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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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Pro's and Con's of PvP small ships
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KiaphasKain
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2015-02-21 13:34:10 UTC
About to jump into pvp on an alt, and I have multiple choices open to me. The alt has practically just support (including gunnery support) skills trained so is not committed to any single race currently. I dont really have any pvp experience, so I am not sure what the current state of frigate pvp is (regarding ships).

From what I can see, it would seem that Gallente is the best overall race for frigate pvp right now. It has the Incursus, Tristan, Atron and Ishkur that seems to dominate frigate pvp right now.

Caldari it would seem that the Merlin is used fairly regularly, and thats it.

Minmatar I dont really know. I see a very loyal following for both the breacher and Slasher, but I also hear people say that projectiles isnt very competitive in pvp currently.

Amarr I have no idea, I dont see people talking much about amarr frigates.

Eventually I would like to have all the races, their tanks and their weapon systems trained, but I need to start somewhere I suppose. Am I right when I conclude that Gallente is the place I need to start
KiaphasKain
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2015-02-21 13:34:58 UTC
KiaphasKain wrote:
About to jump into pvp on an alt, and I have multiple choices open to me. The alt has practically just support (including gunnery support) skills trained so is not committed to any single race currently. I dont really have any pvp experience, so I am not sure what the current state of frigate pvp is (regarding ships).

From what I can see, it would seem that Gallente is the best overall race for frigate pvp right now. It has the Incursus, Tristan, Atron and Ishkur that seems to dominate frigate pvp right now.

Caldari it would seem that the Merlin is used fairly regularly, and thats it.

Minmatar I dont really know. I see a very loyal following for both the breacher and Slasher, but I also hear people say that projectiles isnt very competitive in pvp currently.

Amarr I have no idea, I dont see people talking much about amarr frigates.

Eventually I would like to have all the races, their tanks and their weapon systems trained, but I need to start somewhere I suppose. Am I right when I conclude that Gallente is the place I need to start



I am not including the Pirate ships right now, they seem to be very expensive and I need cheaper ships to learn in.
Azda Ja
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2015-02-21 14:05:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Azda Ja
Tristan is a fantastic frigate. You can fit it in so many different ways. Scram kite, long point kite, active tank, brick tank, neuts, full gank. You name it.

I don't have much experience with the Breacher, but I know quite a few people who love them dearly. They are vicious in scram range. Very tough (Hint: Medium Ancillary Shield Booster), and rockets + drones let them dish out consistent, non cap using DPS within 10km. I'm going to be taking some out for a spin myself soon I think.

Something like this seems to be a standard in FW lowsec:

[Breacher, MASB Brawler]

Damage Control II
Ballistic Control System II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

1MN Afterburner II
Medium Ancillary Shield Booster, Navy Cap Booster 50
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I

Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Inferno Rocket

Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I


Hobgoblin II x2

It's a little snug on CPU, use Meta modules for those you can't T2, do use the Medium Ancillary Shield booster though, coupled with the Ship's bonus you get incredibly powerful reps. Make sure you don't have the repairer cycling continuously though, you only have 9 charges before it runs out.

You're going to want to engage brawlers. DON'T hit approach or 'Orbit at 500m'. You want to do what's called "Scram Kiting". You are trying to orbit at around 7 to 8 km away from the target. Slow Blaster ships are ideal targets, just don't get close.

Something like this will cost you around 5 or 6 million ISK.

Buy a stack of frigates and take them out to FW space. Good luck, and happy hunting!

Grrr.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#4 - 2015-02-21 14:25:36 UTC
Yeah. The general FotM for cookie cutter flying lemmings is Gallente (I dont mean that in a negative sense, its just that A LOT of people fly ship 'x' with fit 'y' cause everybody else does. Be creative).

But in PvP, specially frigate PvP, the person with the ship that utilizes the best tactic in the current situation wins. (*hints to a laser bantam story*).

I've flown and seen a lot of 'thinking ouside the box' fits over the years. Some failed horribly, others worked perfect (ECM burst executioner squad for the win).

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Azda Ja
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2015-02-21 14:30:53 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
(*hints to a laser bantam story*).

I hate you.

Grrr.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#6 - 2015-02-21 15:23:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
Almost all combat ships can be good at solo PVP on low SP, and by "good" I mean can get kills well above their own pay grade. PVP is all about understanding tactics, game mechanics,weapon systems and ships and then have the experience to apply it all in combat. For more info on pvp tactics go here and watch the vid.

Ships that are newbie friendly:

Kestrel (a monster scram kiter)
Merlin (a bit obvious but still good)
Atron (can work both in kiting as brawl setup)
incursus (pure brawl)
Tristan (scram kiting drone ship)
Slasher (nice brawler)
Rifter (good scram kiter)
Executioner (amazingly good scram kiter or brawler)


Of all those I'd probably choose the Kestrel, Rifter or Executioner, kestrel is pretty much fool proof and the Executioner is much better than most people realise, even on low SP (as long as you can use Scorch).
Justin Zaine
#7 - 2015-02-21 16:29:46 UTC
I can vouch for the versatility of the Tristan. Great little ships to play around with and it's super cheap.

He will win who knows when to fight and when not to fight.

He will win who, prepared himself, waits to take the enemy unprepared.
Ines Tegator
Serious Business Inc. Ltd. LLC. etc.
#8 - 2015-02-21 16:54:29 UTC
Amarr ships specialize in damage projection. It's almost impossible to kite them cause they can all hit out to scram range with base tech 2 guns, no tracking mods needed. Most of them are slower as a cost, so in a solo situation, your target will often be able to escape unless you have help tackling. This means they end up being great fleet ships, but you won't see them much on the solo scene. The fast ones, like Executioner and Slicer, make great kiters of their own though.

Overhaul Dscan!
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#9 - 2015-02-21 17:06:03 UTC
Ines Tegator wrote:
Amarr ships specialize in damage projection. It's almost impossible to kite them cause they can all hit out to scram range with base tech 2 guns, no tracking mods needed. Most of them are slower as a cost, so in a solo situation, your target will often be able to escape unless you have help tackling. This means they end up being great fleet ships, but you won't see them much on the solo scene. The fast ones, like Executioner and Slicer, make great kiters of their own though.


Executioner is an amazing scram kiter with really high dps (at range), high speed, a good tank and it works fine on low SP. Works both in MWD/scram/web for 0.0 work as with ab/scram/web for low sec/FW.
Ned Thomas
Signal Cartel
EvE-Scout Enclave
#10 - 2015-02-21 18:19:47 UTC
Don't get locked into just one kind of ship. Frigates are cheap, the skills are quick, and they can all be effective. Fit up 10 different and go see what they doBig smile
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#11 - 2015-02-21 19:20:04 UTC
I feel like a lot of t1 amarr frigs are overshadowed by the navy slicer, as amarr was at tier4 in FW navy slicers are pretty cheap, over the last year they topped out around 12mil. I have seen a bunch of people that seem to like, and get kills, with the tormentor.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
KiaphasKain
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2015-02-21 19:25:36 UTC
Ned Thomas wrote:
Don't get locked into just one kind of ship. Frigates are cheap, the skills are quick, and they can all be effective. Fit up 10 different and go see what they doBig smile


I do want to try out all the ships, but I have to start somewhere!
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2015-02-21 19:55:07 UTC
KiaphasKain wrote:
Ned Thomas wrote:
Don't get locked into just one kind of ship. Frigates are cheap, the skills are quick, and they can all be effective. Fit up 10 different and go see what they doBig smile


I do want to try out all the ships, but I have to start somewhere!


The train for 'racial' frigats 3 and weapon system 3 takes 2 days tops.

So in 1 week you can have the skills to try out all 4 races and decide which one is the most fun for you.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#14 - 2015-02-21 20:16:02 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Frigate Pros (general):

- they are relatively fast compared to other ships
- they are relatively more mobile compared to other ships
- the two above points mean that a frigate can pick and choose engagements more easily

- they rely more on a player's personal skills than character skills.
- frigate combat has more variables that can dictate winning, losing, and escaping.
- there is a wider range of tactics you can try with frigates (brawling, kiting, sig-tanking, honor tanking, support, etc).
- many bigger ships are VERY weak in dealing with frigates

- frigates are relatively (dirt) cheap compared to other ships


Frigate Cons (general):

- they are relatively fragile compared to other ships
- if you make a completely wrong move then there is little to no margin to correct said move
- they are REALLY weak against bigger ships specifically fit to kill them
- some frigates do require you to "pimp" them to order to be really good
- frigate "staying power" comes through reliance of friends and/or allies... it is rare that a single frigate can "hold the field" by itself.



Specific Pros and Cons of each race (general):

Amarr: tanky powerhouses, but often require support to do anything "interesting" as they are mostly "foot soldier" type ships. They epitomize the phrase "one-trick-ponies."
Caldari: excel in support and range projection, but are often quite slow and have limited flexibility outside of each ships' role/specialization.
Gallente: brawlers through and through with some decent flexibility, but they often require high and/or diverse skills to draw out their full potential and can be quite fragile.
Minmatar: fast and flexible, but have flimsy tanks and anemic dps.

NOTE: there are exceptions for all of the above.

How did you Veterans start?
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2015-02-22 00:32:33 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Yeah. The general FotM for cookie cutter flying lemmings is Gallente (I dont mean that in a negative sense, its just that A LOT of people fly ship 'x' with fit 'y' cause everybody else does. Be creative).

But in PvP, specially frigate PvP, the person with the ship that utilizes the best tactic in the current situation wins. (*hints to a laser bantam story*).

I've flown and seen a lot of 'thinking ouside the box' fits over the years. Some failed horribly, others worked perfect (ECM burst executioner squad for the win).

... I may just have to try that ecm burst executioner, got a fit?

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