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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

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Fret Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5581 - 2014-10-03 14:51:22 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
BuddyKnife wrote:

I don't think you understand the scale we are talking. I don't have exact numbers but I know we have over 2,000 reaction towers that need materials that are not from our space. That kind of logistics is not possible without the use of jump freighters and making it so you have to spend 4x the time moving things is just going to make people quit. Not to mention the effects on the economy.


For years we have read Goons saying they were different from others (expecially BoB), because they were NOT the typical "elite hard core guild" of EQ / WoW memory and basically most of them did not even care to join fleets and lived an happy & casual life.


Suddenly it looks like you became super-committed, with giant cogs to keep oiled and make run at all costs else people will mass quit.

That reeks of BoB-itis to me. Are you telling me you got BoB-itis disease? Shocked



Goons were always super commited.

There logi departments in 06-08 were just flat out amazingly well done. Simply epic.

Still is.

I don't think anyone really beleives that any changes you make at this point will break up the powerblocs. Eve is simply an old MMO at this point.

But you can make it more fun for people not in powerblocs. Limiting jumping range/speed etc. like this current patch. Adding more NPC stations dotted throughout null. Lowering structure amounts on POS's and decreasing timers.

Yes though no-one is breaking up colilitions it is just simply not going to happen at this point.

But maybe we can make the game a little more fun and competitive :)
Ochiniwa
No.Mercy
Triumvirate.
#5582 - 2014-10-03 14:51:43 UTC
Nostromo Fidanza wrote:
Ochiniwa wrote:
Guys,

This is just the beginning of the change.

To all the "rage-quitters"... this is a game you buy, you do not like it, well do not pay for it. As easy as that.

If the game dies, so what, go out there and play something else. We are all here to have fun and if you no longer have fun, move on.

To all those predicting what this change will bring, do not forget what CCP states in the dev blog, this is the first of many changes. They want us to have fun and make money out of this, well help them, make constructive criticism and we will have more fun and they will have more money. WIN-WIN :)

Easy said but not so easy done.

In the meantime I trust they will keep on challenging us and bring us change and upgrades in the next years...

Enjoy


I think we can end the thread with this. Close it down please


Not really, my point is: "make constructive criticism and we will have more fun and they will have more money".

I do see a lot of this type of feedback and CCP is taking out most of it.

My message was mostly to the guys stating: If you make this change, I quit.. What does this help ? Basically anything you change there will be people not liking it, human beings are always afraid of the unknown and cosy with the known.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#5583 - 2014-10-03 14:51:47 UTC
True Sight wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
food for tought.. the vast majority of those were 0.0 dwellers and LEFT 0.0 because the game got BORIGN capital ships online. And we are happy because how 0.0 will be interestign enough for us to return.


food for thought... perhaps you're right and the reduction of power projection being gone will make them want to move back to 0.0, but when they realise how difficult it is to actually go anywhere now, even slowly, that their new 0.0 doesn't offer a stable JF service and they can't reach the alliance cyno beacons, they'll not bother going back at all.


Might sound odd, but we stayed for years with just regular industrial ships (that is, without even a normal freighter) and somehow people still went to null.

What happened? That having difficult logistics easily causes isulation and fragmentation which lead to a number of small entities. Those small entities are ever changing and figthing for the better lands and this brings back classic EvE.

No more 3 trillions battles once a year, that cause TiDi but thousands of smaller and more enjoyable fights.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Arsine Mayhem
Doomheim
#5584 - 2014-10-03 14:51:49 UTC
Alp Khan wrote:

However, the reality with the computer games is that once they stop being satisfying, entertaining and being fun, consumers (players) move on to alternatives, and drop your product.


You mean like what is happening now.
Alp Khan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5585 - 2014-10-03 14:53:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Alp Khan
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:
ergherhdfgh wrote:
Kal Azkar wrote:
This idea is terrible, and trying to fix it is just making it worse... there are lots of other methods I am sure, but I question why are we only getting answers from the Devs when suggestions are being made. The Devs are paid money by CCP from our Subs to create ways for the paying customers to have fun and enjoy their time.


CCP is a corporate entity. It's job and there fore everyone that works for them's job is to make money. If there was a way I could emphasize the period on the end of "make money." I would because that is it end of story. The Devs job is not to create ways for paying customers to have fun they increase your fun level only in as much as it increases or at least as much as they think it will increase their bottom line.

Now-a-days most game manufacturers higher Psychiatrists and Psychologists to advise them on how to get people to continue to pay money. The lawyers and the bean counters also have a say in this.

You many say well obviously if the game is fun then they'll make money and the more fun the game is the more money they will make but you are wrong or at least the business model of today will tell them you are wrong.

Cigarette manufacturers didn't look for ways to make cigarettes taste better or anything like that they looked for ways to make them more addictive. Food manufacturers put sugar and corn sweeteners into most of our food for the same reason. TV shows often are not as concerned with making a show that you enjoy watching so much as they are making sure that you tune in next week which is why we have cliff hangars not only at the end of every show but just before each commercial break.

Like wise CCP is more focused on getting you "hooked" on the game than they are making sure you have fun. They want your money not your fun.


However, the reality with the computer games is that once they stop being satisfying, entertaining and being fun, consumers (players) move on to alternatives, and drop your product.



Sicne this is a PVP game, the main fun focus shoudl be changes that create more confict... like this one. Thanks for supporting the changes then.


Let me fix that for you: PVP is only a singular aspect of EVE, which is actually a sandbox.
And trust me, when you are dealing with human tendency to cooperate and collude in the face of mutual gains, you are not going to drive up conflict, no matter what you do.
Josef Djugashvilis
#5586 - 2014-10-03 14:55:41 UTC
remus wulf wrote:
What cap pilot in their right mind is going to risk billions of isk to use gates ? Come on seriously people.


So, the null-sec tough guys who scorn the hi-sec 'care-bears' for being risk averse, are not so tough after all.

This is not a signature.
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#5587 - 2014-10-03 14:56:20 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
True Sight wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
food for tought.. the vast majority of those were 0.0 dwellers and LEFT 0.0 because the game got BORIGN capital ships online. And we are happy because how 0.0 will be interestign enough for us to return.


food for thought... perhaps your right and the reduction of power projection being gone will make them want to move back to 0.0, but when they realise how difficult it is to actually go anywhere now, even slowly, that their new 0.0 doesn't offer a stable JF service and they can't reach the alliance cyno beacons, they'll not bother going back at all.



Most of us lived in 0.0 when these things did not exist. We are not cry babies, we will not stop playing because of such pitiful things.


Current 0.0 generation are spoiled kids.

aside from the cyno beacons, no you didn't
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5588 - 2014-10-03 14:57:44 UTC
I am popping on to express my support for CCP with these proposed changes.

The Amarr/Minmatar warzone should benefit from Null Sec alliances having to pay a real price in man power and force projection to maintain their bored presence here.

Here's to the end of PL capital drops on a handful of cruisers 'for the lulz'.

Hey people may even undock battleships again!
True Sight
Deep Freeze Industries
#5589 - 2014-10-03 14:58:40 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
What ccp wants is that you should NOT have so many tower to refuel and should surely not have them far away from each other.


As I stated in an earlier post. There are two types of players in EVE that are involved in large corporation or alliance wide logistics. the first is a very small subset of the player base that genuinely enjoys doing logistics, organizing and maintaining things, in the large corporations and alliances, these players are known as "that 'f'ing amazing guy that makes my life easier", the rest are those that do it on a varying level of dislike but know it has to be done.

At one point I lived in Pure Blind and was responsible for refueling 12 towers, all within a relatively short distance of each other. I would go through the happy-fun math of working out the exact amount of Oyxgen, Isotopes, robotics etc I needed to keep every single tower optimally fueled, then light a cyno at each one, jump in, refuel and move on.

The new arguement is "well, people should like, have escorts and stuff now, and they should slow-boat their 7b isk ship across 20 systems every 2 weeks". Whilst it sounds cool (and was indeed what was done in the past, a long long time ago), in reality it's a pain in the ass, it's boring 90% of the time for the defenders since people don't attack more often than they do especially outside of an actual sov war and it takes up an awful lot more peoples valuable in-game time doing something they don't actually want to do.

Kagura Nikon wrote:
Yeah it will be some bothersome things , but for a much greater goal. I am not saying it will not hurt anyone at all, jsut that is not the end of the universe as some are claiming.


and I agree with you, I completely agree things need to change, but from my experience as a capital pilot, maxed miner, 0.0 miner, low sec miner, high sec miner, Rorqual Booster, JF owner, capital fights, alliance wide logistics and more... I think this particular solution is awful, not fun and already discourages me from going back into null again.

Kagura Nikon wrote:
How about instead of raging you suggest different values for the changes that get in a mid term and with logic foundation on why those values are a better compromise?


I've already posted a viable alternate suggestion in this thread :)
Alp Khan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5590 - 2014-10-03 14:59:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Alp Khan
Fret Thiesant wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
BuddyKnife wrote:

I don't think you understand the scale we are talking. I don't have exact numbers but I know we have over 2,000 reaction towers that need materials that are not from our space. That kind of logistics is not possible without the use of jump freighters and making it so you have to spend 4x the time moving things is just going to make people quit. Not to mention the effects on the economy.


For years we have read Goons saying they were different from others (expecially BoB), because they were NOT the typical "elite hard core guild" of EQ / WoW memory and basically most of them did not even care to join fleets and lived an happy & casual life.


Suddenly it looks like you became super-committed, with giant cogs to keep oiled and make run at all costs else people will mass quit.

That reeks of BoB-itis to me. Are you telling me you got BoB-itis disease? Shocked



Goons were always super commited.

There logi departments in 06-08 were just flat out amazingly well done. Simply epic.

Still is.

I don't think anyone really beleives that any changes you make at this point will break up the powerblocs. Eve is simply an old MMO at this point.

But you can make it more fun for people not in powerblocs. Limiting jumping range/speed etc. like this current patch. Adding more NPC stations dotted throughout null. Lowering structure amounts on POS's and decreasing timers.

Yes though no-one is breaking up colilitions it is just simply not going to happen at this point.

But maybe we can make the game a little more fun and competitive :)





Yes, indeed. That group is called Goonswarm Offensive Logistics (GSOL). I don't think you'll find a group that is as much as dedicated to the point of being masochistic in anywhere else in EVE.

"While armchair generals love to talk strategy, real generals talk logistics. Goons wheels out its logistics folks to talk about the challenge of running the largest infrastructure in the EVE Universe while at the same time fighting wars, volunteer burnout, security and FC's pinging for a Rorqual pilots to drop I-hubs (seriously dude they don't fit)." -- Javajunky
Gelina Minaro
Expatriates
#5591 - 2014-10-03 15:02:33 UTC
Those with short attention spans, look at the TL;DR below. Thanks!

I have no stake in any of this, but I can see how it's the right answer to the wrong question. The changes needed to make the game interesting are far more profound, need a lot more work, and would definitely need more than just three phases. I just re-subbed to be smacked in the face with an over-achieving precision sledgehammer being swung in some random direction, hoping it will fix an issue too complex to fit in a single dev post

As an industrialist, I can't fathom why Rorqual would need any change. Boost it, remove any and all capability to be used as something OTHER than an industrial. Also I don't see JFs launching fully-equipped ships, so, v0v.

I've attempted life in null, and it's pretty rough going. I haven't gone back, and if my last foray to Steve or the Monolith is any indication, you will kill exploring. New players will probably never see the EvE gate, Steve, or the Monolith. I know some of you are pretty hostile to new players, saying they need to go do what you did back in 200? and whatnot. But the truth of the matter is, things have changed, even if your memories say they have not.

I've liked many of your posts. I don't agree with these changes because they're shorthand for "we need to do something in the laziest way possible." Many had better suggestions, and they probably have the experience to say what would work. All I can say is that any change that makes new players unable to get to nullsec, the heart of EvE, is design suicide. The idea that caps can use gates is freakin' hilarious. I can just see the engineers looking around and v0v at how they managed to squeeze such a large ship through a gate. The "pres butan" to get pilots to their corp space. Are you serious? This sounds like a joke SCP. Magic is apparently a new element to EvE.

I've always wondered what CCP was trying to do with EvE. The same game can be friendly to new players and challenging to experienced players; it comes down to design. EvE needs an overhaul of massive proportions, or, you know, keep going this way, ensure no new blood enters the game, and eventually becomes irrevocably stagnant. An overhaul is going to suck. Hard. Harder than anything has before. I would welcome such a thing. This is not an overhaul; as many pointed out, it's just some DB changes and some lines of code. It is an endemic rot that CCP needs to fix, and this is just making the rot look pretty. CCP needs to HTFU and dig deep into the code and make the changes there. Pull out old design documents and re-evaluate what the hell they thought they were doing.

Say what you will about x winning the game, tears, and blah blah blah. The fundamental thing is that like it or not, new players will be needed to keep your precious going. I would do a Bobby Tables story to illustrate, but I don't have the energy to be uninformative and unfunny. However, the reference is not lost on me and is hilarious. This is not a Bobby Tables kind of change, but I wish it were.

TL;DR

  • Bobby Tables is an unintentionally funny reference.
  • I don't operate out of null. Here are my ideas on why this is bad.
  • Doomsayers might be right on this one, but what do I know? I just unsub to re-sub to be smacked in the face with crap like this.
  • I like mining. Die horrible rocks! Pew! Pew!
  • Gate camping intensifies.
  • Cap's Day Out would make for a hilarious recruitment film.
  • Devs are lazy and scared of code.
  • Magic button is magic.
Dwissi
Miners Delight Reborn
#5592 - 2014-10-03 15:02:48 UTC
Alp Khan wrote:
Arsine Mayhem wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:


Also, such a scheme hurts the small entities and guys who are unable to secure logistical lines!


At least that's the propaganda you're pushing today.

Like you've ever been concerned with "small entities".


Propaganda? Please tell us how it's propaganda, and meanwhile, explain to us how a small group without numbers and resources will ever secure a gate to gate logistical line into the deep null!

The mere fact that you cannot explain how this is propaganda, or how you cannot explain how a solo guy or a small entity can ever do the logistical work you appear to be so keen on is telling. You have only been pushing an emotional, shallow and pedantic knee-jerk reaction here, probably dreaming to yourself how these changes will make you or whatever group you are involved with being the top dogs in null or something.

Your romantic daydreams, while quite adorable, has nothing to do with the facts and problems we are discussing here.


Eve always offered many levels of game play . I ruled a small entity myself - so i talk at least from personal experience. You are part of one of the biggest entities the game has ever seen - so i highly doubt you have any idea how it is to play as a smaller entity to begin with. Its niche gaming, its playing the diplo game because you cant mantle a huge force , its being sneaky and squishy to sink 'through' the big wall that tries to stop you, its choosing your fights wisely etc - that's how you play as a smaller entity. You don't try to 'conquer' the biggest blob but learn how to go around it and sneak into whatever area you want to reach. Small entities 'leak' themselves slowly and carefully - completely different to what you believe actually.

You continue to try to create an illusion of actually 'caring' for people that you simply ignore for the time being. We smaller entities don't have to explain to you how we do things - you claim to be better than us to begin with. The upcoming changes are at least opening more windows for us smaller entities - that's all there is to it. Any realistic small entity isn't even dreaming of being a top dog - that's not how we play. But we see opportunities now and based on the uproar and obvious fear many show right now i make the bold assumption that the changes are good ones.

Proud designer of glasses for geeky dovakins

Before someone complains again: grr everyone

Greed is the death of loyalty
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#5593 - 2014-10-03 15:03:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Kagura Nikon
Retar Aveymone wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
True Sight wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
food for tought.. the vast majority of those were 0.0 dwellers and LEFT 0.0 because the game got BORIGN capital ships online. And we are happy because how 0.0 will be interestign enough for us to return.


food for thought... perhaps your right and the reduction of power projection being gone will make them want to move back to 0.0, but when they realise how difficult it is to actually go anywhere now, even slowly, that their new 0.0 doesn't offer a stable JF service and they can't reach the alliance cyno beacons, they'll not bother going back at all.



Most of us lived in 0.0 when these things did not exist. We are not cry babies, we will not stop playing because of such pitiful things.


Current 0.0 generation are spoiled kids.

aside from the cyno beacons, no you didn't



Yes I did (this is not my first char) and even this char lived in 0.0 BEFORE jump bridges and JF. This char went to 0.0 the day drone regions were released.


There were even 2 titans in game (and none was in our side) to bridge people around.

jump bridges came in revelations, about 1 year old this char was (and it was in 0.0 3 months after start) , and my previous char was already 2 and a half years old. Jump freighters came only in TRINITY. Bridges started to make effect fast, but JF only started to have serious impact in late 2008.

So learn to use the calendar!

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Kassasis Dakkstromri
State War Academy
Caldari State
#5594 - 2014-10-03 15:03:19 UTC
Ninteen Seventy-Nine wrote:
Kassasis Dakkstromri wrote:

Hmmm... maybe, potentially. But then I also might end up with Ebola too? No telling what the future holds...

But trolling, me.. nah - I've posted conscientious material mainly, with some fun posts; but my thought process simply has evolved into... unsub is the only thing CCP pays attention to - so that will ultimately be my 'focus group' contribution along with others that are/will do the same.

Anyway please feel free to continue trolling for tears, as it's always entertaining when folks like yourself can actually get a rage out of someone.


No, at the end of the day you are right. All you can do is state your opinion and click that button.

I just find the melodrama and doomsaying hilarious based off of just the Dev Blog. You haven't even seen or tried this environment. (I know, you'll say "i don't need to")




Sorry had to get some sleep :P

No I'll watch and see what happens,not like I don't have the subb time; though I'm pretty confident in my pre-conception of the way this will work ingame, but what really really turns me off and has led to a protest unsubb is that this totally kills my continuing goals regarding capitals/capital fights and what it means to be a cap pilot in an Alliance.

CCP you are bad at EVE... Stop potential silliness ~ Solo Wulf
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#5595 - 2014-10-03 15:03:53 UTC
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:
Hey people may even undock battleships again!


yup

JUSTK is recruiting
Eigenvalue
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#5596 - 2014-10-03 15:04:06 UTC
Prediction for impact of logistical changes proposed:

* Regional powers will establish markets as close as possible to a highsec/null JF staging. Many regions close to high will be one jump away. This will pull all deployments towards single systems instead of more broadly utilizing a null region

* The rest of the region will be even more empty than it is now because there is no viable market. Because the cost of seeding that proximate market system is probably about the same as it is currently to seed more central deployment systems there will be no increase in localized industry because the risk is simply not worth the marginal reward of having a regional central market system vs. easily stocked market system.

* Smaller groups will *try* to take the more distant parts of regions in the short/medium term, but because they will be logistically isolated they won't be able to either take or hold the space from the well stocked power in the highsec proximate market system. While the smaller power is still trying to fashion boar spears from raw materials the well stocked market system occupant will roll in apache helicopters and humvees and wipe them out.

* More distant regions of null will only be controlled by powers who control the most proximate supply route to highsec. Some regions there will only be one or two possible routes to highsec by jump freighter. Don't believe for a second anyone will gate fly freighters across multiple sov null regions to get to those regions. And the regions don't have a balanced enough supply of raw materials to support any operation that has staying power. Again, the localized production argument goes back to the "local tribe still trying to make boar spears while the apaches swoop in"

Ultimately, what we will see is a a great contraction of EVE occupancy to those places most logistically reasonable and a great emptying out of even marginally less proximate space.

The starry eyed will say, oh, but, wait, why don't you just do escort fleets for your freighters etc?

The answer is really easy - the powers that are jump freightering their stuff into a proximate system will be able to bring resupplies in without fear while the escorting powers will be constantly running escort fleets that are being constantly gigadunked by the risk free supplied entity.

Because here's the problem with power projection nerfing logistical capabilities is it doesn't remove the structural advantage of the better supplied. It just changes where they live and encourages consolidation.

Ahhh you say but maybe the goal is to prevent entities from controlling many regions at once? But that's absurd, because the super powers are super powerful because they both have numbers and resources and infrastructure. It'll take longer for them to deploy their power, but that power will be no less powerful vs. the smaller entity. It'll be more so, because the smaller entity will have an even more constrained ability to resupply relative to the super power than they do now.

This change won't be the end of eve,and it'll change significantly, but the game will become slower and longer to do anything and space will become even more balkanized and less uniformly populated.

The slower and longer to play and less occupancy per system will slowly and surely atrophy the interest in EVE over time, though. People have jobs and families and a choice of games. Making eve overall more boring will in no way help EVE become more attractive vs competitors.
Ochiniwa
No.Mercy
Triumvirate.
#5597 - 2014-10-03 15:05:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Ochiniwa
CCP Greyscale wrote:


Obsidian Hawk wrote:
How about this CCP Greyscale

Change the decay from 0.1 to 0.25. That is still a reasonable rate and will still keep capitals roaming slowly.

Rather than a 5 day cool down timer on some it will change it to about 2 days. Which is still a big hit to capital jumping...... But not as severe.

Dont go full blown harsh, do more like a kick to the shins and stepping on feet.


Tuning the decay is definitely something we're open to.


I can only agree with the decay as 2 days might be seen a short compared to 5 days but you must bear in mind that after two days you will only be able to make one single jump of 5 LY/bridging/JB. So all in all a 20LY move will take you 10 days!

The tuning of the decay seems inevitable.

Alternatively it would be an idea that the longer you wait for the decay it increases. For example if you have a 30 days fatigue, the first 5 days have a decay of 0.1 which goes up every day by let's say 0.05 unless you jump again and the decay is reset.

So you could bring donw the fatigue if you are patient within 12 days...

Example:

Total fatigue: 4320 0,1
Decay for 5 days at a rate of 0.1: 3600

Day / fatigue / decay rate
6 / 3384 / 0,15
7 / 3096 / 0,2
8 / 2736 / 0,25
9 / 2304 / 0,3
10 / 1800 / 0,35
11 / 1224 / 0,4
12 / 576 / 0,45

Should you at any moment do a jump your decay rate goes back to 1.

Not sure if I got this through but my idea is to allow a longer break as when you are really tired and you sleep long is better than sleeping shortly only and then do the effort again :)
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#5598 - 2014-10-03 15:05:55 UTC
DNSBLACK wrote:

Exactly but we can control one and the cool part is the price of the one will sky rocket and won't have to move it to jita to sell it and if it gets taken and the people sent there to fight everynight for it we will take it back. But havnt you heard they are fuxi g siphons and also going to let us moon mine with ships. What will you do then to prevent me from mini g co.e and kill me. Yea we are playing eve now. As a goon please HTFU and by the way I hear BoB may be reforming. Watching your to organization slap fight was the most fun I have ever had.


Finally someone I recognize!

I was there (and proud of it!) when they were slapping fights.

I was in an awesome low / null / FW corporation with around 200 pilots. We made our life everywhere, our freigthers supply caravans through low and null were epic, we had Hulk fleets mining close to or inside null-sec and we'd do L4 missions in null sec, harvested moons, sieged bases with what once would have been a large force (20 "puny, normal" carriers and a pair of dreads).

EvE by then was the most freaking fun, awesome, "I just lost 10 life years by how much my heart pumped when we 10 got jumped by 50 guys at the gate AND LIVED TO TELL" game that could ever be created.

I quit shortly after we joined a "powerbloc" and what we'd do every day was:

- log in in station / POS / whatever
- be notified we had a CTA at 2.30 am. BE THERE OR KICK.
- go to CTA, bash an empty tower for 4 hours. Drops: 100 fusion S ammo.
- go defend some blue guys speaking Klingoln, including the fleet leader speaking in alien and we'd end lost all over the region.


Maybe this change will grandiously fail. But if it does not... fun might come back to EvE!

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
FraXy
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#5599 - 2014-10-03 15:06:11 UTC  |  Edited by: FraXy
Jethro Winchester wrote:
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:
I am popping on to express my support for CCP with these proposed changes.

The Amarr/Minmatar warzone should benefit from Null Sec alliances having to pay a real price in man power and force projection to maintain their bored presence here.

Here's to the end of PL capital drops on a handful of cruisers 'for the lulz'.

Hey people may even undock battleships again!


http://www.overloadeverything.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=9312 Confirming that nobody ever undocks battleships against nullsec alliances and that you FW guys aren't cowards.


Significant difference between Kourm area and Agoze as was the case with USTZ fleets in Shadow Cartel that rarely if ever undocked BS (in a non-Itsme insurance scam).

One man's junk is FraXy's choice of weapon to kill you with.
flakeys
Doomheim
#5600 - 2014-10-03 15:06:38 UTC
Zhul Chembull wrote:
flakeys wrote:
remus wulf wrote:
Problem : Less and less players are logging in and playing eve.

Solution : Implement your current proposed changes.

Result : You annoy even more players causing them to un-sub multiple dozen accounts each !

Brilliant plan CCP if you want to kill off this game and move onto other projects because
seriously at the rate your going the only ones playing your game will be Dev's.
Oh wait NO players NO need for Dev's job's complete !

Seriously CCP please STOP listening to the CSM and start listening to your players an exercise
some better thinking and problem solving while you still have a player base at all.

That is if you still want to see this game around in another 10 years !

Changes are needed to keep things fresh and interesting but your plans are a nerf bat too far.


264 pages of comments in 3 days and that number will rise significantly by the time you implement these changes.
That speaks volumes at the amount of disgruntled players your about to cause to quit.



No , that speaks volumes about how nullsec inhabitants have become afraid of changes.

What you suggest will let the game die off in X years , what CCP suggests is giving the game a good kick wich may result in a short term player drop but in the long run a more attractive game for new people to get into.


We are afraid of bad change, you are correct. Not being able to seed markets and move goods to high sec in any reasonable fashion is unacceptable after we have had acceptable means for doing it for years.



But you ARE going to be able to seed the market , it will just take more time so make sure to charge for that extra time to your corp/Alliance mates.Just like the high-sec freighterpilot who is laughed at because he is carrying 20 B in one go when being ganked instead of taking it into 5 or more trips wich would mean his 30 minutes trip would become a 180 minutes trip .I'm sorry if all of a sudden eve ineed seems like a big universe , i am sure that was never the intention in the first place ...

Also what is defined by ''reasonable fashion'' is in the eye of the beholder , we used to think it was a ''reasonable fashion'' to fly our **** there in badgerconvoys. CCP is NOT removing your beloved ship it is just altering it , so no unlike what some claim we are not going back to the days of old as then we would just remove these ships too.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.