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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#7321 - 2014-10-07 00:04:22 UTC
SanDooD wrote:
Incarna -> Summer of Rage
Phoebe -> Winter of Rage

TwistedXTwisted

More like Winter of Fatigue

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7322 - 2014-10-07 00:16:00 UTC
We figured bittervet syndrome would be the demise of EVE.

Lets have some bitterdev syndrome to compare it to.
t'raq mardon
Laminated Metals
#7323 - 2014-10-07 00:19:55 UTC
Sigras wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
Sigras wrote:
how is it that you dont see this change as a buff? for any small fleet operating in a limited area, this change is fantastic news. Now you can deploy your caps in combat without it being hot drop o'clock 23.5/7

Sure your jump range may be a bit more limited, but did you miss the part where you can use gates?

im not sure what possible small gang low sec application you could possibly be using your caps for that would be worse after the change.

Never said I lived in lowsec and if that is the option left to me, the result is the same.. Unsub capital toons.

I did mention jumping capitals through gates and as i said, I don't want to have to travel with a lot of other carriers plus a support fleet to be able to go through gates.

Small gang, where there may be 15 or 20 of us. 2 or 3 scouts, with cynos go out find us a target which we then jump on. Much of our time is spent doing Blops but when we can we like to use our caps. Jump fatigue is all but removing our style of play, it is by no means a buff. Our chances of being dropped by a larger group will increase with these changes as we would be FORCED to use gates in hostile territory.

Sorry but I'm not seeing any positives here for small gangs.

So right now you have 15-20 cap ships hugging a station with 2-3 scouts out there looking for a target that you can hot drop?

And you do this in 0.0 somehow? and you routinely travel a distance of more than 5 LY away from your cap staging system when you do this? (also you realize that a 5 LY operational envelope is the entire region of curse minus 3 systems plus about 1/5 of the great wildlands?)

Where in the hell do you operate?

additionally, it might call for a bit of a change in strategy, but I think that you could still reasonably play this way... no problem.


assuming they are making two or three jumps, instead of the one they are now they could be looking at a fairly significant delay between when they lock down a target and when they can drop on them. even if it is only two jumps you are talking a several minute delay in getting to the target so little to no chance of the tackler surviving. then you have an even longer delay in being able to gtfo so plenty of time for reinforcements to arrive and tackle and kill them. So no, it wouldn't really wouldn't be possible after the changes unless you are within 5AU, and even then it would be a pretty big risk
Banjo String
Steel Winters Stellar Enterprises
#7324 - 2014-10-07 00:26:10 UTC
I havent seen anyone mention this yet, but I'm pretty interested to see how and where new market hubs spring up to deal with the difficulty of rapidly pulling in supplies from Jita and friends.
Christopher Mabata
Northern Accounts and Systems
#7325 - 2014-10-07 00:39:51 UTC
Banjo String wrote:
I havent seen anyone mention this yet, but I'm pretty interested to see how and where new market hubs spring up to deal with the difficulty of rapidly pulling in supplies from Jita and friends.


odds are you wont see that happen in soverign null sec due to the docking restrictions, and the majority of NPC null will be difficult to reach with the range changes, not to mention the extreme danger of the systems being camped or being stuck in station by a dictor or an anchored bubble. Risk more likely than not outweighs the rewards.

However low sec hubs may be a thing, perfect midpoint from null leading towards highsec, far less dangerous overall since you cant be bubbled or really camped into station if you plan accordingly but on the same token it could end up like the CONCORD sec status reclaiming centers with people just using tornados to alpha haulers and rob their goods. should be interesting though, who knows what could happen

♣ Small Gang PVP, Large Fleet PVP, Black Ops, Incursions, Trade, and Industry ♣ 70% Lethal / 30% Super-Snuggly / 110% No idea what im doing ♣

This Message Brought to you by a sweet and sour bittervet
Christopher Mabata
Northern Accounts and Systems
#7326 - 2014-10-07 00:42:21 UTC
Hagika wrote:
Christopher Mabata wrote:
Hagika wrote:
SFM Hobb3s wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
This thread still full of fear mongering and deception?



And Glorious tears. Being an optimist I always prefer to see it as the cup being half full. But no. Its damned full and overflowing. It's gonna be soo much fun...


It doesnt matter if your glass is half full or empty when it is filled with ****.

Sincerely,

A Realist....


Depending on how much fiber is in your diet you actually could have an issue getting it in the cup, So it leaves the is it half full or full open to interpretation especially if theres air pockets

Sincerely
A former Nutritionist



The word was p i s s =) No issue getting that into a cup. For the other substance, i just need 2 girls P



I don't get nightmares very often but i know that now i will be seeing that shiet in my sleep again Ugh
also either way that was a four letter word with no hints, kinda like playing forum hangman for all i know it could have been MOTD

♣ Small Gang PVP, Large Fleet PVP, Black Ops, Incursions, Trade, and Industry ♣ 70% Lethal / 30% Super-Snuggly / 110% No idea what im doing ♣

This Message Brought to you by a sweet and sour bittervet
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#7327 - 2014-10-07 00:42:42 UTC
t'raq mardon wrote:


maybe. or more likely the major alliances will build another few thousand caps an station them more frequently around the map making it impossible for anyone who isn't just as big to take them on anywhere they decide is their space. As for low sec, you will all become pets for the purpose of logistics for the major power blocks or you will be steamrolled by said capitals and replaced with someone more domesticated. Frankly, that will be the first thing that happens since alliances can't make isk without logistics and a secure logistics chain will be worth whatever it takes to squash wanna be pirates like you.


Nah, we'll just steal your junk when you bring it through.
t'raq mardon
Laminated Metals
#7328 - 2014-10-07 01:01:32 UTC
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
t'raq mardon wrote:


maybe. or more likely the major alliances will build another few thousand caps an station them more frequently around the map making it impossible for anyone who isn't just as big to take them on anywhere they decide is their space. As for low sec, you will all become pets for the purpose of logistics for the major power blocks or you will be steamrolled by said capitals and replaced with someone more domesticated. Frankly, that will be the first thing that happens since alliances can't make isk without logistics and a secure logistics chain will be worth whatever it takes to squash wanna be pirates like you.


Nah, we'll just steal your junk when you bring it through.


lol, no you won't.
Reboot It
Duct Tape Mafia
#7329 - 2014-10-07 01:01:33 UTC
EVE was a lot better in the old days before Caps / Supers.

Get rid of them.

You are trying to make EVE feel bigger like it used to be when the biggest thing out there was a BS.

I know you can't do this because the cat is already out of the bag so all you can do is try and fix it a bit. But no matter what you do a lot of the player base won't like it. They will cry and threaten to quit but they won't and you know that. They will learn to live with whatever you come up with and even go around it in some way you haven't thought of.

EVE should feel huge and it doesn't.
Logistics should be a pain the rear. After all that is what makes this more than just an arcade game and makes it feel more "real".
Taking somebody's home away from them should never be stopped. But it needs to be damn hard to do.
Super's should never be allowed out of null sec.

When they gave us the ability to buy a Titan with a credit card there should have been a public hanging for whomever came up with that stupid idea.
Sigras
Conglomo
#7330 - 2014-10-07 01:01:54 UTC
t'raq mardon wrote:
Sigras wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
Sigras wrote:
how is it that you dont see this change as a buff? for any small fleet operating in a limited area, this change is fantastic news. Now you can deploy your caps in combat without it being hot drop o'clock 23.5/7

Sure your jump range may be a bit more limited, but did you miss the part where you can use gates?

im not sure what possible small gang low sec application you could possibly be using your caps for that would be worse after the change.

Never said I lived in lowsec and if that is the option left to me, the result is the same.. Unsub capital toons.

I did mention jumping capitals through gates and as i said, I don't want to have to travel with a lot of other carriers plus a support fleet to be able to go through gates.

Small gang, where there may be 15 or 20 of us. 2 or 3 scouts, with cynos go out find us a target which we then jump on. Much of our time is spent doing Blops but when we can we like to use our caps. Jump fatigue is all but removing our style of play, it is by no means a buff. Our chances of being dropped by a larger group will increase with these changes as we would be FORCED to use gates in hostile territory.

Sorry but I'm not seeing any positives here for small gangs.

So right now you have 15-20 cap ships hugging a station with 2-3 scouts out there looking for a target that you can hot drop?

And you do this in 0.0 somehow? and you routinely travel a distance of more than 5 LY away from your cap staging system when you do this? (also you realize that a 5 LY operational envelope is the entire region of curse minus 3 systems plus about 1/5 of the great wildlands?)

Where in the hell do you operate?

additionally, it might call for a bit of a change in strategy, but I think that you could still reasonably play this way... no problem.


assuming they are making two or three jumps, instead of the one they are now they could be looking at a fairly significant delay between when they lock down a target and when they can drop on them. even if it is only two jumps you are talking a several minute delay in getting to the target so little to no chance of the tackler surviving. then you have an even longer delay in being able to gtfo so plenty of time for reinforcements to arrive and tackle and kill them. So no, it wouldn't really wouldn't be possible after the changes unless you are within 5AU, and even then it would be a pretty big risk

Sure, as I said, their operational envelope shrinks quite a bit, but 5 LY is actually a pretty large area when going system to system (like I said the entire region of curse can be covered in 5 LY).

Also, if scouts confirm that there is nobody to engage within 5 LY every direction, it's probably safe to jump the darn gates and fly to a new location.

That plus the decreased risk of a counter drop I call a cumulative buff.
Nazri al Mahdi
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#7331 - 2014-10-07 01:04:10 UTC
Edisonn Trent wrote:
I just resubbed this account, just to say I support these changes. If you follow through with this, I'll resub the rest. Call me trusting if you like, but for these kind of changes, CCP can have my stuff.

That's it, that's what I resubbed for. That and the blobber's tears. Seriously, if they're crying, you must be doing something right.

I for one think it's brilliant to prioritize ex-customers over current ones.

These changes are good, but the JF range nerf is way, way too severe to preserve the diverse resource landscape. One or the other must give.
t'raq mardon
Laminated Metals
#7332 - 2014-10-07 01:04:35 UTC
Mona Me wrote:
... As for not bothering to read the posts after 200, it seems to me that some of the best ideas came after this benchmark...


not really... if you read his posts the new idea stop coming pretty quickly and he continues to respond to the same things over and over. also, I'm not saying no one is reading all these post, just that greyscale put in a good effort to keep up with the thread for like 12 hours and it was impressive
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#7333 - 2014-10-07 01:09:23 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
This thread still full of fear mongering and deception?

Aren't you getting exactly what you wanted? No snark, I'm legitimately curious.

I wonder if the result will be what you expect.

To be frank, I am and then some. It pleases me the announcement of these changes alone is causing many players to come back to the game. Various non-bloc groups rubbing their hands and discussing how to finally be able to carve out a section of null for themselves.

We are all venturing into the unknown. Adventure has finally shown her face again and everyone is happy.

Well.. almost everyone.


Many more leaving or cutting off their cyno alts to jump their caps or run their freighters.

The loss is far more than gain, easily...

I cancelled my main and my alts. Quite a few accounts.
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#7334 - 2014-10-07 01:11:15 UTC
t'raq mardon wrote:
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
t'raq mardon wrote:


maybe. or more likely the major alliances will build another few thousand caps an station them more frequently around the map making it impossible for anyone who isn't just as big to take them on anywhere they decide is their space. As for low sec, you will all become pets for the purpose of logistics for the major power blocks or you will be steamrolled by said capitals and replaced with someone more domesticated. Frankly, that will be the first thing that happens since alliances can't make isk without logistics and a secure logistics chain will be worth whatever it takes to squash wanna be pirates like you.


Nah, we'll just steal your junk when you bring it through.


lol, no you won't.


You're new here aren't you.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#7335 - 2014-10-07 01:13:10 UTC
Reboot It wrote:
They will cry and threaten to quit but they won't and you know that.

Definitely, this is never an issue for CCP and they know that

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Burl en Daire
M.O.M.S. Corp
#7336 - 2014-10-07 01:15:18 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
SanDooD wrote:
Incarna -> Summer of Rage
Phoebe -> Winter of Rage

TwistedXTwisted

More like Winter of Fatigue



I was thinking more like monsoon season. Lots of threats but probably very little action or follow through.

Yesterday's weirdness is tomorrow's reason why. Hunter S. Thompson
Christopher Mabata
Northern Accounts and Systems
#7337 - 2014-10-07 01:16:17 UTC
Hagika wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
This thread still full of fear mongering and deception?

Aren't you getting exactly what you wanted? No snark, I'm legitimately curious.

I wonder if the result will be what you expect.

To be frank, I am and then some. It pleases me the announcement of these changes alone is causing many players to come back to the game. Various non-bloc groups rubbing their hands and discussing how to finally be able to carve out a section of null for themselves.

We are all venturing into the unknown. Adventure has finally shown her face again and everyone is happy.

Well.. almost everyone.


Many more leaving or cutting off their cyno alts to jump their caps or run their freighters.

The loss is far more than gain, easily...

I cancelled my main and my alts. Quite a few accounts.



Can i have your stuff? Please?

♣ Small Gang PVP, Large Fleet PVP, Black Ops, Incursions, Trade, and Industry ♣ 70% Lethal / 30% Super-Snuggly / 110% No idea what im doing ♣

This Message Brought to you by a sweet and sour bittervet
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#7338 - 2014-10-07 01:21:49 UTC
t'raq mardon wrote:
Mona Me wrote:
... As for not bothering to read the posts after 200, it seems to me that some of the best ideas came after this benchmark...


not really... if you read his posts the new idea stop coming pretty quickly and he continues to respond to the same things over and over. also, I'm not saying no one is reading all these post, just that greyscale put in a good effort to keep up with the thread for like 12 hours and it was impressive

Basically all these posts are just a bunch of people echoing trolls and is of minimal value

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
raz1980
TEMPLAR.
The Initiative.
#7339 - 2014-10-07 01:24:14 UTC
What a bone way to nerf capsRoll
t'raq mardon
Laminated Metals
#7340 - 2014-10-07 01:30:07 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
t'raq mardon wrote:
Mona Me wrote:
... As for not bothering to read the posts after 200, it seems to me that some of the best ideas came after this benchmark...


not really... if you read his posts the new idea stop coming pretty quickly and he continues to respond to the same things over and over. also, I'm not saying no one is reading all these post, just that greyscale put in a good effort to keep up with the thread for like 12 hours and it was impressive

Basically all these posts are just a bunch of people echoing trolls and is of minimal value


if by trolls you mean the vast majority of anyone who has ever tried to maintain the logistics necessary to supply a group of people more than 3 jumps out of highsec then ya. It is of pretty minimal value at this point though, not a lot of new comments being made