EVE General Discussion

I was there for it, and to me the only part that was an issue was the microtransaction part and the "super secret" information about how far that would extend outside of vanity items.

Honestly, beyond the fact that it took a bit of time I don't think it was as bad as people make out. Other features were still rolling out with it. The jump bridge changes were a pretty big part of that expansion too IIRC.

I don't see why it would be a problem. They've already got walking around the CQ working well, they've now got better separation for their service layers so interacting with non solarsystem stuff would be straight forward. They haven't lost the WoD stuff either, they didn't bin it or anything. They also have more experience with DUST now and hopefully with legion too, so I think it's a stretch to thing it's beyond their capabilities.

POS code is different because it's old core code they need to change without breaking the whole system. They stated last year at fanfest that POSes would in fact be easier if they just did new POSes that sat alongside the old ones and just phased out all old POSes, as adding new features is considerably easier than hacking old ones - but they didn't want to go that route.

http://www.examiner.com/article/mmos-space-eve-online-jumpgate-evolution-and-black-prophecy

http://news.mmosite.com/content/2009-09-25/20090925064415805,1.shtml

it's funny reading those knowing what happened, (EVe, still here, BP dead, JGE never launched)

Bookmarked this post so I can post it in 5 years just with new links to SC, Elite and No man's Sky

I would also like to see EVE be EVE, I just have no problem with them adding to what is EVE. They've added loads of new features over the years which didn't use to be EVE. They've even recently added the ability to fly your ships using keypresses, and I haven't seen you complain about that either. As long as it kept to the lore and improved the depth of the game, I'd have no issue with them expanding on the already existing CQ.

No, I simply don't believe that it is a lie. You're now trying to tell me that EVE was not designed to be immersive just because you say so. Prove it.

It didn't start with WiS, but who knows how long that was in the design for. What I do know is that to a certain extent it's already in the game. I'm really not sure how new NPCs is relevant at all here.

I'm not expecting anything. Well, that's a little unfair, I was expecting people who respond to actually read my posts but apparently you've not done that.

I'm sorry that I don't believe you are automatically right just because you say you are. I've played this game for 10 years and I'm entitled to my own opinions. If you don't like that and feel that everything I say is irrelevant, feel free to block me.

Have you had a look at Neocron recently? The GMs and some of the community were given permission to take over and run it as free to play, so it's gradually improving now. The old sync issues are vastly improved.

Exactly, that was the problem for you. My problem was the 18 months and no gameplay. Other people had other issues with it, because there was so many issues with it. I can't imagine how a single person can put there hand up and say "No, I was perfectly happy with what we got with Incarna" (and if they do, well congratulations, you still have all you wanted!)

A bit? I am still, to this day, angry about the minutes of the CSM 5 summit, where every single request, suggestion, and plead was met with "sorry, we are doing nothing on EvE til WiS is done". Every. Single. Request. Even then, it would have been forgivable had we recieved WiS, in any form what so ever. But that's the rub, we didn't. So, no, it didn't take a bit of time, simply because nothing ever got delivered.

If that was the core issue the NeX/NeS store would have been removed along with Aurum and the incident would have been brushed under the carpet. What we got was a company wide shift back to focusing on fixing the core game. And some fairly public grovelling and internal restructing/culling, which I'd imagine was fairly painful for senior management and only done out of necessity.

^ Yep. Regardless of the squawking over gold ammo and jeans, melted graphics cards and removing ship spinning, it was the announcement that there wouldn't be any FiS development for 18 months that ignited the playerbase. People across the game started muttering at various different stages, but the actual riots and 'to teh forums with yer pitchforks' call went out in null when that was announced. Those riots weren't accidental, and that threadnaught of 60 odd pages with people listing their unsubs wasn't an idle threat.

The people who came into game later or were less engaged at the time probably can't judge this easily (it's hard to tell if the zombie mission runners even noticed anything was going on), but the emergency summit meetings are on you-tube and they were not held purely to discuss microtransactions. There wouldn't have even been an emergency summit if it wasn't a massive issue. I can't believe people are ignorant about what an important flashpoint that was and still carp on about the uselessness of the CSM. It's one of the only times player reps went to development company and successfully pursuaded them to reverse a monumental series of mis-steps.

The Incarna riots were 2011. It's now 2015 and we still don't have a coherent, transparent roadmap for a sov revamp or a POS fix. EvE is dying, and has been since Dominion. Not because we don't get to gyrate in station, or new players can't be pursuaded to try the game. The spikes in new player accounts after the B-R/This is EvE vids demonstrate that new players can be attracted (and they don't come to play with the character creator). If nullsec dies, the game dies. Even if you don't play there, it's a mistake to underestimate how important sov space is.

Avatar gameplay might be viable for future development. It probably will attract players. But to implement it now with a broken core game would be as destructive as it was the first time round. At the end of it you might have a great 'Second Life in Space' cyber chat window, but it wouldn't be EvE. All of the EvE players would have left in disgust. It's not unreasonable for those of us who support the current FiS focus to defend it, although it must come as a real shock to those who do nothing but bleat at CCP over pretty much everything.

OK I'll try again.

The issue isn't about what people want. I personally would be delighted to see meaingful avatar gameplay added to EVE, The possibilities of literally adding a new dimension to the game are enormous. Done right, it would pull EVE to the next level.

The issue is that CCP clearly lacks the technical chops, the the organisational talent and above all the financial resources to produce WiS done right. CCP's now significantly reduced (from 2011 levels) resources are now wholly focused on what they know for sure works at bring in money in because they're unable to do anything else. Not saying CCP is dying, but they're certainly walking a tightrope, and every erg of dev resource they can muster is fully committed for a minum of 2 years.

It's a shame, but that's the evident truth. Making puppy eyes and saying in your cutest voice oh pwwwwease won't change that. Holding your breath. Won't change that. Throwing a tantrum won't change that.

There comes a point where persistent optimism in the face of obstacles becomes blind stupidity in the face of obvious facts. The WiSwhine threads have long since past that point.

you never learn

Just some random comments:

CCP's stance on eve has changed a lot over the years. When Eve first started, they stated they would like to be the best scifi game ever. But they dropped the ball.

I think CCP's biggest issue was this need to keep moving forward. Add new stuff, get new players, add new stuff, get new players. The problem with this is they left a lot of stuff to be broken and fester, and by the time they swung back around to look at it, it was in a state that had no choice but to either leave it, or rip it out.

Then they started working on other projects and again lost focus.

CCP did not so much fail at making the best scifi game, i would argue, that for all of eve flaws and issues, she is still one of, if not the, sexiest game on the market. As i once said before, in a sea of Dumb fake blondes, eve is the smart red head by the bar. Sure not everyone likes her, sure she is difficult to get to know, sure she will chew you up and spit you out, but she is worth the risk.

I firmly believe CCP made the right choice to kill WiS when they did, and WoD. CCP has make huge strides to fix eve, and still there is more to go (pi, sov, pos, rebalances, etc) and the new comition coming to eve's party to stand by her in the bar, just makes eve want to be better and work harder.

WiS could enhance eve. I think there are lots of game play elements that can come form WiS, i also think it can tie in valk and legion nicely with eve. Though, i think there is stll a ton more work to be finished before this can be done. As i said already, my opinion is let the people who want that aspect of eve pay for it by buying clothing and other items. Then you cna have a team figure out what tools and things can be done with it. I'm sure something useful can come. But tbh, right now, the best use of WiS is with legion exploring stations or as a way to 'capture or destroy' player built ones. Anyway, yes there are other games out there with avatar play. But they are not eve. And i rather like eve. I just think we can do WiS better then it is. And letting people who want it pay ccp to make it, ala a kick starter but with microtransactions is not a bad way to do it. Anyway my 2 isk

Dear space-God, THIS! Some of these guys would be like "you really should dye your hair blonde, you'll get more men that way", to which EVE says "I like real men, not those squishy bastids that like fake Blondes"