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[Kronos] Mordu's Legion

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TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#641 - 2014-05-14 07:45:53 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


sensor damps are a counter to everything though, if you're willing to use 1 specialist dampening ship per thing you're trying to counter. also this doesn't even work if it's vs the frigate because FOFs.
Alghara
Les chevaliers de l'ordre
Goonswarm Federation
#642 - 2014-05-14 07:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Alghara
Dave Stark wrote:
Alghara wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


yes but try to keep you scramble on the orthrus with enough speed to don't take the drone damage and more than 10 km because under the orthrus can lock you, if they are a medium neutra in the utility slot you range where you can be. It's from 12 km to 15km at more than 2500 m's good luck

then do what you do with any other ship you face; bring 250 megathrons and alpha it straight off the field.
more than one way to skin a cat.


Guy no every body can formup 250 megathron in EVE. one orthrus fleet will never a real problem for goons. But EVE is not only Goons
Dave Stark
#643 - 2014-05-14 07:52:06 UTC
Alghara wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Alghara wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


yes but try to keep you scramble on the orthrus with enough speed to don't take the drone damage and more than 10 km because under the orthrus can lock you, if they are a medium neutra in the utility slot you range where you can be. It's from 12 km to 15km at more than 2500 m's good luck

then do what you do with any other ship you face; bring 250 megathrons and alpha it straight off the field.
more than one way to skin a cat.


Guy no every body can formup 250 megathron in EVE. one orthrus fleet will never a real problem for goons. But EVE is not only Goons


fine then, 125 maelstroms.
Shamus en Divalone
The Clandestine Forge
#644 - 2014-05-14 08:25:39 UTC
Makari Aeron wrote:
Still kinda miffed that Mordu's Legion ships aren't ECM based like the lore dictates.


One day we might get some new faction BC's these should be able to fill a few gaps, including the Mordus ECM one.
Mario Putzo
#645 - 2014-05-14 08:40:35 UTC
Alghara wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Alghara wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


yes but try to keep you scramble on the orthrus with enough speed to don't take the drone damage and more than 10 km because under the orthrus can lock you, if they are a medium neutra in the utility slot you range where you can be. It's from 12 km to 15km at more than 2500 m's good luck

then do what you do with any other ship you face; bring 250 megathrons and alpha it straight off the field.
more than one way to skin a cat.


Guy no every body can formup 250 megathron in EVE. one orthrus fleet will never a real problem for goons. But EVE is not only Goons


As a little guy, who goons so arrogantly pretend to look out for. As a lowsec denizen who doesn't have the luxury of easy peazy bubbles...These ships while strong are easily countered. Pretty much any lowsec fleet will have on field the tools to deal with this. Any Nullsec group should hopefully have the tools to deal with this.

Damps is an obvious solution, but it is not the ideal solution, **** the real answer has only been the meta for the last year.
Feodor Romanov
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#646 - 2014-05-14 08:51:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Feodor Romanov
So much OP crying! What about Angels, that can kite easily in a Dis range, or get close to any ship and withdraw at any moment because of speed? Or what to do with Serpentis, they can contol out of scram range and do best dps in the game? If you think that Mordu's is OP, you need to nerf those factions too. But I don't think that all three factions is OP, because their price is too high to be crap, they MUST be better then t2 analogs. look at all of them, they have good speed, tank, dps and range control capabilities, so mordu's is in line with mates. No ships in their class can fight them 1vs1, so use more ships or take web profile ones.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#647 - 2014-05-14 08:57:12 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
the real answer has only been the meta for the last year.


Cry on the forums for nerfs? Lol


Ok, you said last year, that's been the fashion a lot longer but still Smile
Camper101
State War Academy
Caldari State
#648 - 2014-05-14 09:20:01 UTC
afkalt wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:
the real answer has only been the meta for the last year.


Cry on the forums for nerfs? Lol


Ok, you said last year, that's been the fashion a lot longer but still Smile



Apparently he means Slowcats. Slowcats are the natural counter to anything subcap.

Edit: *if you are doing them right

2013.03.01 13:30:58 notify For participating in the General Discussion Forum Section your trustworthiness has been adjusted by -2.5000.

My name is Hans. The "L" stands for danger.
Alghara
Les chevaliers de l'ordre
Goonswarm Federation
#649 - 2014-05-14 09:41:39 UTC
Feodor Romanov wrote:
So much OP crying! What about Angels, that can kite easily in a Dis range, or get close to any ship and withdraw at any moment because of speed? Or what to do with Serpentis, they can contol out of scram range and do best dps in the game? If you think that Mordu's is OP, you need to nerf those factions too. But I don't think that all three factions is OP, because their price is too high to be crap, they MUST be better then t2 analogs. look at all of them, they have good speed, tank, dps and range control capabilities, so mordu's is in line with mates. No ships in their class can fight them 1vs1, so use more ships or take web profile ones.


Again no.

Angel is turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Serpentis also turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Mordus Missile , none

This configuration with no real E-war.
Long range weapon, speed tank and long range disrupt

it's hydre at 5 head.
Feodor Romanov
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#650 - 2014-05-14 09:44:49 UTC
Alghara wrote:
Feodor Romanov wrote:
So much OP crying! What about Angels, that can kite easily in a Dis range, or get close to any ship and withdraw at any moment because of speed? Or what to do with Serpentis, they can contol out of scram range and do best dps in the game? If you think that Mordu's is OP, you need to nerf those factions too. But I don't think that all three factions is OP, because their price is too high to be crap, they MUST be better then t2 analogs. look at all of them, they have good speed, tank, dps and range control capabilities, so mordu's is in line with mates. No ships in their class can fight them 1vs1, so use more ships or take web profile ones.


Again no.

Angel is turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Serpentis also turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Mordus Missile , none

This configuration with no real E-war.
Long range weapon, speed tank and long range disrupt

it's hydre at 5 head.

you can use all of E-war arsenal except track disruptors
Ganthrithor
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#651 - 2014-05-14 10:01:17 UTC
I think I will buy an example of each of these ships because the art team did a nice job with them. I hope the engine flares are blue.

Dat 20th century stealth tech look, tho. Seriously, the frigate and cruiser are pretty good looking. I might even come back to EVE for a few days just to fly around in a blackops-fit ship that looks like a blackops ship ought to look (and can actually kite a bit to boot!).

I'm not going to make any detailed commentary about the ships before I can play with them in EFT, but good job on picking a simple theme that actually looks very flexible and usable. Given how OP the Stratios is, when I saw the stealth-fighter looks I totally expected them to be some new form of game-breaking covert-cloaking ships. I kind of wish they were, given that you've already set a pretty absurd precedent for how powerful covert ships can be with the Stratios and how well being sneaky would pair with a stealthy-looking hull, but these will do. Plus, you can't admire that great artwork when your ship is invisible!
Ganthrithor
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#652 - 2014-05-14 10:06:48 UTC
Seriously though, your art team. I love that they worked in not only visual elements of the F-117 and B-2, but also Northrop's early steath tech demonstrators. Dat art team, dat art team...
Cassius Invictus
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#653 - 2014-05-14 10:44:41 UTC
Alghara wrote:
Feodor Romanov wrote:
So much OP crying! What about Angels, that can kite easily in a Dis range, or get close to any ship and withdraw at any moment because of speed? Or what to do with Serpentis, they can contol out of scram range and do best dps in the game? If you think that Mordu's is OP, you need to nerf those factions too. But I don't think that all three factions is OP, because their price is too high to be crap, they MUST be better then t2 analogs. look at all of them, they have good speed, tank, dps and range control capabilities, so mordu's is in line with mates. No ships in their class can fight them 1vs1, so use more ships or take web profile ones.


Again no.

Angel is turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Serpentis also turret, you can use e-war weapon medium range
Mordus Missile , none

This configuration with no real E-war.
Long range weapon, speed tank and long range disrupt

it's hydre at 5 head.


Tell me which e-war you can't use? Damps? U can. ECM? U can? Web? U can. Scram/Disrupt? U can. Neut? U can.

The only one you can't use is tracking disruption.

A flight of Phantasms with Rapier support will trash this.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#654 - 2014-05-14 11:05:40 UTC
Rajeet Achmar wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:


Rethink your fit. Try cruise + AB + MJD + scram + web. You can leave any time you want.


And? You can do this in almost any battleship in the current state anyway, MJD is like a get out of jail free card for battleships.

Plus MJD won't work if you are scrammed, so I don't see how that is a get of jail free card at all really.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#655 - 2014-05-14 11:08:53 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Rajeet Achmar wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:


Rethink your fit. Try cruise + AB + MJD + scram + web. You can leave any time you want.


And? You can do this in almost any battleship in the current state anyway, MJD is like a get out of jail free card for battleships.


I think you're ignoring the scram range superiority of the barghest. IT gets to choose when to leave, not the non-Mordus opponent.

Pvp is as much (more) about dictating the terms of the encounter as anything else. The Mordus ships hold all the cards in this respect without having to give up speed, damage or tank.

Yes, but this only applies to the frigate as very few ships in the game can match it's speed allowing it to dictate. When it comes to the BS though then it isn't going to be able to dictate against many of the ships it will come up against as BS's are inherently slow, even the fastest ones.
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#656 - 2014-05-14 11:15:06 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


Grath is wrong. A pair of unbonused senor damps still leave the ship plenty of safe operating room, and a dedicated sensor damp ship only counters it insofar as a rack of bonused damps counter every. Which, to be fair, they do, but that's not a peculiar weakness.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#657 - 2014-05-14 11:15:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Medalyn Isis
Syzygium wrote:
Quote:
Mordu's ships are focused on three main themes: speed, missiles, and warp scram/disruptor range.

To FOCUS means to concentrate on ONE thing. Either they are fast, OR they are good missileboats OR they excel in tackling opponents. FOCUSING on THREE things is denying the meaning of FOCUS at all.

Maybe it is clear now why this concept will not work well. It is just too much focusing on too many things.

Precisely. Someone else who understands how the overall concept will not work. You can't have speed, the ability to dictate with long point range, and tank, and good missile dps. Basically you might as well just say the ship focuses on being OP.

Imo, the focus on speed and ability to dictate point range is what makes these ship far too powerful. If you do really want to give it that combination then DPS and tank needs to be severely diminished.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#658 - 2014-05-14 11:20:55 UTC
Milton Middleson wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
i love all the "it has no counter" posts when i'm pretty sure grath pointed out about 20 pages ago the obvious and common counter to these ships.

(hint: he said sensor damps)


Grath is wrong. A pair of unbonused senor damps still leave the ship plenty of safe operating room, and a dedicated sensor damp ship only counters it insofar as a rack of bonused damps counter every. Which, to be fair, they do, but that's not a peculiar weakness.

Plus a dampening ship won't actually be able to inflict any meaningful damage, the best it can do is manage to escape. If you call that a counter then you really don't understand pvp.

The natural counter would be either a ship which has higher max velocity, unfortunately the Garmur will probably outbrawl most of those ships anyway due to it's great EHP and dps. The other counter would be long range webs. But bringing a Rapier of Loki to take on a frigate isn't exactly what I call a viable counter, and Blood Raider webs are going to be too short range unless the Garmur pilot is incompetent.
Feodor Romanov
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#659 - 2014-05-14 11:21:03 UTC
Medalyn Isis wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Rajeet Achmar wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:


Rethink your fit. Try cruise + AB + MJD + scram + web. You can leave any time you want.


And? You can do this in almost any battleship in the current state anyway, MJD is like a get out of jail free card for battleships.


I think you're ignoring the scram range superiority of the barghest. IT gets to choose when to leave, not the non-Mordus opponent.

Pvp is as much (more) about dictating the terms of the encounter as anything else. The Mordus ships hold all the cards in this respect without having to give up speed, damage or tank.

Yes, but this only applies to the frigate as very few ships in the game can match it's speed allowing it to dictate. When it comes to the BS though then it isn't going to be able to dictate against many of the ships it will come up against as BS's are inherently slow, even the fastest ones.

dueling BS is smth from fantasy films. More like exception.
darius mclever
#660 - 2014-05-14 11:21:28 UTC
Every other pirate ship also focuses on 3 things. They even explained each of them in the fanfest presentation for ship balancing.