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Claim wars or BLOB wars

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Justfortrade Heleneto
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-04-03 21:56:44 UTC
This theme was created to draw attention to the mechanics of claim wars

But first :what we imagine when we think of сlaim wars? War for territories, spectacular battles
But today it's just boring and broken


1) POWER blocks. Let's look at the map of New Eden. As you can see today there are 2 powerful Blocks (CFC and N3+PL) which don't allow the passage of any small alliance. Even to conquer small territory, small alliance must unite with others to form a giant(blob) alliance.

2) iHub mechanics. Do you imagine how to reinforce iHubs with RU/EU/US/AU timezones? To destroy ihub you should successfully attack them 2 times in the enemy timezone. For some people it's a middle of working day or late at night. RIP work or good sleep

3) Rent alliances. Crazy idea. In fact, giving a huge amount of money for each power blocks. What is this war, when quarter territories rented alliances? As a result, the blocks are so dependent on them that create any kind of OTEC

4) Eve node/TiDi. Node can't keep a massive amount of people. Let's all remember HED or B-R(and all the battles with the local 1k+). Creepy lags, TiDi 10%, dying node. B-R which lasted 13 hours real time. Without TiDi it would be a 2-3 hour battle.Yes, maybe it is technically impossible to do without, but it is directly related to сlaim wars?

NOTE: I do not want to blame any alliance in this topic (But if I did it - sorry Oops) . Apparently until you start whining about the situation, nothing will change (remember drone Assist).

P.S. Sorry for my EngRish

You can start to throw rotten tomatoes at me
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2 - 2014-04-03 22:07:12 UTC
Justfortrade Heleneto wrote:
Apparently until you start whining about the situation, nothing will change (remember drone Assist)


Until you "start" whining about something? START!?!?!!

People have been whining about this for longer than Ive been playing! Im sure the thread count on this subject is somewhere in the 7 digit range!!

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Mario Putzo
#3 - 2014-04-03 22:10:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Mario Putzo
Yes sov mechanics suck and encourage N+1 mentality. CCP should adopt a more "use it or lose it" approach. But since the only time CCP gets good press is when 4K dudes sit in 10% Tidi for 18 Hours, you'll be hard pressed to get them to make the massive changes that need to be made.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#4 - 2014-04-03 22:41:55 UTC
Both Goons and PL debase their renters, even make them wear the tags of PBLRD and B0T. Obviously they are not very serious about renting their space with such business acumen; the joke is literally on the renters.

CCP has mentioned from time to time making it possible for players to setup small communities under the noses of the larger entities. The recent deployables like the depot are a start (as is the behind-the-scenes coding for them), but it could be years before there are enough tools to make the dream possible.

Probably only w-space currently gives a small group of players the ability to take control of a system -- mass limits and random wormhole connections are great mechanics that make this possible -- at least temporarily, but there are (by design) no tools to allow players to improve and invest in their micro-community.

Until CCP makes something else possible, the status quo will likely be maintained.
masternerdguy
Doomheim
#5 - 2014-04-03 22:51:21 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
CCP has mentioned from time to time making it possible for players to setup small communities under the noses of the larger entities. The recent deployables like the depot are a start (as is the behind-the-scenes coding for them), but it could be years before there are enough tools to make the dream possible.


Why do people think they deserve to have smaller independent entities squatting on the territory of great coalitions? Unlike you, they actually worked together to get and hold that space. You could do the same if you actually made some friends and invested the effort, instead of asking CCP to hand you territory just because you're a corporation.

Things are only impossible until they are not.
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#6 - 2014-04-07 12:44:21 UTC
masternerdguy wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
CCP has mentioned from time to time making it possible for players to setup small communities under the noses of the larger entities. The recent deployables like the depot are a start (as is the behind-the-scenes coding for them), but it could be years before there are enough tools to make the dream possible.


Why do people think they deserve to have smaller independent entities squatting on the territory of great coalitions? Unlike you, they actually worked together to get and hold that space. You could do the same if you actually made some friends and invested the effort, instead of asking CCP to hand you territory just because you're a corporation.


Because when these smaller independent entities try to do their own landgrab they will find their stuff under siege by the large fish before you can even look up what ROI means. Some friends and some effort are not going to cut it, not by far, and especially not in nullsec. The effort required by smaller independent entities to sustain ownership of anything worthwhile through force is - by lack of another word - total masochism. I think it's a side effect of being told to "get out of hisec" only to discover that no matter where you go, everything worth a damn has already been claimed by massive entities protected by instant power projection.

Reminds me of deforestation. And subsequent problems with bears. Ahhh human nature, gotta love it! Lol
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#7 - 2014-04-07 12:55:38 UTC
If you dont wnat to join the Emerging Powers, you can always go live in a Worm Hole

Plenty of unclaimed or easily conquered WHs left

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Amyclas Amatin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2014-04-07 13:20:09 UTC
We only regret that there is only one universe to conquer.

For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/

Remember that whenever you have a bad day in EVE, the correct reponse is "Thank you CCP, may I please have another?"
E-2C Hawkeye
HOW to PEG SAFETY
#9 - 2014-04-07 13:33:14 UTC
masternerdguy wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
CCP has mentioned from time to time making it possible for players to setup small communities under the noses of the larger entities. The recent deployables like the depot are a start (as is the behind-the-scenes coding for them), but it could be years before there are enough tools to make the dream possible.


Why do people think they deserve to have smaller independent entities squatting on the territory of great coalitions? Unlike you, they actually worked together to get and hold that space. You could do the same if you actually made some friends and invested the effort, instead of asking CCP to hand you territory just because you're a corporation.

Ever herd of the great range wars from past U.S. western history? Because there is real life money at stake CCP will do what is required to keep subscriptions.

If that means making it easier for the smaller groups to own sov then thats what they will do.
Spurty
#10 - 2014-04-07 13:47:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Commander Spurty
Want to take an occupied system? Probably shouldn't even bother.

Look at this rubbish:

Sovereignty Blockade Unit: 50% resists (Owner will be glitching your attempts)
..Shield........10,000,000 (20mill effective HP)
..Armor........ 10,000,000 (20mill effective HP)
..Hull.......... 1,000,000 ( 1mill effective HP)
............................41mill to grind (Per SBU)
Outpost Services: No resists
..Fitting...... 81,000,000 (81mill effective HP)
..Cloning...... 54,000,000 (54mill effective HP)
..Factory...... 40,000,000 (40mill effective HP)
..Laboratory....40,000,000 (40mill effective HP)
..Repair........13,000,000 (13mill effective HP)
..Reprocessing..13,000,000 (13mill effective HP)
.......................... 241mill to grind
Part A) Outpost :
..1st timer.... 75,000,000 (75mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 48+-3 hours
..2nd timer.... 75,000,000 (75mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 48+-3 hours
..3rd timer....127,000,000 (127mill effective HP)
............................277mill to grind
Part B) I-HUB:
..1st timer.... 56,000,000 (56mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 24+-3 hours
..2nd timer.... 56,000,000 (56mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 24+-3 hours
..3rd timer.... 33,000,000 (33mill effective HP)
.......................... 145mill to grind

NOTE: You cannot attack TCU before you have parts A and B completed.

Territorial Claim Unit:
..Shield........10,000,000 (10mill effective HP)
..Armor........ 10,000,000 (10mill effective HP)
..Hull.......... 1,000,000 ( 1mill effective HP)
............................21mill to grind

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2014-04-07 13:54:02 UTC
Spurty wrote:
Want to take an occupied system? Probably shouldn't even bother.

Look at this rubbish:

Sovereignty Blockade Unit: 50% resists (Owner will be glitching your attempts)
..Shield........10,000,000 (20mill effective HP)
..Armor........ 10,000,000 (20mill effective HP)
..Hull.......... 1,000,000 ( 1mill effective HP)
............................41mill to grind (Per SBU)
Outpost Services: No resists
..Fitting...... 81,000,000 (81mill effective HP)
..Cloning...... 54,000,000 (54mill effective HP)
..Factory...... 40,000,000 (40mill effective HP)
..Laboratory....40,000,000 (40mill effective HP)
..Repair........13,000,000 (13mill effective HP)
..Reprocessing..13,000,000 (13mill effective HP)
.......................... 241mill to grind
Part A) Outpost :
..1st timer.... 75,000,000 (75mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 48+-3 hours
..2nd timer.... 75,000,000 (75mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 48+-3 hours
..3rd timer....127,000,000 (127mill effective HP)
............................277mill to grind
Part B) I-HUB:
..1st timer.... 56,000,000 (56mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 24+-3 hours
..2nd timer.... 56,000,000 (56mill effective HP)
....NOW WAIT 24+-3 hours
..3rd timer.... 33,000,000 (33mill effective HP)
.......................... 145mill to grind

NOTE: You cannot attack TCU before you have parts A and B completed.

Territorial Claim Unit:
..Shield........10,000,000 (10mill effective HP)
..Armor........ 10,000,000 (10mill effective HP)
..Hull.......... 1,000,000 ( 1mill effective HP)
............................21mill to grind

To be fair Tri is just bad at Eve.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Varesk
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-04-07 20:16:49 UTC
Justfortrade Heleneto wrote:
This theme was created to draw attention to the mechanics of claim wars

But first :what we imagine when we think of сlaim wars? War for territories, spectacular battles
But today it's just boring and broken


1) POWER blocks. Let's look at the map of New Eden. As you can see today there are 2 powerful Blocks (CFC and N3+PL) which don't allow the passage of any small alliance. Even to conquer small territory, small alliance must unite with others to form a giant(blob) alliance.

2) iHub mechanics. Do you imagine how to reinforce iHubs with RU/EU/US/AU timezones? To destroy ihub you should successfully attack them 2 times in the enemy timezone. For some people it's a middle of working day or late at night. RIP work or good sleep

3) Rent alliances. Crazy idea. In fact, giving a huge amount of money for each power blocks. What is this war, when quarter territories rented alliances? As a result, the blocks are so dependent on them that create any kind of OTEC

4) Eve node/TiDi. Node can't keep a massive amount of people. Let's all remember HED or B-R(and all the battles with the local 1k+). Creepy lags, TiDi 10%, dying node. B-R which lasted 13 hours real time. Without TiDi it would be a 2-3 hour battle.Yes, maybe it is technically impossible to do without, but it is directly related to сlaim wars?

NOTE: I do not want to blame any alliance in this topic (But if I did it - sorry Oops) . Apparently until you start whining about the situation, nothing will change (remember drone Assist).

P.S. Sorry for my EngRish

You can start to throw rotten tomatoes at me


PL are members of CFC due to their b0tfagl0rd agreement.

N3 is now N2 due to Nexus fleet Alliance disbanding and joining Nulli as a single corp.
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#13 - 2014-04-07 22:43:04 UTC
A thread that belongs in CAOD but is started by an NPC alt and as such cannot be moved to its appropriate place, gets a straight lock.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)