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Low Armor Hp = Lower Mass.
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Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#21 - 2014-08-11 16:15:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Fer'isam K'ahn
Ncc 1709 wrote:
pretty god idea, but id have it as structure that you reduced to reduce the mass, after all, its bits of your ship that your losing to lose the mass

See what I mean, have to fight superficial no-brainers all the time. At least he got the conncetion between basic mass and structure. But EVE doesn't work like reality, or we would not stop moving when the engine cuts out.

And how he can call this a "pretty good idea" is beyond my comprehension.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-08-11 16:21:16 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
pretty god idea, but id have it as structure that you reduced to reduce the mass, after all, its bits of your ship that your losing to lose the mass


It would only make sense if the ship was not repairable out fo station unless you somehow conjure the missing pieces by running a repper. Impacts don't need to rip off armor pieces off something to reduce the integrity of that same armor. All the pieces can still be there except in broken pieces or iwth tears in them giving up the integrity of the armor while still weighting just as much.

Speed penalty is a drawback of fitting a plate. Just because you got shot does not mean your fitting choice are irrelevant.

If you want armor mods with possibility of gaining back your speed, ask for something akin to detachable armor modules. GIves some buffer at the cost of speed but unlike normal plates, you cannot gain back the HP loss outside of a station but the mass of the module is reduced when it takes hit. Once it has absorbed enough damage, you only suffer a fraction of the mass penalty because the fitting device is still on your ship but the plate itself is gone so it no longer burden your ship as much. Make the fitting requirement a bit under that of normal plate modules to compensate a bit more for the fact they cannot be repaired outside of station because you don't have parts for it while in space.
Brutus Le'montac
#23 - 2014-08-11 16:26:45 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Ncc 1709 wrote:
pretty god idea, but id have it as structure that you reduced to reduce the mass, after all, its bits of your ship that your losing to lose the mass


It would only make sense if the ship was not repairable out fo station unless you somehow conjure the missing pieces by running a repper. Impacts don't need to rip off armor pieces off something to reduce the integrity of that same armor. All the pieces can still be there except in broken pieces or iwth tears in them giving up the integrity of the armor while still weighting just as much.

Speed penalty is a drawback of fitting a plate. Just because you got shot does not mean your fitting choice are irrelevant.

If you want armor mods with possibility of gaining back your speed, ask for something akin to detachable armor modules. GIves some buffer at the cost of speed but unlike normal plates, you cannot gain back the HP loss outside of a station but the mass of the module is reduced when it takes hit. Once it has absorbed enough damage, you only suffer a fraction of the mass penalty because the fitting device is still on your ship but the plate itself is gone so it no longer burden your ship as much. Make the fitting requirement a bit under that of normal plate modules to compensate a bit more for the fact they cannot be repaired outside of station because you don't have parts for it while in space.



so something like an lowslot module, that can hold Plate "charges" in different sizes, say it can hold a 1600mm plate charge, it gets the same mass reduction as a normal one, but like you said can not be repaired ( or the placeholder refilled out of station) but when it takes damage you gain more speed less mass?

that way it becomes somekind of a kite buffer tank that becomes more effective in kiting the more damage it takes... sounds like last men standing XD

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Brutus Le'montac
#24 - 2014-08-11 16:31:57 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Btw. I just read the whole thing again, which makes me doubt even more. The thing you said about shileds, even questioning the relation to sig radius is stupid.

Not to mention, that the game already functions in a certain way as proposed, not in absolutes, but %. Shutting off a MWD will lift the Sig penalty, offlining a plate will give speed (as done in tournaments/onlining doing the opposite).

Not sure why anyone would support this half backed nonsense. - Don't get me wrong, dynamic and realistic action/reactions/results would be great, but this is not a spaceship combat simulator, it's a space simulator in a very broad sense. And I don't see this happen, probably ever. And to just exploit it via armor ... is just silly.

-X

Brutus Le'montac wrote:
i dont see it as a drawback, ofcourse if i want to go fast i know countless other ships/fits that can go fast, this idea is just to get some more intresting tactics and fights going on.

No, you only add exploits. And I can see where you come from with your WH concept.
- Just fit nanos, shoot armor down to 0% and then jump 1000 capitals into a WH, rep up. done. Or fit nanos to Subcaps, shoot to 0%, Rep, refit for plates, done.
- Shield tanked, no prblem, shoot armor to 0% rep shields, 6000m/s BS ...
- Not to mention all the other nonesense.


the reason i did not respond to your "exploits" is because i did read your post before you made an edit.

i live in a c3 wh with a lowsec static, i dont own, or fly a capital and it also doesnt fit in oure wh ( outside building it inside which is stupid in a c3).
you are the one coming up with that idea, not me, so i dont know who is adding exploits here? i come up with a mechanic, you make it an exploit, but i got to give it to you, its a nice find.

now if the proposed wh jump/mass goes on, caps will land outside of rep range, so you dont have to worry caps shoot eachother to 0 to rep themselfs up again.

now, considering you dont have much more to add, besides repeating how you think this is a bad thing and bla bla bla, how about you go and troll somewhere else?

so us "no brainers" can discuss something that might work out with normal input.

Thought is dangerous; lack of thought, deadly!
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#25 - 2014-08-11 16:36:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Fer'isam K'ahn
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
So something like an lowslot module, that can hold Plate "charges" in different sizes, say it can hold a 1600mm plate charge, it gets the same mass reduction as a normal one, but like you said can not be repaired ( or the placeholder refilled out of station) but when it takes damage you gain more speed less mass?

that way it becomes somekind of a kite buffer tank that becomes more effective in kiting the more damage it takes... sounds like last men standing XD

Well, finally you seem to get it. Blink Changing the old mechanic is a no-go. Creating a new module is something else. I actually thought plates would work like this the first time I read about them. No Speed increase beyond the base speed though, in case you still think you could get that feature. Roll
Though a module like this would only make sense for a non lagi support throwaway buffer ship and I am not sure where I would even be in need of such a thing. Still, the basic module would work.

@dit: The basic OP idea is still bad and objectively bad, disregarding my opinion.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-08-11 17:02:30 UTC
Brutus Le'montac wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Ncc 1709 wrote:
pretty god idea, but id have it as structure that you reduced to reduce the mass, after all, its bits of your ship that your losing to lose the mass


It would only make sense if the ship was not repairable out fo station unless you somehow conjure the missing pieces by running a repper. Impacts don't need to rip off armor pieces off something to reduce the integrity of that same armor. All the pieces can still be there except in broken pieces or iwth tears in them giving up the integrity of the armor while still weighting just as much.

Speed penalty is a drawback of fitting a plate. Just because you got shot does not mean your fitting choice are irrelevant.

If you want armor mods with possibility of gaining back your speed, ask for something akin to detachable armor modules. GIves some buffer at the cost of speed but unlike normal plates, you cannot gain back the HP loss outside of a station but the mass of the module is reduced when it takes hit. Once it has absorbed enough damage, you only suffer a fraction of the mass penalty because the fitting device is still on your ship but the plate itself is gone so it no longer burden your ship as much. Make the fitting requirement a bit under that of normal plate modules to compensate a bit more for the fact they cannot be repaired outside of station because you don't have parts for it while in space.



so something like an lowslot module, that can hold Plate "charges" in different sizes, say it can hold a 1600mm plate charge, it gets the same mass reduction as a normal one, but like you said can not be repaired ( or the placeholder refilled out of station) but when it takes damage you gain more speed less mass?

that way it becomes somekind of a kite buffer tank that becomes more effective in kiting the more damage it takes... sounds like last men standing XD


I envision them as having their mass penalty reduced by like 95% when they got completely wrecked because the device to hold the place in the first place is still there.

Fantasy number because CBA to look them up :

1600mm detachable armor plate

gives 200 armor hp

Increase mass by 100

Take 50 damage.

Your mass is now only increased by 72.25.

Take total 200 or more damage.

Your mass in now increased by 5 and you must go back to station to repair the 200 hp granted by the module either by normal repair or whatever item CCP want us to produce somehow.

The item would probably give more HP when not damaged because you could put stronger plates since they are made of stronger material at the cost of field repair being impossible.
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-08-11 17:13:49 UTC
Sigras wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
This is... an interesting idea.

I guess my only concern would be people purposefully shooting friendlies before combat so that they can kite better.

I dont see a problem with that... If they wanted less HP and more speed they could always just have fit a smaller plate, or a nanofiber instead of a plate etc.

think about it, it would be an huge boost to shield fits, ats they could just get around with 99.9% armor damage as their buffers are in shields, not armor.
wo in their right mind would use an armor-fit ship again then?
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