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system security status

Author
Emma Muutaras
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-07-16 11:09:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Emma Muutaras
should the system security status be so static?

in my opinion the answer has to be no.

so here is my idea a idea i am sure will be met with a waves of NOPE with no real argument as to why

make system security status fluid so system that isn't being used can get more dangerous as the pirate faction present in the system gain a stronger presence, and systems that are being ratted to death will slowly become safer

for example

a 0.0 system that has not killed X Pirate NPC's in 24 hours DT->DT will get a little more dangerous instead of being 0.00 it will now be -0.01 after 2 weeks of not being used it will be -0.14 and so on potentially making space that is currently close to worthless quite decent it will require alliance/corps to manage there space.

now i can hear you all saying already OMG this is a amazing add it now, no more tripping over each other while you got ya null sec care-bear on.

well now the flip side of the coin, this is where i think i will get resistance to the idea. The inverse also must be true.

a -1.0 which as people grinding out hubs/sanctums and is easily killing the X Pirate NPC's in 24 hour's DT->DT will get a little safer each day so after 2 weeks of reaching its X kills quota every day the system security status of that system will have dropped to -0.86.

the key will be space management yes some space will get worse while other space gets better.

officer NPC's i think should be changed so there spawn chance is identical no matter the system security status in null sec.

pirate faction space, system security status shouldn't be able to drop below --0.8 as it is pirate space though i dont see a issue with that as most people there run missions for said faction

(not sure how this will effect the rental empires that some coalitions/alliances have set up as the rent is based on system security status which if fluid will be constantly changing)

Disclaimer
This is only a rough outline of a idea.

X pirates to be calibrated by ccp so balance effectively
Sec Status change per day to be calibrated by ccp so balance effectively
a 0.0 system should never reach a positive number (low sec) just my opinion
i used X Pirates as my benchmark though others can be used in its place or in combination with such as average pilots in space.
Lothros Andastar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2014-07-16 11:13:18 UTC
Basically you want to nerf Nullsec ratting systems because you don't have a piece of the pie.
Emma Muutaras
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-07-16 11:23:46 UTC
quite the opposite i have access to several systems that are -0.75 to -1.0

i want to make null more dynamic give players tools to effect there space add a little Pussshhhh

and you said nerf please explain how its a nerf all u need to do is rat in your top end -1.0 for a week yes it drops to -9.3 but the system next door that was -9.3 and not been used for a week will have changed to -1.0.

if by nerf you mean god no, i have to work to maintain my ratting space then yes i guess its a nerf.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2014-07-16 11:39:10 UTC
Lothros Andastar wrote:
Basically you want to nerf Nullsec ratting systems because you don't have a piece of the pie.



I'd have said it's more of a buff, there are more systems with **** truesec that no-one uses than there are good ones.

That said, after a year or so you'd end up with a completely homogenised nullsec. I'm not sure why that's a good thing.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#5 - 2014-07-16 11:39:34 UTC
How is this forcing people to defend "their" space?

You can do this now by large invasions. At some point even the null bears have to form up the 100 man fleet to take on your 100 man. If only because the 100 man fleet is choking out the pve.

Don't really need to play with true sec tbh. If not doing that, well thats on you really. Even if assed to care about a much smaller roam rolling in I know if out ratting here is what I thought.

Hmm...8 hacs burning gates inbound. 4 jumps back to station (assuming I have intel for the 4 systems back...solo bs and tard deaths on gates if non blues around always goes so well) if welcome wagon was being formed. reship, meet fleet and by that time comes, 8 hacs sees response fleet and if large enough they veer off and do not engage. Chance of wasted time....pretty damn good.

Or....


safe up in pos, catch a smoke break and come back to see they have cleared my system and went on.


Want more pvp in 0.0...thats on leadership. Basic stuff, 100% tax rate. Or leadership could just pull a Bobby. Just woke up one day and as the story goes as I heard it....killed Atlas as an entity because he got tired of them not wanting to pew pew with great enthusiasm. SOV and all its bene's...gone just like that.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#6 - 2014-07-16 11:43:18 UTC
Well, I basically support the concept of dynamic system security, but no implementable solution has been found that would not be horribly exploitable and break the game

Besides, 0.0 is lawless space anyway, you would substitute one pirate faction (NPC) just with another (player) so overall it would still be the same. Pirate on pirate crime isn't really law enforcement.

Now I am not saying there might be other options to 'secure' space, but thats far away from the original invetnion of sec status. 0.1 - 1.0 usually relates to empire (npc/fw) presence and from 0.5 to concord. There I actually would find it more realted to change through players piracy or law enforecement activities, but that would so horribly ruin everything, since I don't think any regulation methods have been explored so far with any success.

Personally I can't comment much on 0.0 ratting sec status influence, haven't observed it much. But basically its the same, collect data, research the effects, create an idea, try to exploit and break it, then suggest with links to everything, so we can try to break what you didn't think off - maybe you are the one to find the right solution, not that it hasn't come up before. Blink

Cheers
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#7 - 2014-07-16 12:04:44 UTC
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Well, I basically support the concept of dynamic system security, but no implementable solution has been found that would not be horribly exploitable and break the game

Besides, 0.0 is lawless space anyway, you would substitute one pirate faction (NPC) just with another (player) so overall it would still be the same. Pirate on pirate crime isn't really law enforcement.

Now I am not saying there might be other options to 'secure' space, but thats far away from the original invetnion of sec status. 0.1 - 1.0 usually relates to empire (npc/fw) presence and from 0.5 to concord. There I actually would find it more realted to change through players piracy or law enforecement activities, but that would so horribly ruin everything, since I don't think any regulation methods have been explored so far with any success.

Personally I can't comment much on 0.0 ratting sec status influence, haven't observed it much. But basically its the same, collect data, research the effects, create an idea, try to exploit and break it, then suggest with links to everything, so we can try to break what you didn't think off - maybe you are the one to find the right solution, not that it hasn't come up before. Blink

Cheers



Big issue here is it can choke out the little guys. Large blobs worst case have the space to rotate out space for their corps. Sort of like a farm. You rotate the plots out. Field 1 and 2 next to each other. 1 produces some good crops you run with that till its time to let it rest a iittle. On to field 2 you go till thats about due to recoup. Back to field 1. Larger crews have this option. The smaller ones wouldn't. Not saying be uber nice to the null bears.

However, it takes isk to do pvp and you have to give peeps away to make it. A way that doesn't involve spamming jita with scams anyway....got enough of that tbh lol. Or the other ways 0.0 seems to make money (i.e.. empire incursion farming, fw farming, etc). Basically anyway to get 0.0 to pew more to me should have it so people actually stay out in 0.0 more full time. Kind of hard to have good fights if half the resident corp is knee deep in an fw or empire on alts for a few hours while on your roam.
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#8 - 2014-07-16 12:29:22 UTC
Eah, sure. I am not arguing any of this, well, here .... because there is already another thread about this.

I only pointed out, that firstly I personally find it worth exploring, that secondly no solution has been found, thirdly this is an ongoing discussion in general and fourthly thats negative sec might be a different thing/perspective to look at (why I havent it reported as redundant, because, as I said, the discussion already exists).

And beliebeme, I hold two opposing positions on this and argue with myself, player vs game designer, and with different positions from newbie via fw and veteran to exploiter and powerblock manager. This whole suggestion is a game changer and should be treated as such with great care and wariness. And everything should be considered and tested in theory before any hint of actual implementation is suggested.

Otherwise, see you in the other thread ,)
Emma Muutaras
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2014-07-16 12:35:16 UTC
Zan Shiro wrote:
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:
Well, I basically support the concept of dynamic system security, but no implementable solution has been found that would not be horribly exploitable and break the game

Besides, 0.0 is lawless space anyway, you would substitute one pirate faction (NPC) just with another (player) so overall it would still be the same. Pirate on pirate crime isn't really law enforcement.

Now I am not saying there might be other options to 'secure' space, but thats far away from the original invetnion of sec status. 0.1 - 1.0 usually relates to empire (npc/fw) presence and from 0.5 to concord. There I actually would find it more realted to change through players piracy or law enforecement activities, but that would so horribly ruin everything, since I don't think any regulation methods have been explored so far with any success.

Personally I can't comment much on 0.0 ratting sec status influence, haven't observed it much. But basically its the same, collect data, research the effects, create an idea, try to exploit and break it, then suggest with links to everything, so we can try to break what you didn't think off - maybe you are the one to find the right solution, not that it hasn't come up before. Blink

Cheers



Big issue here is it can choke out the little guys. Large blobs worst case have the space to rotate out space for their corps. Sort of like a farm. You rotate the plots out. Field 1 and 2 next to each other. 1 produces some good crops you run with that till its time to let it rest a iittle. On to field 2 you go till thats about due to recoup. Back to field 1. Larger crews have this option. The smaller ones wouldn't. Not saying be uber nice to the null bears.

However, it takes isk to do pvp and you have to give peeps away to make it. A way that doesn't involve spamming jita with scams anyway....got enough of that tbh lol. Or the other ways 0.0 seems to make money (i.e.. empire incursion farming, fw farming, etc). Basically anyway to get 0.0 to pew more to me should have it so people actually stay out in 0.0 more full time. Kind of hard to have good fights if half the resident corp is knee deep in an fw or empire on alts for a few hours while on your roam.


your right the small corp/alliance that only holds 1-2 systems would probability struggle but realistically how many small corps/alliances that only have 1-2 systems even exist in null sec? in its current state im gonna guess not many but u are right. as i said this is only a rough idea that would need to be balanced

perhaps new ihub upgrades to help sustain the system status new pos module that hostiles can deploy on there pos in your space to increase the sec status change.

the whole idea is a rough outline i would love to read your thoughts and ideas and suggestions perhaps together we can make null sec that little bit more dynamic
Netan MalDoran
Hail To The King
The Silent Syndicate
#10 - 2014-07-16 18:17:17 UTC
Apply this everywhere but null, as that is really the only place where true sec matters for officer and faction spawns.

"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!

Falcon's truth

Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#11 - 2014-07-16 18:24:41 UTC
They tried this when they introduced the Sov upgrade structures.

It worked.

People took poor null and made it good.

And much like it is now, Null became a blue donut and fortunes were made, super caps were built, Null sec population was on the rise.

Then they nerfed it and everyone left.