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Dev blog: Politics by Other Means: Sovereignty Phase Two

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epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#2661 - 2015-03-05 21:47:14 UTC
DaReaper wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


Interesting, So I imagine with the new sov, you and others you have connections with as renters, will be re-evaluating the terms and conditions at the least, and considering freedom and independence, as opposed to continuing the rental relationship?

This could turn out to be the most significant area of the new changes, particuarly if the current sov holders are relying on you to provide your own defence?

I remember a quote from the foundation trilogy, that Empires collapse from the periphery. As they need to consolidate, the periphery takes it's independance. I wonder if the new sov means we are exiting the age of Null empires.

I am sure, every renter corp will be starting to ask these questions, and like pandora's box once open what is released and seen can never be shoved back into the box and forgotten.

Exciting times.

Edit:- I may have messed up quoting apologies if so.



This is usually what happens daily. It also depends on who is in the alliance. My alliance was a 600 man mostly industrial alliance with maybe 50 pure pvpers tossed in. Thouse 50 pvpers kept asking 'why are we paying rent? why are we letting this small alliance next to us survive?" things like that. It was a weekly "because we can not survive on our own" and it got worse if the 50 happen to win a small pvp match. Then when you had the miners getting mad that they could nto fan out and mine, you got more pressure to expand and kill the dudes next door. All the while you see your land lord flexing its muscle. And once time, again while in atlas. space, one of there renters decided to not pay rent, and atlas. reset them. and all the renters did as well. by the end of the day that alliance was slaughtered, as the wolves of the renters came in and killed them. Which again led to talks of 'lets stop paying rent and be on our own!' This happens alot in renter and small alliances. So it sa constant evaluation. And if you get invaded and your land lord does nothing... well then you REALLY get the pressure of 'f*** them"


Thank you very much, that answers my question wonderfully clearly.
This is going to be much more of a reset of the map than I first imagined, CCP have definately got their Mojo back, and interesting times ahead.
So many people are going to be challenging so many assumptions, and nothing will be the same again.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
M1k3y Koontz
Speaker for the Dead
Shadow Cartel
#2662 - 2015-03-05 21:48:56 UTC
Drogo Drogos wrote:

Having sov is already a pain and 90% of each region is already bad living in, only a handfull of systems are considered good in a whole region.


Great, so hold sov in 10% of the region, and you don't have to worry about holding the other 90%! Let random people have the other 90% and let the PVPers in your alliance farm them for kills. Best of both worlds, good carebearing, local PVP.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Eli Apol
Definitely a nullsec alt
#2663 - 2015-03-05 21:50:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Apol
Promiscuous Female wrote:
no

if you actually knew how POS worked, you'd know that you can set permissions such that only people with roles can empty the silos

then you don't hand out those roles except to the logisticians

Sorry my bad, been a few years since I was in a position to give out POS roles and never did moon goo so didn't even glance at those ones - C5 WH life without moon goo :S

but what would I know, I'm just a salvager
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#2664 - 2015-03-05 21:53:22 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
DaReaper wrote:



And this is why moon need to be ACTIVE mined. Not mined with pos.


I think what those moon values shows is that Dyspro needs to be more common. The region I live in has about half a dozen Thuliums, not a singlee Dyspro or Neo moon.

Moving moon mining away from POS's would remove the last combative POS content, but it would probably be for the best. Maybe make it scannable like gas.



That is really interesting, players mining the moon materials, would certainly increase the opportunities for players to increase their personal incomes, quite a few players have suggested this as a good idea. What would be the down sides though? Would it put to much pressure on the null Empires, if a primary income source was removed?

It certainly would play towards the declared goals of the Sov rebalance, but would it be too much? Too soon? And would hurting the Empire holders be in the best interest of the game? That could unleash a firestorm that would be quite traumatic for many.

The effects of this release are going to be greater than any of us realised at first. Wow.



Read my signature as an idea. But people complain about null not havign income. If all the moons were depleted and appeared in a revamped belt, you would have more people mining the ore form said belt, more targets to hit. Dysp, prom, and tech now become like ABC ore. Rare, but you can find it in belts all over. This would only be possible with a pos revamp, where pos' do more then act as moon mining platforms. This also would mean that, in theory, alliance X would need less space. As they coudl gather all the T2 resources they need in a much smaller area. Like a constalation. No need to sit on empty systems because you need that system for the two dysp moons, and you only touch the system once every week to get yoru ore, and fuel the pos.

In addition, alliances coudl then tax the moon ore as now it would need to be refined, and then if you added say reactions to stations (again, pos revamp needed) you coudl tax the reactions. Now the economy starts to shift form a top down to a top up.

The disadvantage is to the alliance leadership. As a dysp moon (fudging numbers only an exsample) brings in a garenteed 5b a month. That money can be counted on like clock work if you have a good logistics network. The other way though, you have to relay on your miners to refine in yoru stations and react in yoru stations, so you can sell the excess.

But to a line man, this gets you more iskies, and to a pvp roaming space, this gives a chance for a good fight. And this also means your mining index will be used and you will use the space you own.

Passive moon mining needs to die.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#2665 - 2015-03-05 21:55:26 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
DaReaper wrote:



Naw, i have learned in my 11 years here are 34 on earth that humans are stupid. Most who pay rent, do so so they don;t get steam rolled. If say goonies sent a small fleet through renter space, most renters would fold. So i'm good.

Damn, I could used an extra 10 million isk, grrr.



Quote:

In THEORY however, if the land lord is ignoring you, you stop paying rent.
Exactly Big smile


But your post illustrates something that is important here. Ideally, renters would 'rise up' against their 'masters' and throw the bums out. That would make for exciting game play. But that is the thinking of an 'ideal person' . No such person exists. Real humans are messy.

REAL people say they want exciting game play, but they end up seeking comfort and convenience. Many an alliance fell because it's pilots left the game or stayed in the game and went 'carebear'. It's another one of those human nature things, and why this new sov system and this discussion in general wil probably not have the desired results:

http://uxmyths.com/post/746610684/myth-21-people-can-tell-you-what-they-want

Quote:

In his TED Talk on spaghetti sauces, Malcolm Gladwell argues that the food industry made a big mistake asking people about their preferences and conducting focus groups. Gladwell says that “The mind knows not what the tongue wants. […] If I asked all of you, for example, in this room, what you want in a coffee, you know what you’d say? Every one of you would say ‘I want a dark, rich, hearty roast.’ It’s what people always say when you ask them what they want in a coffee. What do you like? Dark, rich, hearty roast! What percentage of you actually like a dark, rich, hearty roast? According to Howard, somewhere between 25 and 27 percent of you. Most of you like milky, weak coffee. But you will never, ever say to someone who asks you what you want — that ‘I want a milky, weak coffee.’”


When someone asks us what we want (or what gameplay we think would be fun) we always say shooting and conflict. Give the average EVE player what he says he wants and watch them end up not wanting it lol.

Many a renter talks a good game about what they would do if they didn't have to worry about super caps dropping on them, but they will keep renting because they really want comfort and for someone else to move that damn IHUB.

You are most likely right, but interesting, I imagine the Empire leaders will try to enforce the rental agreements with a rod of Iron to ensure compliance, but I do wonder, whether those rental corps, far from the centre, will notice the ships of their landlords, less and less visible, and start to wonder, what life would be like if they didn't have to keep those agreements? And just how fast that would spread? Only time will tell, but very very interesting possibilities. I didn't visualise this when I first heard of the changes.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
M1k3y Koontz
Speaker for the Dead
Shadow Cartel
#2666 - 2015-03-05 21:56:59 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:

That is really interesting, players mining the moon materials, would certainly increase the opportunities for players to increase their personal incomes, quite a few players have suggested this as a good idea. What would be the down sides though? Would it put to much pressure on the null Empires, if a primary income source was removed?

It certainly would play towards the declared goals of the Sov rebalance, but would it be too much? Too soon? And would hurting the Empire holders be in the best interest of the game? That could unleash a firestorm that would be quite traumatic for many.

The effects of this release are going to be greater than any of us realised at first. Wow.


Alliances would need a new income source before moons can be removed as a top up source.

There's still cost associated with sov, and generally running an alliance (Titan POS's, jump bridges, sov maintenance costs, logistics etc.), which line members don't like to open their wallets to. So some new income stream would be needed at an alliance level.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#2667 - 2015-03-05 22:00:00 UTC
afkalt wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
afkalt wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it doesn't have to beat the orthrus, just not die to it until the artosis link finishes the job

also i do like that you are having to use a 280m ship and 750m of implants to kill a 20m frig with an 80m module



Or I could use a cheapass cruiser and block the link....


Stop the melodrama. Interceptors threaten sprawling, indefensible empires. NOTHING MORE.

Stop being bad, stop derailing with FUD about "trollceptors" and maybe we can all get a decent future.


These phantom interceptors threats are nothing short of a nonsense if you live in your space.

the inteceptor then shrugs, burns off grid, and hits another node or sov structure, and cannot be stopped if the pilot uses a shred of intellect while burning around a region

you can't bridge around them due to fatigue, you can't warp faster than them, and outside of serious pilot error, they cannot be caught while traveling

stop focusing on the individual fight (especially since you are bad at theorycrafting them)


Again, an empire of APPROPRIATE SIZE will give zero craps about this.

Funny that.


Please define "empire of appropriate size."

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#2668 - 2015-03-05 22:00:54 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
DaReaper wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


Interesting, So I imagine with the new sov, you and others you have connections with as renters, will be re-evaluating the terms and conditions at the least, and considering freedom and independence, as opposed to continuing the rental relationship?

This could turn out to be the most significant area of the new changes, particuarly if the current sov holders are relying on you to provide your own defence?

I remember a quote from the foundation trilogy, that Empires collapse from the periphery. As they need to consolidate, the periphery takes it's independance. I wonder if the new sov means we are exiting the age of Null empires.

I am sure, every renter corp will be starting to ask these questions, and like pandora's box once open what is released and seen can never be shoved back into the box and forgotten.

Exciting times.

Edit:- I may have messed up quoting apologies if so.



This is usually what happens daily. It also depends on who is in the alliance. My alliance was a 600 man mostly industrial alliance with maybe 50 pure pvpers tossed in. Thouse 50 pvpers kept asking 'why are we paying rent? why are we letting this small alliance next to us survive?" things like that. It was a weekly "because we can not survive on our own" and it got worse if the 50 happen to win a small pvp match. Then when you had the miners getting mad that they could nto fan out and mine, you got more pressure to expand and kill the dudes next door. All the while you see your land lord flexing its muscle. And once time, again while in atlas. space, one of there renters decided to not pay rent, and atlas. reset them. and all the renters did as well. by the end of the day that alliance was slaughtered, as the wolves of the renters came in and killed them. Which again led to talks of 'lets stop paying rent and be on our own!' This happens alot in renter and small alliances. So it sa constant evaluation. And if you get invaded and your land lord does nothing... well then you REALLY get the pressure of 'f*** them"


Thank you very much, that answers my question wonderfully clearly.
This is going to be much more of a reset of the map than I first imagined, CCP have definately got their Mojo back, and interesting times ahead.
So many people are going to be challenging so many assumptions, and nothing will be the same again.


Well this depends. A land lord could easily keep a tight fist on their renters. Its why i won't bet a huge revolt. Its WAY to early. For all i know, small alliances might go 'yes hat sounds too hard... naw i'm good paying' . But if you base it solely on human nature... then you can see there is a possibility for a shake up and chaos.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
M1k3y Koontz
Speaker for the Dead
Shadow Cartel
#2669 - 2015-03-05 22:01:45 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
afkalt wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
afkalt wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
it doesn't have to beat the orthrus, just not die to it until the artosis link finishes the job

also i do like that you are having to use a 280m ship and 750m of implants to kill a 20m frig with an 80m module



Or I could use a cheapass cruiser and block the link....


Stop the melodrama. Interceptors threaten sprawling, indefensible empires. NOTHING MORE.

Stop being bad, stop derailing with FUD about "trollceptors" and maybe we can all get a decent future.


These phantom interceptors threats are nothing short of a nonsense if you live in your space.

the inteceptor then shrugs, burns off grid, and hits another node or sov structure, and cannot be stopped if the pilot uses a shred of intellect while burning around a region

you can't bridge around them due to fatigue, you can't warp faster than them, and outside of serious pilot error, they cannot be caught while traveling

stop focusing on the individual fight (especially since you are bad at theorycrafting them)


Again, an empire of APPROPRIATE SIZE will give zero craps about this.

Funny that.


Please define "empire of appropriate size."


One big enough to have active members in all (read: spread out over most) of the systems they own. That can be 100 or 100,000, it depends how many systems they are trying to hold. A hundred (active) guys could likely hold a constellation, 100,000 could likely keep multiple regions safe.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#2670 - 2015-03-05 22:01:51 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Mike Azariah wrote:

I am doing my damndest to catch up with this thread. But you lot keep writing faster than I can read. When I am full caught up I will start actual comments and answers but like ISD Ezwal, I am reading it all.

Every damn post.

m

Or...

Instead of reading all the posts happening now and gauging public opinion first as to how to spin what you did in the past, let people know now what your advice to CCP already WAS and to what level the CSM was consulted on this PRIOR to the dev blog announcement?

I think that's where people are disappointed with the CSM right now. We expected you guys to have immediate releases ready to go once the dev blog hit to say "we talked to CCP about this and we said 'X"', BEFORE seeing which way the wind is blowing...

Now you are just going to spin based on what public reaction is now, rather than divulge what your thought leadership with CCP was.

A pox on all of you.

Mike Azariah's CSM Candidacy wrote:
I am Mike Azariah, Hisec resident...Carebear...Casual player...Northern Troll...Anarchist


I have a hunch about how he might have felt about this Cool


I'm not just singling out mike here. The minutes on sov discussions that were redacted in the minutes must now be released, so the community can weigh 'what value csm', or 'what value csm member X'

Would you like to know more?
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#2671 - 2015-03-05 22:02:30 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:

That is really interesting, players mining the moon materials, would certainly increase the opportunities for players to increase their personal incomes, quite a few players have suggested this as a good idea. What would be the down sides though? Would it put to much pressure on the null Empires, if a primary income source was removed?

It certainly would play towards the declared goals of the Sov rebalance, but would it be too much? Too soon? And would hurting the Empire holders be in the best interest of the game? That could unleash a firestorm that would be quite traumatic for many.

The effects of this release are going to be greater than any of us realised at first. Wow.


Alliances would need a new income source before moons can be removed as a top up source.

There's still cost associated with sov, and generally running an alliance (Titan POS's, jump bridges, sov maintenance costs, logistics etc.), which line members don't like to open their wallets to. So some new income stream would be needed at an alliance level.



There is a simple fix to this. An alliance tax would fix a huge chunk of this. get a 5% tax on ALL income sources and you are good.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Locke DieDrake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2672 - 2015-03-05 22:06:33 UTC
Doctor Fabulous MD wrote:
Zip Slings wrote:
Doctor Fabulous MD wrote:


Anything lands on grid capable of actually catching it and tackling it (only other T3 destroyers fit with a scram), it can just immediately warp off to a safe and cloak, wait for them to leave, then fire up the sov laser again.


1. Your idea that this Svipul would "just warp" seems to forget the fact that it can't warp for 2 minutes at a time.

2. http://i.imgur.com/waJhtx5.png



Yes, i misspoke and edited my post, he would simply have to burn away until warpoff timer expired.

That naga fit wont hit at all either.


Three sniper eagles deployed correctly can hit anything, going any speed. The fact that you don't know how to do this is your problem.

Anyone that cares to can remove your sovscrewer ship from the grid with no more than 3 HACs.

Forgetting entirely that a newb ship with a sovlaser can completely invalidate your ship in the first place.
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support
#2673 - 2015-03-05 22:07:47 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
One big enough to have active members in all (read: spread out over most) of the systems they own. That can be 100 or 100,000, it depends how many systems they are trying to hold. A hundred (active) guys could likely hold a constellation, 100,000 could likely keep multiple regions safe.

so you should need 100 guys to be able to hold 5 systems eh
Thoirdhealbhach
Liga der hessischen Gentlemen
#2674 - 2015-03-05 22:09:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Thoirdhealbhach
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:

That is really interesting, players mining the moon materials, would certainly increase the opportunities for players to increase their personal incomes, quite a few players have suggested this as a good idea. What would be the down sides though? Would it put to much pressure on the null Empires, if a primary income source was removed?

It certainly would play towards the declared goals of the Sov rebalance, but would it be too much? Too soon? And would hurting the Empire holders be in the best interest of the game? That could unleash a firestorm that would be quite traumatic for many.

The effects of this release are going to be greater than any of us realised at first. Wow.


Alliances would need a new income source before moons can be removed as a top up source.

There's still cost associated with sov, and generally running an alliance (Titan POS's, jump bridges, sov maintenance costs, logistics etc.), which line members don't like to open their wallets to. So some new income stream would be needed at an alliance level.


Whats the big deal? Corps have tax rates and corps do have agreements with their alliance and can be kicked from an alliance...

But of course it is much more convenient for the moon owners to have a steady source of income, that only a small restricted circle has access to and proper information about. That way, ISK and the power to do big things trickles down top to bottom, just as in real life...

And by the way, I think a big money making machine, working on what, weekly supervision(???), is a good idea in the first place, when every group without moon goo needs to earn their ISKs for PvP through playing/grinding actual content. It is hilariously easy to condescent to high-sec players for beeing seemingly risk-averse, when your alliance is so filthy rich, it can afford a full blown ship replacement program. Are there ANY non-nullsec entities that can afford to do that? I don't think so.

But I'm afraid this is drifting off topic.... I think I have to go and find the nearest abolish-moon-mining-thread...

In the dev blog, Fozzie stated:
Quote:
This system of occupancy defensive bonuses is intentionally built to be modular and adjustable. In future iterations of the Sovereignty system we plan to refine the process for measuring activity, including expanding what kinds of activities are counted towards the bonuses.


I think it would be important for CCP to come up with a new expanded and refined way to measure occupancy really fast. I'm under the impression that there is a HUGE mechanical and/or psychological difference between 10 min and 40 min capture times...
I would like to see several activity indices adding up to a total bonus. I think it would be important to cap that total bonus, so that you don't need to grind certain types of gameplay, just to get your maxed out def bonus.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#2675 - 2015-03-05 22:09:52 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
DaReaper wrote:



Naw, i have learned in my 11 years here are 34 on earth that humans are stupid. Most who pay rent, do so so they don;t get steam rolled. If say goonies sent a small fleet through renter space, most renters would fold. So i'm good.

Damn, I could used an extra 10 million isk, grrr.



Quote:

In THEORY however, if the land lord is ignoring you, you stop paying rent.
Exactly Big smile


But your post illustrates something that is important here. Ideally, renters would 'rise up' against their 'masters' and throw the bums out. That would make for exciting game play. But that is the thinking of an 'ideal person' . No such person exists. Real humans are messy.

REAL people say they want exciting game play, but they end up seeking comfort and convenience. Many an alliance fell because it's pilots left the game or stayed in the game and went 'carebear'. It's another one of those human nature things, and why this new sov system and this discussion in general wil probably not have the desired results:

http://uxmyths.com/post/746610684/myth-21-people-can-tell-you-what-they-want

Quote:

In his TED Talk on spaghetti sauces, Malcolm Gladwell argues that the food industry made a big mistake asking people about their preferences and conducting focus groups. Gladwell says that “The mind knows not what the tongue wants. […] If I asked all of you, for example, in this room, what you want in a coffee, you know what you’d say? Every one of you would say ‘I want a dark, rich, hearty roast.’ It’s what people always say when you ask them what they want in a coffee. What do you like? Dark, rich, hearty roast! What percentage of you actually like a dark, rich, hearty roast? According to Howard, somewhere between 25 and 27 percent of you. Most of you like milky, weak coffee. But you will never, ever say to someone who asks you what you want — that ‘I want a milky, weak coffee.’”


When someone asks us what we want (or what gameplay we think would be fun) we always say shooting and conflict. Give the average EVE player what he says he wants and watch them end up not wanting it lol.

Many a renter talks a good game about what they would do if they didn't have to worry about super caps dropping on them, but they will keep renting because they really want comfort and for someone else to move that damn IHUB.


Not all, my alliance used to use wormholes and move our own ihub.. we pissed off the renters next door couse we would use there wh's but meh.

But your point is very valid. I met A LOT of alliances that were totally happy paying rent, as long as they coudl mine or rat they did not care.

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#2676 - 2015-03-05 22:14:16 UTC
DaReaper wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:

That is really interesting, players mining the moon materials, would certainly increase the opportunities for players to increase their personal incomes, quite a few players have suggested this as a good idea. What would be the down sides though? Would it put to much pressure on the null Empires, if a primary income source was removed?

It certainly would play towards the declared goals of the Sov rebalance, but would it be too much? Too soon? And would hurting the Empire holders be in the best interest of the game? That could unleash a firestorm that would be quite traumatic for many.

The effects of this release are going to be greater than any of us realised at first. Wow.


Alliances would need a new income source before moons can be removed as a top up source.

There's still cost associated with sov, and generally running an alliance (Titan POS's, jump bridges, sov maintenance costs, logistics etc.), which line members don't like to open their wallets to. So some new income stream would be needed at an alliance level.



There is a simple fix to this. An alliance tax would fix a huge chunk of this. get a 5% tax on ALL income sources and you are good.

It seems like a big step though, i'll naturally leave the discussion of that to others, outside my area, but still facinating seeing just how many ripples, and how strong they are , even before the release of the sovereignty changes.

Certainly no assumptions can be made as to how it turns out, but personally I am impressed with the new thought process CCP are adopting of changing the tools, to make them in the control of individual groups of players, and let the player base decide what sort of universe they want to live in, rather than just one that is almost predetermined.

It is a facinating time, and I genuinely wish the whole of nullsec the very best of success in creating one that you are happy and thriving in.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2677 - 2015-03-05 22:15:52 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
First, CSM..I am yet to actually see a swath of stories this time around on how the CSM wasn't consulted or ignored on the proposed changes. In leiu of that we must assume then the bulk of the CSM gave nodding approval to these changes, and their silence now is approval after the fact (or pansied waiting to see which way popular vote blows first...).

Second, CCP obviously isn't trying to ruin the game. They are perhaps just trying to ruin your game.


Or, you know, that the CSM is under NDA, which means they can't tell you if they were consulted and/or agree with it.


we were consulted.

I do agree with most of it. But if I am not your rep maybe you should be ringing up the ones you do think represent you.

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)/¯
Arrendis
TK Corp
#2678 - 2015-03-05 22:20:49 UTC
Eli Apol wrote:
Promiscuous Female wrote:
Eli Apol wrote:
That's a LOT of iskies in moon goo that most line members never get to touch.

please tell us how alliance finances are run

I'll just hazard a guess that those R64 POS are complete deathstars set to shoot on sight absolutely everyone and only 2 people ever have the password... if it's not like that then you're probably doing something wrong...

amirite?


Yeah, because deathstars set to shoot absolutely everyone on sight are really friendly to logistics fleets there to rep them up.

And if you mean 'everyone who isn't blue', well, all our towers do that.
Arrendis
TK Corp
#2679 - 2015-03-05 22:22:13 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
I don't get any of it.


That's because you fly megathrons in every fleet!

(seriously, you should see this guy's fit for harpyfleet. It's a thing of crazy, crazy beauty.)
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#2680 - 2015-03-05 22:25:04 UTC
I have removed a rule breaking post.

The Rules:
27. Off-topic posting is prohibited.

Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued to the off-topic poster.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)