Player Features and Ideas Discussion

First of all, understand that I am speaking in the context of wormhole space combat, smaller scale than nullsec and with ship limitations. Feel free to also discuss the impact of my suggestions in relation to combat in k-space environments.

With that out of the way, I'd like to start on Energy Neutralizers. These fantastic devices drain a targeted ship's capacitor and eventually shut off active resistance modules, ECM modules, guns, propulsion mods, active reppers, and anything that is not a passive module. But what are the drawbacks to using such ships? They drain your capacitor as well...except when permafed by a Logi chain which is present in almost every w-space engagement.

So in essence, we have a type of EWAR which in its current state effectively destroys an enemy fleet's ability to defend as well as fight back, with little to no drawback. Lots of people whine about ECM Jammers being omnipotent and ridiculous, but neuts are truly a "fun fight" killer.

Notice I didn't say anything about Nosferatus, which offer only a meager capacitor boost and don't completely wreck an enemy's ability to fight. They are really situation specific, where neuts are used anywhere as a utility high and are the only thing fit in highs on ships with bonuses for them (Legions, Armageddons, Bhaalgorns).

My suggestion to make neutralizers something to be used in moderation is that normal use of them causes heat damage across high, mid, and low slots. Not the amount of damage that modules normally cause from overheating, but a small amount that builds up over time and is applied across the entire ship. The result is a more sparing use of the modules because of its tendency to reduce the fighting capability of those ships.

Discuss. And do proffer examples of how this would effect k-space as well.

"IF" nuets are so op why not counter fit them with a cap battery or booster? or maybe an ancillary repper of some sort?

Use a little more imagination in your fit if certain ewar type shuts down your ship.

You could make a very similar argument about any ewar system. Honestly I don't see a problem with ewar systems being exceedingly effective at their specifically defined roles. Ewar can't cause damage or make a killing blow, which are tied directly with the metrics for winning a fight.

By necessity these methods of combat need to have very strong incentives for usage or else everyone will just ignore them. (Which they still do, but regardless!) In a majority of scenarios, ewar, on a per player instance, needs to be capable of neutralizing incoming dps of a single target or limiting incoming dps across multiple targets with high efficacy.

If it can't do that then it has less than a 1:1 efficiency in combat and has no purpose in a fleet when compared to a standard conventional combat vessel.

Tl;dr Neuts are fine and integral to gameplay as GP stated.

As a dedicated Sentinel pilot/fanboy, I can personally say with all certainty, **** boosters, gets me killed more often than remembering too late that hyperions have drones.

See that made me very happy. Sentinel <3

Tracking rigs/computers/enhancers have a laughable effect on the overall effectiveness of well bonused TDs because of the way the formula is calculated. Dampeners, even post nerf, function about the same way. Good luck "flying closer" to that Keres shutting you down to 5K with a 20KM scram. Jams do actually have a proper counter and ill give you that ECCM is pretty effective at shutting them down, but thats mostly because of falcon and the way they absolutely isolate you from helping your friends or participating in combat, and keep in mind that ECCM is the one and only counter, along with that weird low slot thing that no one fits. Neuts have a counter in the form that almost every fleet of any size will have logi, and those logi will have energy transfer arrays. Compared to other ECM systems, neuts also have a laughably small range, fit in high slots instead of mediums, and require a ton of fitting space. This is not to mention that a full neut Bhaal or Curse will cap itself out rapidly because of the intense capacitor requirements. You bring this up yourself in your OP, stating that they require a permafeed logi chain just to keep them running. Im not arguing that neuts are underpowered, but they serve a vital role in fleet fights as a counter to capitals outside of loldps.

So you just wait for your corp to shove a ship in your hands to fly and don't bother trying anything from there?

That explains a lot.

If you're not winning with your current tactics, change them, don't try to force people to change their tactics by acting through a third party (asking CCP to "fix things" because they're "unbalanced")

I fly a Legion. A lot. Even a neut Legion. And mostly Amarr ships with a smattering of Gallente when I'm bored. I haven't flown a single ship that didn't have cap problems. I completely ignored batteries until about a month ago, now I'm finding several fits where I actually have better cap stability by swapping out a recharger with a large battery, should the fit have a recharger and/or rely on heavy cap regen, or a few other factors.

Without being neuted. Throw neuting into the mix and the difference is phenomenal.

Cap boosters are life to a lot of Amarr and Gallente setups out there. How.... do you not know this?... Even for some Logi setups. I see cap booster Exequrors all the time, and they usually outlast ours.


Tackle is tackle. Everyone should fit a smattering of tackle. E-war is E-war. If you've got an extra slot fit it, but otherwise put a specialized ship(s) on grid and wreck face with it because half-arsing it just doesn't get you very far. If you can't field the ship(s) and are relying on kitchen sink setups to win the E-war day, you should be expecting problems.

Neuting is already getting another hard counter in the bottomless NOS ships, which aren't in any way intended to counter them. But a new hard counter or a nerf isn't even needed, because there are so many ways to get around neuts backed by cap-chain currently.