EVE General Discussion

So... how exactly did Erotica 1 intimidate him? Did the contest sound intimidated or give any indication that he was intimidated?

You're trying to frame this into me being some criminal, desperate to justify my actions.

The problem here is I don't have to. My playstyle is covered the EULA. Think about it for a little while... EVE Online has existed for 10 years, more or less unchanged in regards to CCP's attitude towards scamming and ganking.

And now here you and your ilk come... thinking they're going to change things with the "sword of moral authority".

Um. Question for you to ponder: Do you think CCP has made some oversight for the past 10 years?

Yeah...

People being mean in teamspeak and hurt feelings.

We do indeed live in trying times.

Bloodmyst Ranwar is admittedly new to the game. Give him some time, he'll "get it" one day, or he won't.

(Where you end up usually depends on where you start so I'm going to guess he won't; he'll decide to be just an angry moralistic carebear).

I've long since given up on drinking coffee. I'm now running a drip directly into my veins.

This sounds like lies.

Gee I wonder why.

Isn't it disgusting how a CSM candidate is trying to piggyback on this to raise awareness and publicity for his running?

The logs would show if they really did spam convo, and that is in fact punishable by CCP as has been stated rather recently, although for a first time most likely just a warning or short temp ban. So I would agree that it is likely made up.

Where is the part that it's all entirely voluntary lost on you?

Isn't it rather fair for people connected to Erotica to be common posters, what with it being about them?

I have followed this affront to common decency across several forums, including this 300+ page threadnaught, and I felt it necessary to add my voice to the din, because to do nothing would make me just as guilty as those who commited this atrocity to begin with.

I would like to begin by allaying any fears you gankers and scammers may have that I'm here to urge CCP to do something to curtail your right to your douchebaggery. I see no reason to change any of the EULA/TOS, because what is already there is quite sufficient to handle this.

The bulk of you can skip to the end and begin my crucifixion now, since you don't seem to be fettered by silly things like facts anyway.

First, "it's not torture because he could leave at any time.' Despite several posts and references to case studies in which roughly 8 out of 10 people in similar situations could not bring themselves to walk away from a situation they knew to be untenable, you still insist on defending this position? (look up "Prior Investment Trap" or read Scott Plous - the Psychology of Judgment and Decision Making Investment Traps) Arguements that it wasn't turture because he wasn't hung from the ceiling or had fingers removed are equally ludicrous. The type or degree of torture does not define torture, merely its severity.

Two wrongs do not make a right. The fact that the man snapped and resorted to racial slurs does not justify his being strung along and abused for hours. I grew up with race riots due to government imposed forced integration. A friend of mine has a plastic bag where his bladder used to be due to being stabbed in the back repeatedly, for no reason other than the color of his skin. I have plenty of reason to hate these types of remarks, because I know what they can, and often do, lead to. However, I can also see that being manipulated into a position of total frustration and feeling the only weapons left to you are words, you might say things you normally wouldn't. It doesn't make it right, but certainly no worse than a predator using an online game to find victims for premeditated, acts of degradation.

Premeditation is also a key here in that, E1 knew what he was doing was a violation of the EULA/TOS. Why else would he try to get around them by drawing his victim off to an outside VOIP program, despite the game having one that works just fine? A loop-hole that doesn't technically exist. Rule 1 of the TOS "You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP, including customer service personnel and volunteers." Nowhere in that statement does it stipulate that the infraction is required to happen in game. This is not setting a precedent either, since CCP has already gone after one member of the community for threatening another player out of game. "I want to reassure you that CCP in no way condones the harassment of players, especially those who suffer from depression or suicidal thoughts, as we understand the possible consequences of such abhorrent behaviour."

4. "You may not use “role-playing” as an excuse to violate these rules." Especially since the minute E1 had taken all of his victim's possessions, there was nothing more, game related, to be gained from continuing the farce.

7. "You may not violate any local, state, national or international laws or regulations." Regardless of the outcome, any lawsuit of this type would certainly put Eve and CCP in the spotlight, and being found guilty in the court of public opinion is far easier and requires far less evidence. Not to mention that it opens up this option, "CCP may take any action it deems appropriate regarding any User Content, if CCP believes, in its sole discretion, that such User Content violates the EULA or may expose CCP, its licensors and/or its suppliers to liability, damage CCP's relationship with any of its suppliers, licensors, ISPs or other users of EVE, harm anyone or harm CCP's reputation or goodwill." The "User Content" in this case, being the uploaded recordings of these torture sessions. Of course, CCP doesn't need a reason do ban either, or both, of the parties involved, or anybody else for that matter, since rules 25, "CCP reserves the right to close, temporarily or permanently, any user’s account without advance notice as we deem necessary." and 26 "We reserve the right to ban any user from the game without refund or compensation." already cover it.

It has been argued that, should CCP step in, we would start down a slippery slope, but no offer of any other advice, no defining line, is made. There is no slippery slope. The people have stated their defining line, 300 plus pages worth. A line has been crossed from the game world into the real world. If CCP chooses to continue to do nothing, they are as good as condoning this behavior, and announcing to the world that they care nothing for what happens to their customers. If nothing comes of this, not only will the victimization and dehumanization of other players continue, it will grow. More and more members will not want to be associated with such a doctrine, and Eve's population will drop. Just within my corp, at least half are already questioning if they'll be renewing their subscriptions, and several others have flat out said that they will not if CCP chooses to do nothing.

How much is too much. Ask yourself, how far does it have to go before something should be done? The game is open for 13 and up. What if it were a child? What if that child snapped and killed himself? Would you finally find your conscience then?