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Level 4s revamp idea. adding risk to the reward along with fun. First post
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Rena Emishi

Doomheim

Likes received: 69

#21 - 2014-07-21 21:06:49 UTC

Renegade Heart wrote:

Would be too easy to exploit I think. Players would get their alts to aggress them for the tank and dps boost from the concord drones. Also, if the rats aggressed the alt, then alt could be the tank too, allowing a better dps fit on the main mission runner.

Terrible idea really, although I appreciate the thought behind it! Best to just leave level 4 mechanics as is, AND move them to low sec too Big smile

Hmm true did not think of that exploits or alts.. but really does any one actually need a exploit to beat npc rats ? Make it one use per mission let them use the exploit it will bit them on the behind if a pirate jumps in 5 mins later.

_Valar Morghulis, Valar Dohaeris _

Doomheim 339
Altirius Saldiaro Doomheim Likes received: 339	#22 - 2014-07-21 21:16:08 UTC 6 OP is the reason the forums should have a dislike button next to the like button.

Jonah Gravenstein

Machiavellian Space Bastards

Likes received: 28,489

#23 - 2014-07-21 21:18:25 UTC | Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein

Rena Emishi wrote:

Then let them farm level 3s the rate of safe isk they make will drop a lot.

Actually nope speedfarming 3's for LP is very nearly as profitable as running level 4's if you choose the right LP to farm.

Quote:

And you are not taking into account changes that could be made to give them a advantage in fending off a mission invader in low sec.

The mission space isn't the really dangerous bit, getting there is and most people are averse to risking their shiny expensive PvE ships in gatecamps, because it's like being the fish in a barrel made of C4 and rusty nails.

Quote:

Perhaps they could try adding those to level 5s first before removing level 4s from high sec to see how many people venture into low sec to give level 5s a go.

I can tell you how that'll work out right now, people still wouldn't run level 5 missions.

The reward < the risk.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Doomheim 550
Renegade Heart Doomheim Likes received: 550	#24 - 2014-07-21 21:18:32 UTC Nothing for me to dislike here really. At least he wants to increase risk rather than reduce it! Should probably be in right forum section though.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie

University of Caille

Gallente Federation

Likes received: 2,097

#25 - 2014-07-21 21:23:31 UTC

Yarda Black wrote:

Rena Emishi wrote:

Yarda Black wrote:

Already implemented. Its called a lvl5.

Level 5s do not have the features I described. and you missed the most important part... removing the risk free isk making level 4s from high sec and moving em to low.

Aight. Apologies for interrupting your stealth "nerf h-sec" thread. I thought you were serious.

Stealth?

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!

Nolak Ataru

Hedion University

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 840

#26 - 2014-07-21 21:24:38 UTC

Rena Emishi wrote:

Renegade Heart wrote:

You clearly haven't tried a L5 in a L4 fit.

If you're extremely lucky, you're using a MJD sniper fit against non-Guristas and no neuts. If not..... you just lost a pimp Golem or Paladin to multiple Neut Tower III and 2.5k+ incoming dps, not counting the small pirate gang that's probing you down....

The current meta for L5s is: PassiveGu, PassiveSnake, MJD Drone Domi, dual ASB Vargur, Carrier, or a fleet with RR and remote cap support.

Note the "Passive" nature of each of these ships (not counting the carrier since it has enough cap to not be bothered too much). The neut towers are very powerful.

Rena Emishi

Doomheim

Likes received: 69

#27 - 2014-07-21 21:28:25 UTC

Nolak Ataru wrote:

Rena Emishi wrote:

Renegade Heart wrote:

I'll hold my hands up and admit ive never tried a level 5, mainly because I find level 4s too boreing to grind to get my standings up. But also because I was under the impression they were designed for small gangs and not solo doable. Maunders can solo level 5s?

_Valar Morghulis, Valar Dohaeris _

In Boobiez We Trust 3,082
Schmata Bastanold In Boobiez We Trust Likes received: 3,082	#28 - 2014-07-21 21:30:44 UTC 3 There are L4s in lowsec. /thread Invalid signature format

Nolak Ataru

Hedion University

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 840

#29 - 2014-07-21 21:31:48 UTC

Rena Emishi wrote:

Yes. Dual ASB Vargur or Golems are capable of L5s. So are MJD Domis. A T2 Vargur with a Crystal set will tank 2.8k dps on a single XL ASB. 5.6k with 2 in case things get dicey.

Rena Emishi

Doomheim

Likes received: 69

#30 - 2014-07-21 21:38:31 UTC | Edited by: Rena Emishi

Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:

Rena Emishi wrote:

Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:

Hello.

First of all, new ideas are always welcome and we all appreciate your try at presenting a new idea. However, in order to avoid creating posts with ideas that are pretty much useless, might I suggest that you learn a bit about the game.

There are several excellent guides and resources that deal with every aspect of the game, including mission running and PvP. My suggestion is to start with "ISK The guide" (http://www.isktheguide.com/), where you can find a lot of information about Level 4 mission profitability and difference between PvE and PvP fits (among other things). You can also learn a lot about various game mechanics and options that already exist.

One very good alternative to the mentioned guide is EVE University Wiki (http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Main_Page). If you prefer more personal and direct approach to education, you can also enlist in EVE University and learn about the game in their organized classes provided by experienced players.

I hope these advices will help you make better suggestions in the future.

Fly safe.

Wow.. *Slow clap* so well written. But lacks any substance or argument. That post is akin to telling a atheist their is a god im not going to explain why im just going to direct you to the bible all of the reasons to why you are wrong are their.

Hey... don't blame me Lol

I'm one of the rare posters in this thread who genuinely tried to help you see your mistakes in logic and provided a good guide for getting help with your knowledge of the game.

If you prefer the idea with honey on keyboard and a hungry badger, it's totally fine with me.

again I see a lot of well written words but no meaning or substance..

Grow a pair of balls and a soul, and use your immaculate grammar and sentence structure to say some thing that acutually has meaning. Its not hard just say Rena Emishi you are wrong.. then proceed to explain why im wrong then if I am able ill retort and we can go on from there.

And yes I'm clearly not a native English speaker yes I am aware that my spelling grammar and sentence structure are very poor, im fine with the hungry badger comment the other guy made because at least he actually pointed something out ( my poor English) and didn't just waffle on without actually saying anything.

_Valar Morghulis, Valar Dohaeris _

virm pasuul

Imperial Academy

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 446

#31 - 2014-07-21 21:54:22 UTC

Altirius Saldiaro wrote:

OP is the reason the forums should have a dislike button next to the like button.

Beat me to it. This is exactly what I was thinking.

In an attempt to be constructive -
Every "fix" needs to be a fix to a defined and recognised problem. When did level 4s in highsec become a problem and why?

Hishsec is not "safe", it is relatively safe. I know a group who will take great pleasure in proving this to you.
If you doubt it Google James 315 and then buy a permit.

Game mechanics. The more complex any game mechanics are the more easily they are exploited. Your example mechanics seemed pretty complex and a few people have already suggested exploits. Imagine what they could come up with after several weeks.

Unexpected consequences. Related to the last point - So Concord spawns drones? Concord doesn't currently have drones? Are these drones killable? Does killing them have a standings effect? What are concord doing doing in space below 0.5? Isn't this confusing for noobs? Will the concord drones respawn if the rats kill them? Can I go afk orbiting something speed tanking and let concord do all the work?

I'm sorry but this seems to be one of the worst thought out ideas I've seen suggested in the boards. No problem definition and a very complex solution pretty much guaranteed not to work as intended.

ISD Community Communications Liaisons ISD Alliance 7,710
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode ISD Community Communications Liaisons ISD Alliance Likes received: 7,710	#32 - 2014-07-21 21:56:03 UTC 1 Moving this from General Discussion to Features and Ideas. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Senior Lead Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department

Doomheim 2,972
Vortexo VonBrenner Doomheim Likes received: 2,972	#33 - 2014-07-21 22:03:20 UTC "It's like deja vu all over again" - Yogi Berra EvE security zones in pictures EvE quick reference pdf EvE links

Rena Emishi

Doomheim

Likes received: 69

#34 - 2014-07-21 22:22:46 UTC | Edited by: Rena Emishi

virm pasuul wrote:

Altirius Saldiaro wrote:

OP is the reason the forums should have a dislike button next to the like button.

I proposed a idea, Its just a idea if implemented it would be tweaked, play tested over and over until it did work.. or it would never be released.

Im not going to argue with you over the risk reward ratio gap in regards to low and high sec, because I shouldn't need to if you.

_Valar Morghulis, Valar Dohaeris _


virm pasuul Imperial Academy Amarr Empire Likes received: 446	#35 - 2014-07-21 22:37:32 UTC 4 It's a hugely flawed idea. It doesn't need tweaking, it needs taking out back and shooting and dumping in the river.

Doomheim 17
Jango Cane Doomheim Likes received: 17	#36 - 2014-07-21 22:47:23 UTC virm pasuul wrote: It's a hugely flawed idea. It doesn't need tweaking, it needs taking out back and shooting and dumping in the river. Level 4 mission runner that doesn't want to lose his meal ticket.


Schmata Bastanold In Boobiez We Trust Likes received: 3,082	#37 - 2014-07-21 23:20:52 UTC Jango Cane wrote: virm pasuul wrote: It's a hugely flawed idea. It doesn't need tweaking, it needs taking out back and shooting and dumping in the river. Level 4 mission runner that doesn't want to lose his meal ticket. Pot, meet kettle. Kettle, meet brave NPC alt. Invalid signature format

Mina Sebiestar

Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate

Likes received: 1,231

#38 - 2014-07-21 23:35:10 UTC | Edited by: Mina Sebiestar

Rena Emishi wrote:

Mina Sebiestar wrote:

Pve fitted mission runners thanks you and tell you worry not about them, rather go shoot pvp oriented targets.

I don't worry about them.. I want them to work for their money, I want the eve moto risk = reward to be a actual fact of the game. I hate that people can sit in high sec and make the so much risk free isk.. and the risk to reward ratio in low sec is so imbalanced. ( and null in not fortified allienced secured area's ). It disgusts me that people sit afk mining and run level 4s blind folded for years upon years, its nothing but a tutorial zone that people never want to leave because the isk to risk ratio is so good.

You should check those: wanting, hating, world and eve is not fair and disgust feel you are hoarding, those don't seem healthy.

high sec is not was not nor will it ever be tut space it is massive part of new eden and hardly just mission running exercise, I cant seriously even consider this as non troll idea.

mission out of wack risk vs reward is mission out of wack problem it is not low sec suck problem and each is fixed by addressing it in mission case why it is such walk in park for a decade now and not buy giving every mission runner a cow bell / concord whistle and sent away to be someone lunch giggle.

not to mention creating absurd gameplay mechanic just to keep thing alive...not in my sandbox.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Goldiiee

Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies

Likes received: 1,190

#39 - 2014-07-22 00:24:11 UTC

Your absolutely right OP, the risk reward is certainly skewed, but I think an easier solution would be to quadruple the rewards and bounties for missions in Low Sec.

Should solve all your problems. :)

Things that keep me up at night; Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.

Industrial Management and Engineering Mouth Trumpet Cavalry 665
Nalelmir Ahashion Industrial Management and Engineering Mouth Trumpet Cavalry Likes received: 665	#40 - 2014-07-22 00:24:19 UTC Rena Emishi wrote: P.s im not a pirate. Sounds legit. and I'm "not" posting in stealth buff mission runners ganking thread.