thing to fight for Attributes removal/change current system and tafter that SP remap.

Will see how it goes.

Some slight changes to how newbies (in their first 30d) start and run career agents might get them into the game better.

Career agents are changed so that when a newbie runs the missions, they don't get skillbooks, but the skillbooks are injected and set to L1.
Advanced Career Agents are designed to improve the skills the player starts with by +2 levels over the current. Someone could do a small arc of 4-5 missions and get their Frigate, Gunnery, Nav, etc... improved on.

A Final Agent available to newbies who did at least 1 of the Advanced Career Agent Arcs who installs some funky implant that permanently boosts your attributes by 2. The goal is to get them in, get them playing, get them resubbing.

This is only available to new toons/alts only who are under 30 days old. Don't complete it, no problem, but no +2 to your attributes.

That's a very shallow response on a very encompassing idea (poor status quo from stats).

For the fresh experience, it's an unexpected setback for no apparently-decent reason.

Hey CCP, if you let me swap clones in station (for the purpose of going from learning implants to PVP implants), I'd consider all issues regarding remaps, learning implants, and risk aversion (due to implants) solved. Right now you have to use a jump clone timer even if it's in-station and that doesn't make much sense to me. I'm under the impression jump clone timers are there to limit travel (and you don't travel if all you're doing is changing clones in your current station).

It's like > /dev/null for bad SP ideas