These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Discussion] Entosis Link Tactics and Ship Balance

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#561 - 2015-03-09 19:21:19 UTC
Carniflex wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
afkalt wrote:

Or a cerberus is on field. Or a linked rapier/huginn/lachesis/garmur. Or a sniper fit turret ship. Or a smartbombing camp is in the way. Or it comes in close to kill the ship with damps on it or that is running its own link.

It's never at risk if you're remotely not serious about contesting the structure.

the interceptor just disengages if any of those things somehow managed to waddle onto field in defiance of an interceptor's superior warp speed

what is it about the concept "the interceptor can travel at will and disengage at will" are you chuckleheads failing to grasp


Did you read that little note that this sov laser thingy disables ability to warp while its active?

yes, and that is not an issue for a ship that is faster than nearly everything else in the game

an interceptor decides it is time to bug out, but its link is still active? just burn off grid while it falls off
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#562 - 2015-03-09 19:22:29 UTC
Leisha Miranen wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread


I just wanted to note that you've now posted more than 72 times in this thread.

so, wanna fight about it Twisted
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#563 - 2015-03-09 19:22:58 UTC
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Veskrashen wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
what is it about the concept "the interceptor can travel at will and disengage at will" are you chuckleheads failing to grasp

The fact that it can't "disengage at will" while an Entosis Link is active? Which gives a defender up to 2 minutes to close and kill it? Especially when the fight starts at less than 80km due to combat probes?

how do you close on an interceptor before it burns off grid exactly

hint: they go fast, can't be bubbled, and scrams have a very short range on anything that can keep up with them


Lachesis or Rapier, combat probes would be my first suggestion. Although if the fight is not on spawned bunker but at static structure defender should have already the bookmarks prepared.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#564 - 2015-03-09 19:23:20 UTC
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it's an issue because you can't stop the attacking interceptor in any meaningful fashion from doing this every single day

if someone is being a nuisance it should be mechanically possible to stop him from being a nuisance, i feel like this is a reasonable request

You mean like high sec ganking?

avoid obvious choke points, fit tank, limit the amount you are carrying, and stay dimly aware of things like Burn Jita and you will never get ganked
Acuma
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#565 - 2015-03-09 19:24:36 UTC
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it's an issue because you can't stop the attacking interceptor in any meaningful fashion from doing this every single day

if someone is being a nuisance it should be mechanically possible to stop him from being a nuisance, i feel like this is a reasonable request

You mean like high sec ganking?

avoid obvious choke points, fit tank, limit the amount you are carrying, and stay dimly aware of things like Burn Jita and you will never get ganked

Have one inty with the link and you'll never get RF'd by a trollceptor.......see, I can do that too. LOL
Leisha Miranen
Doomheim
#566 - 2015-03-09 19:24:39 UTC
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Leisha Miranen wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread


I just wanted to note that you've now posted more than 72 times in this thread.

so, wanna fight about it Twisted


lol not rly, doesn't matter rly, I just noticed a lot of posts and was bopred enough to count \o/
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#567 - 2015-03-09 19:25:03 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread

This thread is about the Entosis link and the sovereignty system thereof. Not just TCUs. If the inty's don't bother with the "pimples" that spawn immediately following the TCU RF, the TCU returns to a non-RF state. I.E. No Problem at all for the defender.

In effect:
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Leaves ---> TCU Returns to non RF after 4 hours. (No action needed)
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Engages Sov Node (Need 1 caracal for every 4 Trollceptors per constellation assuming occupancy 40 minute bonus)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#568 - 2015-03-09 19:25:26 UTC
Is that what the command nodes are called now, sov pimples?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#569 - 2015-03-09 19:25:51 UTC
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it's an issue because you can't stop the attacking interceptor in any meaningful fashion from doing this every single day

if someone is being a nuisance it should be mechanically possible to stop him from being a nuisance, i feel like this is a reasonable request

You mean like high sec ganking?

avoid obvious choke points, fit tank, limit the amount you are carrying, and stay dimly aware of things like Burn Jita and you will never get ganked

Have one inty with the link and you'll never get RF'd by a trollceptor.......see, I can do that too. LOL

if you want to pose a chance of actually stopping their shenanigans you have to approach with supernumeracy in levels that are excessive to anyone other than GSF and possibly brave newbies
Sigras
Conglomo
#570 - 2015-03-09 19:25:52 UTC
To the people stating that trollceptors dont matter because you can counter them with a friendly entosis link...

Picture this Scenario

I have a fleet of 300 coming to capture your system after we reinforced it last night, but I dont like Fozzie's idea of splitting my fleet up to capture command nodes in different systems... So i allocate 20 of my ships as trollceptors. I send 4 of them to each command node to prevent it from being captured and move my other 260 people around capping the modules one by one. No need to split up my fleet, no risk of loss.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#571 - 2015-03-09 19:26:47 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread

This thread is about the Entosis link and the sovereignty system thereof. Not just TCUs. If the inty's don't bother with the "pimples" that spawn immediately following the TCU RF, the TCU returns to a non-RF state. I.E. No Problem at all for the defender.

In effect:
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Leaves ---> TCU Returns to non RF after 4 hours. (No action needed)
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Engages Sov Node (Need 1 caracal for every 4 Trollceptors per constellation assuming occupancy 40 minute bonus)

what does the tcu have to do with it, you can make timers for ihubs and stations too

if anything the tcu is the least vulnerable to trollceptors
Acuma
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#572 - 2015-03-09 19:27:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Acuma
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Acuma wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it's an issue because you can't stop the attacking interceptor in any meaningful fashion from doing this every single day

if someone is being a nuisance it should be mechanically possible to stop him from being a nuisance, i feel like this is a reasonable request

You mean like high sec ganking?

avoid obvious choke points, fit tank, limit the amount you are carrying, and stay dimly aware of things like Burn Jita and you will never get ganked

Have one inty with the link and you'll never get RF'd by a trollceptor.......see, I can do that too. LOL

if you want to pose a chance of actually stopping their shenanigans you have to approach with supernumeracy in levels that are excessive to anyone other than GSF and possibly brave newbies

Not really, sounds like it's just nuisance for alliances with vast area's of unused space....the trollceptor isn't going to make a career out of gate jumping for 4 hours everyday. In an active constellation it'll be ridiculously easy to ruin trollceptor's imaginary fun of RF'ing everything.......he'll get bored accomplishing nothing and then maybe some real fighting can occur.
Alp Khan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#573 - 2015-03-09 19:27:57 UTC
Eli Apoli wrote:
lol ad-hominem at an avatar of an alt..



Not really, you have demonstrated your lack of insight on sovereign null time and time again with your posts under the thread. You even posted once yourself that you do not want to sound like a high-sec salvager that knows everything in EVE. Well, you awfully sound like one, therefore, I'm just reiterating your opinion of yourself.

You haven't lived in null before, you don't even recognize that Goons and by extension CFC use their sovereign space at levels unlike seen with any other major null power. Yet, you are trying really hard to pretend that your opinions are based on solid assumptions, and not patched up guesswork as it really reads like.

But you continue to entertain, I'll give that to you. Now you are implying that you are an alt of a null dweller! I'm hoping for another post coming from you that will claim you are actually an alt of a sovereign null alliance leader, and that your wild and speculative rhetoric should be taken seriously because of that.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#574 - 2015-03-09 19:27:59 UTC
Sigras wrote:
To the people stating that trollceptors dont matter because you can counter them with a friendly entosis link...

Picture this Scenario

I have a fleet of 300 coming to capture your system after we reinforced it last night, but I dont like Fozzie's idea of splitting my fleet up to capture command nodes in different systems... So i allocate 20 of my ships as trollceptors. I send 4 of them to each command node to prevent it from being captured and move my other 260 people around capping the modules one by one. No need to split up my fleet, no risk of loss.

So,,, you're blobbing, you're blobbing...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#575 - 2015-03-09 19:28:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Apol
Sigras wrote:
To the people stating that trollceptors dont matter because you can counter them with a friendly entosis link...

Picture this Scenario

I have a fleet of 300 coming to capture your system after we reinforced it last night, but I dont like Fozzie's idea of splitting my fleet up to capture command nodes in different systems... So i allocate 20 of my ships as trollceptors. I send 4 of them to each command node to prevent it from being captured and move my other 260 people around capping the modules one by one. No need to split up my fleet, no risk of loss.

I think one maulus or griffin completely stops 3, maybe 4 trollceptors, so yeah 2 ewar frigs and then a friendly laser and you cap each of those points with just 2 people in 10 minutes whilst the fleet of 260 takes upto 40 minutes to cap one.

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#576 - 2015-03-09 19:29:09 UTC
Acuma wrote:
Not really, sounds like it's just nuisance for alliances with vast area's of unused space....the trollceptor isn't going to make a career out of gate jumping for 4 hours everyday. It'll get boring while accomplishing nothing and then maybe some real fighting can occur.

it's a nuisance for any alliance who does not overwhelmingly outnumber the people attacking them

guess who has the most numbers in eve

hint: it's us
Mr Omniblivion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#577 - 2015-03-09 19:29:59 UTC
Pre-emptive "we told you so" before the inevitable tears of everyone getting hosed by these changes (hint: it's not us)
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#578 - 2015-03-09 19:30:06 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
Promiscuous Female wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread

This thread is about the Entosis link and the sovereignty system thereof. Not just TCUs. If the inty's don't bother with the "pimples" that spawn immediately following the TCU RF, the TCU returns to a non-RF state. I.E. No Problem at all for the defender.

In effect:
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Leaves ---> TCU Returns to non RF after 4 hours. (No action needed)
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Engages Sov Node (Need 1 caracal for every 4 Trollceptors per constellation assuming occupancy 40 minute bonus)

what does the tcu have to do with it, you can make timers for ihubs and stations too

if anything the tcu is the least vulnerable to trollceptors

Same deal, if something is RF'd by a trollceptor, and then the inty ignores the "sov pimples" (your stated concern), the RF'd structure (station, IHub, TCU, w/e) returns to a non RF state at the end of 4 hours.

If, as you say, you aren't discussing the trollceptor attacking "sov pimples", then you're literally worrying about having to take no action whatsoever, as any attack that isn't followed by a bout of pimple popping does absolutely nothing.
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#579 - 2015-03-09 19:30:16 UTC
EvilweaselFinance wrote:
Groperson wrote:
[We do, we have pvp'ers at home, running bubbled gatecamps with instalockers and even they are unable to catch the interceptor gangs that come through. How would you suggest we counter the interceptor gangs?

obviously by using neuting bumping nafalgars or whatever the latest theoretical approach is that anyone who has spent 5m in null knows won't work and why

i think smartbombs are the lastest hotness in theorycrafting because npc alts can't activate smartbombs where they live so they don't know you can't smartbomb if you'd hit a gate


Local pirate population in aunenen (spelling?) seems to be pretty good at getting my interceptors with smartbombs. Trick seems to be sitting on outbound gate, certain distance from gate and hit the right number of bombs when the ship appears on short range scan. The smartbombs will hit it during the warp deacceleration phase.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#580 - 2015-03-09 19:31:27 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:

you're talking about capture node pimples, not the initial rf timer, which is all that i have ever been talking about throughout this entire thread

This thread is about the Entosis link and the sovereignty system thereof. Not just TCUs. If the inty's don't bother with the "pimples" that spawn immediately following the TCU RF, the TCU returns to a non-RF state. I.E. No Problem at all for the defender.

In effect:
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Leaves ---> TCU Returns to non RF after 4 hours. (No action needed)
Trollceptor RF TCU ---> Trollceptor Engages Sov Node (Need 1 caracal for every 4 Trollceptors per constellation assuming occupancy 40 minute bonus)

what does the tcu have to do with it, you can make timers for ihubs and stations too

if anything the tcu is the least vulnerable to trollceptors

Same deal, if something is RF'd by a trollceptor, and then the inty ignores the "sov pimples" (your stated concern), the RF'd structure (station, IHub, TCU, w/e) returns to a non RF state at the end of 4 hours.

If, as you say, you aren't discussing the trollceptor attacking "sov pimples", then you're literally worrying about having to take no action whatsoever, as any attack that isn't followed by a bout of pimple popping does absolutely nothing.

the problem is that a single attacker generates a disproportionate amount of work for the defenders at any scale without enduring even an iota of risk

that is the whole thing