EVE General Discussion

I'd been meaning to reply to your post on page42 of this thread, but I've been really busy. I don't like most of what you propose. Here's why:

a) I think that while pilots would use your version of implants to PvP, they'd make some ships OP and would make re-balancing ships and modules harder than it is already. Balancing an implant for the hundreds of ships would not something I'd want to do as a game developer either.
b) I'd expect the costs of learning implants to rise and I don't count that as a good thing. End result would be something like 80% of Eve would be grinding L4 missions in the hope of learning implant story missions in high sec to make isk. I'd also be worried about the prices of pirate implants - those falling would just be another buff to high sec.
c) I think the whole system is complicated, and the wall of text that would have to be added for each to explain what the implant does to each ship would be biblical.
d) Your system favours the old pilot much more than the new and increases the SP gap between the two (when the old will already have in game experience, and maybe fleet boosts, blue pill/crash, hardwiring etc on top of maxed skills anyway.)

There is a forum for features and ideas where your proposal would get attention from the more serious Eve players though. GD is just for shiptoasting so don't take it personally when folks ignore your ideas.

Tell you what, when your ship respawns back in station with your skill hardwiring implants that you had when you get podded, then we will have WOW in space, till then Eve is still Eve learning implants or not.

I made a post some time ago, with a suggestion based on CCP removing atts, remaps and learning implants. We would have a flat 2700 for all skills.

This falls into line in regards to CCPs removal of clone costs and their use in the future also.
Basically medical clones would be based on attributes and which ever one you buy, would help boost your profession in some way. This would take the atts out of training and place them directly into game play.

I.E.

• Gunnery clone: High perc and will.


• Logistics clone: High Perc and Intel.


• Trading clone: High Char and memory.

etc etc.
Each attribute could be tailored to boost certain bonuses in skills. This could even be linked with On Grid Boosting in the future.
There could even be the addition of new attributes from newly discovered Sleeper/Jovian tech.

All would work as now and could still be used as jump clones. But the medical application of attributes at creation, will help boost certain professions.

I can't agree with CCP Darwin more. I did a ton of reading and research before starting EVE Online a few days ago. But even still, the first few days I totally forgot about the attributes, remaps and learning implants. When it came to what skills to learn and train, I just picked the stuff that enabled my interests. I am a bit all over the place trying things out and I loved it.

But because I love to read forums and such and seeing this thread, I was reminded attributes, remaps and learning implants exists. Now I'm sitting here trying to figure out the most optimal way to train and it does not even remotely resemble the choices I was making earlier and more importantly - is not fun at all.

It leaves no room for me to explore and try new things. Like some strict diet where there is no room for the enjoyable foods. The whole time I keep asking myself, "What if I spend this whole year training into something I don't find enjoyable at the end of the year?" I just want to enjoy the game and have fun. I hate having to endure certain game mechanics that leave me with no enjoyable options. Either endure a year not having fun or fall further and further behind. That is hardly a good choice now is it.

I want to specialize in frigates, but to do that means I most certainly will not be sticking to just Perception and Willpower skills. I will be training skills that will be across all the attributes. But to do that would mean falling behind. I could try and make up for it by shoving learning implants into my head, but that means a good deal of ISK and going out of my way to not be podded. It just puts me into situations that are not enjoyable. I don't want to play like that. I would rather spend that ISK on my ship and setup. Sure if I had been playing for years and year and had all these support skills and core ships already trained; setting up a year long training path that stuck to just two attributes would be really easy. But I'm not. There is a ton of skills I need to train across all attributes if I want to be remotely decent at specializing into a frigate.

I really enjoy making decisions where I have to deal with risk and reward. Strategic decisions and the like. But having to decide which path to walk down when all presented to me are equally terrible...

So the first year of the game I have to pick between leveling up my ship or leveling up my support skills... Wow. Thanks.

Let me ask you this. Would you rather me enjoy the game and risk more and more ships because I have the skills to fly them somewhat decently.

-or-

Twiddle my thumbs being risk averse for the first year or so because I have to stick to a strict skill plan that only lets me work on one aspect of my skills at a time.

Which one do you think is going to be the one that keeps me logging in?

Ask yourself this; are you against the removal of learning implants, remaps and attributes because you had to suffer through it?

That's exactly how I look at annuals. It's not really blank, as it's a clear amount ($131 USD per annual), but yeah, I feel the same way about making those payments.

Lately I've begun cancelling the recurring billing right away, and left my biggest gripe as the reason, and the phrase "one year at a time ;-)"

If I seem especially vicious on EVE-O, just keep in mind that I'm a paying customer, to the tune of ten annuals per year, or $1,310.00 USD ;-)

that's... not counting the PLEX and AUR purchases because lazy and RP (and I love clothes).

I'm not saying be rude. I try not to be. It's just some things hit me a little harder than others, for being 10x. There's also a fair bit of interplay between ships that most players don't see, but I feel when I'm logi, dps, boosts, and scouts for myself.

so you're saying that all new players, because of a ****** attribute system, should not be able to train optimally?

stop prenteding there's effort anywhere in here; you simply cannot optimally train basic skills as a new player due to the fact that they all use different attributes which forces them to either training half of them painfully slow, or all of them just plain slowly.

the only thing they can do optimally is train a bunch of skills that without other skills are borderline useless. congratulations, you can fly all of the cruisers with t2 guns... can't fit any of them because you've got no support skills.

why should new players have to accept that the only way for them to train for the first few months is suboptimally?

lies?

not in the slightest; tanking skills and gunnery skills use two totally different sets of attributes. it's an undenyable fact that you cannot train both optimally on the same remap. this leaves the situation where new players, who need both sets of skills are FORCED to train at least one, if not both of these types of skills suboptimally.

feel free to find a lie there, but that's the reality of the situation.

for the likes of (probably) you and (definitely) me, who are probably somewhere around the point where our support/fitting/tanking skills are where they need to be - we can comfortably sit in a per/will remap and cross train all the guns/ships optimally and not care about attribute remaps for years at a time. new players do not have this luxury.

you are not forced to do anything, you make a chioce. there's the lie.

Go create a blank character in EFT, select a chosen path with decent skills that any newbie would be proud of. I made one for caldari with missile skills, T2 light med drones, T2 light missiles for frigate pvp and a Raven for PVE. All lvl 4 ship skills and proper support skills. Total SP count just under 8 mil.

- with base attribs total training time is 175 days
- with perc/int total training time is 160 days
- with 3 remaps for perc/wil, int/mem and mem/perc (drones), which would be dumb as hell as it's a waste but lets go with it, total training time is 152 days



So, by not using a pretty standard perc/int remap and instead going for a ******** "lets waste all my 3 remaps right away" OCD attitude you gained.... 8 days, out of 160 total. That's like 5%? WHO GIVES A ****!



In short: less hyperbole, more facts and maths.