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We wouldn't need a thread lock if you would just state your (wrong) opinion and leave it without resorting to parachute posting the same drivel over pages with multiple alts.

So, this is clearly no longer correct, with the hacks added to round at the job instead of run level and always rounding up instead of close.

If ME was perfect before, odds are you're going to get a hefty round up, especially on small run sized jobs.

What is most funny is that the account LHA Tarawa, is actually the alt... the only forum alt I use.

This is precisely the situation T2 BPOs are in presently. Post Kronos, players who want these perfect BPOs are perfectly capable of buying them from players who have them. CCP hasn't taken any steps to change the T2 BPO situation, so I imagine they won't change things here either.

MDD

Im beginning to agree with CCP on this one. The only complaint I still maintain is moving to a 100 level system instead of a 10 level system.

Again I believe this would be simpler, and better for granulation and shortening those ridiculous research times.

This would also improve the rounding argument because you'd be rounding to the nearest 0.1% instead of the nearest 1%

This would mean that everyone with a BPO level 100 would get a perfect 100 BPO afterward,
ME 50 (0.196% waste) would get changed to level 98 (0.2% waste)
ME 23 (0.416% waste) would get upgraded to level 96 (0.4% waste)
ME 10 (0.909% waste) would get upgraded to level 91 (0.9% waste)

The only problem I could see this causing would be researching ME 0-5 would be like 1 second for all BPOs

This still doesnt fix the "grandfathering" issue, but at least the "grandfathered" BPOs would have had to have been very well researched (ME 100+) to be rounded up to perfect.

Ah yes, the well known might of the nullsec industry.



This assumes you know maths and have thought through what the new numbers actually mean.

Did you read my post on carrier construction, where the move to always round up means you have top produce billion ISK ships in bulk and to get a pretty goob BPO will take 5 years instead of 3 months? Move to 100 steps only takes a few months off the 5 years that will be required to get 11 to be 10 with the new "always round up".

There is a lot more that is really bad in what they are doing than just the big round up and the insanely longer research time.

It seems to me that they only thought about the BPOs that need minerals when designing the new material reductions ideas. Sure, who cares about a tiny round when you're dealing with numbers in the thousands.... But not everything takes inputs measured in the thousands. What seemed like a tiny round when only thinking about mineral inputs, becomes HUGE when the inputs are in single or low double digits like capital components, T2, POS structures and rigs.

There is still a lot here to hate.


I hate the idea of teams, because it is only going to make the large, rich corporations larger and richer at the expense of the casual player.

I hate the implementation of infinite slots that bases cost on total solar system wide usage rather than activity inside a specific facility that would allow all components for a titan to be built in a single component assembly array in a single small POS. It simply makes no sense. And IF CCP makes the usage information available through the API, then it is a super easy source of data on where your enemy is building his supers.

But, with all there is to hate, and so little to like, by far the worst, in my opinion, is the changes involving material reductions and what that does to the BPOs that need small numbers of inputs.

i realize the chance you'll understand this time when you have not understood ... anything, however I've already pointed out even if you have the money for long carrier runs that may not be the right move

however i genuinely don't think you can grasp things like churning capital being better than slightly higher margins so let me repeat for readers:

while you may get slightly higher profit margins if you install 5 runs of carriers at once, you can't sell carriers 1-4 in that time and buy minerals for new carriers. you're generally going to be better off when you can sell those carriers as they come out and immediately start a new one: two 5% profits beat one 7% profit. this will largely depend on your setup and market but you'll have to use your noggin

lha, of course, cannot figure that out

lha's math has been smashed into little bits more times than you can count, he just spams it to try to drown out the posts tearing it to shreads

Everything I see indicates the discounts for batch carrier runs is just an unintended side effect of trying to hack in fixes.

They misunderstood the source of the complexity, attacked the wrong thing, found they didn't actually remove the complexity, hacked in a change to do round at batch instead of run, that would have made round down a much bigger advantage than intended, so hacked in a ciel to always round up, and that broke single run carrier jobs.

They are just thrashing about trying to undo the damage they have done by not really unsdrstanding what they were doing.

Every time they hack in a fix for one thing they broke, they break something else.

As for "fixing" the really long research time, I don't see that being NEARLy as easy as some seem to think it will be. It is Base Time to Level * multiple for item type. Bring down the base times, and the items with low multiples become too easy to research to 10% reduction. Bring down the multiple for capital, and they become too easy to get to teh lower %s.

It's all the result of not thinking threw the ability to remove partial % research.

I still don't see ANYTHING good about the changes to research that could not have been achieved by something as simple as:
Waste = 10% / Waste Divider
where Waste Divider = old ME + 1.


If you couldn't figure out that researching to 2 waste divider drips waste to 5%, and 3 to 3.33% and 4 to 2.5%, then you should be doing manufacturing....



Then again, if you can't figure out that 10% + 1/(1+ME) where ME is 100 is DAMN close to 1/1000 waste and 50 is damn close to 1/500th waste, then you also probably shouldn't have been doing manufacturing.

The complexity came from multiplying the 10%/(1+ME) by the number of items needed to identify the inflection points in the rounding. Which they didn't fix, so they hacked in a change to move the complexity to manufacturing, which broke more stuff, so they hacked in another fix to always round up, so they broke more stuff.


And the apologists continue top pretend this is all intended, "good complexity".

Sad. Sad, sad, sad, sad,