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What about Off Grid Boosting?

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Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#501 - 2014-12-09 19:24:21 UTC
Ong wrote:
Shaleb Heworo wrote:
Ogb is a unique tool unlike any other which becomes available due to "off limit" out of sandbox action (paying for a second account) and only to a certain part of the player base.



But thats compleatly untrue, you can choose to train a second account and have OGD links yourself, or ecm alt or anothr dps alt or a probing alt to probe the OGB char and kill them, its part of the sandbox. Bringing your inability to fund a 2nd account either via rl money or plex is your issue and should not be part of the argument for or against OGB.

Shaleb Heworo wrote:


While ogb doesn't make you fully automatically win or lose it massively decreases the margin for error for the solo guy and at the same time increases it for the gang he fights. Simply because 18km webs and snake speed across the bord will get you killed in a kiting ship when the pilots you're fighting are only half way competent.



Sorry but now you just sound like your crying because you cant kyte all the things in your ships that abuse the OP nature of scorch.


Your argument is that you should be allowed to bring whatever advantage to the table you possibly can whether derived in-game or from RL financing. If you follow that argument through to it's logical conclusion are you not advocating unrestrained pay to win gameplay? Otherwise you have to put borders on the sandbox, which ccp has already done where they deem it reasonable. This is a game, other people also play it, you don't get to slaughter them mercilessly just because you spend more time and money on it; and then go to the forums with your CODE alt to complain about how afraid people are of PvP.
Raydn James
Coven.
Black Rabbit.
#502 - 2014-12-09 19:41:09 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
Gavin Dax wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Yes, a second account for a boosting alt helps you in a fight.
Nerf OGB.

A second account for a logi alt helps you in a fight.
Nerf logi.

A second account for a Falcon alt helps you in a fight.
Nerf Falcon.

A second account for a DPS alt helps you in a fight.
Nerf DPS.


OGB, logi, and ECM are all broken. EVE would be a much better game without these things.

OGB has the worst risk/reward balance of those though. It's also not something that someone would reasonably do on their main.

shiiiet that's all I do baby.


Looks at main

Training FC 5
3/4 mindlink specs trained

yep, no one does this on their main

Also, I've been gone a while, but whoever gave me the Myrm hull for the Eos... Well, If I ever make it to Fanfest, drinks are on me.
Shaleb Heworo
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#503 - 2014-12-09 19:49:08 UTC
Ong wrote:
But thats compleatly untrue, you can choose to train a second account and have OGD links yourself, or ecm alt or anothr dps alt or a probing alt to probe the OGB char and kill them, its part of the sandbox. Bringing your inability to fund a 2nd account either via rl money or plex is your issue and should not be part of the argument for or against OGB.




Imo you argument is analytically flawed because the units of the system or the sandbox of Eve are clearly player characters and not players. Therefore the reference point of any balancing and/or rules of the sandbox are always the player characters. In other words: What a capsuleer can or can not do should be determined by his ingame actions and certainly not by the ability of willingness of the player behind the character to pay for a second account which he doesn't really have to play to get massive boni for his main. What kind of argument is that anyway? Players who are rl poor shouldn't be able to compete in pvp? Seriously?

It has been discussed in great detail in what regard ogb unlike ecm, logis or any other mechanic really breaks the rules that otherwise constitute the sandbox which is why your enumeration is misleading as much as your proposal to solve the issue with a probing alt. The main point is that the notion that if you want to do things on your own you need a second account is devastating for Eves appeal to new players. It ads a terrible static element to eve pvp with these ridiculous link boats hugging stations or gates almost everywhere and it effectively dumbs down tactics due to massively powerful uniform boni. if you like that kind of thing: To each his own but it's certainly not good for the quantity aswell as the for quality of eve pvp -or for subscription numbers

Ong wrote:
Sorry but now you just sound like your crying because you cant kyte all the things in your ships that abuse the OP nature of scorch.


C'mon...
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#504 - 2014-12-09 19:57:24 UTC
Shaleb Heworo wrote:


Ong wrote:
Sorry but you just sound like your crying because you cant kyte all the things in your ships that abuse the OP nature of scorch.


C'mon...



Lolwut? Have you even SEEN a linked garmur? Every time I fly a slicer somebody just undocks a TD condor/hookbill.
Cancel Align NOW
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#505 - 2014-12-09 20:00:51 UTC
Shaleb Heworo wrote:

Imo you argument is analytically flawed because the units of the system or the sandbox of Eve are clearly player characters and not players. Therefore the reference point of any balancing and/or rules of the sandbox are always the player characters. In other words: What a capsuleer can or can not do should be determined by his ingame actions and certainly not by the ability of willingness of the player behind the character to pay for a second account which he doesn't really have to play to get massive boni for his main. What kind of argument is that anyway? Players who are rl poor shouldn't be able to compete in pvp? Seriously?



IMO your argument is trumped by the advertisement on The Eve Launcher for side kick accounts. CCP are selling side kick accounts for $24.95 for 90 days. That is less than $9.00 a month. That gives me the impression CCP want to make it financially easy to step up from one account to two accounts. If that premise is true then your attempt to define what is sandbox and what is not is out of line with the CCP's definition of what a sandbox is or is not.
Shaleb Heworo
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#506 - 2014-12-09 20:34:23 UTC
Cancel Align NOW wrote:
Shaleb Heworo wrote:

Imo you argument is analytically flawed because the units of the system or the sandbox of Eve are clearly player characters and not players. Therefore the reference point of any balancing and/or rules of the sandbox are always the player characters. In other words: What a capsuleer can or can not do should be determined by his ingame actions and certainly not by the ability of willingness of the player behind the character to pay for a second account which he doesn't really have to play to get massive boni for his main. What kind of argument is that anyway? Players who are rl poor shouldn't be able to compete in pvp? Seriously?



IMO your argument is trumped by the advertisement on The Eve Launcher for side kick accounts. CCP are selling side kick accounts for $24.95 for 90 days. That is less than $9.00 a month. That gives me the impression CCP want to make it financially easy to step up from one account to two accounts. If that premise is true then your attempt to define what is sandbox and what is not is out of line with the CCP's definition of what a sandbox is or is not.


Well if the add would say: "Green your Kb for just $24.95. With an OGB-Alt you can!" or something like that then I would certainly agree.Fact of the matter is that they put out adds for alt accounts which by itself is in no way false or problematic from where i'm standing. On the contrary: I'm glad when ccp makes additional cash and alts divert attention too Big smile

On a more serious note: As others and I have stated the problem lies with ogb and only with ogb specifically and not with alts in general.