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Navi Annages
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3661 - 2014-03-26 20:55:11 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:
Puuhanalle wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:

You know you can continue to falsely claim that all Erotica 1 does is getting songs out of people he scams all day long, and you won't be fooling anybody.

That record goes on for three hours and is full of enhanced interrogation techniques and mental torture.

You are lying to whiteknight real life psychopathy.

I Just had to do a google search on enhanced interrogation techniques cause I had no idea what those could be. There actually was a wikipedia arcticle by that name. Here's a quote:
Quote:
Enhanced interrogation techniques or alternative set of procedures are terms the George W. Bush administration used to describe methods of torture, including hypothermia, stress positions and waterboarding.

Damn looks like you must have been right. All of that stuff was clearly happening on that recording.


"Sleep deprivation. Check.
Creating a state of learned helplessness. Check.
Subjecting the victim to interrogation for long periods. Check.
Isolating or surrounding the victim psychologically. Check.
Inflicting pressure through greed or blackmail. Check.
Exploitation of phobias, such as -- say -- making a man with an admitted speech impediment perform long periods of public speaking. Check."


1: He was not forcibly kept awake.
2: Debatable.
3: What interrogation? A few questions at the beginning of the recording and interspersed =!= long period of interrogation.
4: This is unverifiable - what does it mean to "isolate and surround" psychologically?
5: One check.
6: It is unknown that the client had a phobia. Suffice to say if the client did have a phobia who would not have so readily engaged in said behaviors without exhibiting stress, which he did not.

No leg to stand on, again, you're sat down, little bee. (I noticed you completely ignored my other post - a little too inconvenient maybe? Hehehehehehehehehe )


God your great at debating. Can we go steady after this is all said and done? Lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8-JfK-wwFU
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#3662 - 2014-03-26 20:55:20 UTC
Whose fault is it that he gave all his stuff away?

Oh god.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#3663 - 2014-03-26 20:55:21 UTC
Danalee wrote:
Alp Khan wrote:

"Sleep deprivation. Check.
Creating a state of learned helplessness. Check.
Subjecting the victim to interrogation for long periods. Check.
Isolating or surrounding the victim psychologically. Check.
Inflicting pressure through greed or blackmail. Check.
Exploitation of phobias, such as -- say -- making a man with an admitted speech impediment perform long periods of public speaking. Check."


Who deprived that bigot of sleep?
Who allowed the interrogation to take place?
Which racist isolated himself?
Which homophobe was greedy?
How is ignoring a small speech hickup anything more than common courtesy?

Why are you trying so hard?

D.

Bear


I wonder that myself. As I see it, an individual is 1st and formost responsible for himself. That doesn't mean that what other people do isn't wrong, it means that the only thing you CAN do is protect yourself as best you can.

The above principle was tought to me as a small child and reinforced well into adulthood. I simply don't know how people are rasing kids these days that people don't seem to understand this.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#3664 - 2014-03-26 20:55:31 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
In EVE? Absolutely.

This wasn't in EVE.

Xuixien wrote:
I'm actually sad that no tormenting actually took place, though.

Except it did.

I agree, he has a horrible singing voice.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Tarojan
Tarojan Corporation
#3665 - 2014-03-26 20:55:35 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Tarojan wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Hi, my name is Joe.
I have a reputation for kicking small children in the face.
A week ago this boy of age 7 stood in front of me in the grocery store line so I kicked him in the face.
Kid should have known better than to stand in front of me, after all I do have a reputation.
To punish his stupidity I kicked him in the face and stomach several more times.



real life...game....real life...game....

You having troubles telling the difference between the two bud?

You seem to be having trouble telling where they separate.
If you torment someone for hours on a voice chat to the point where you're systematically attacking things like speech impediments, then it certainly has gone too far and crossed into the point of torment.


At which point you click on an X (or pull a plug out of the wall) and it's over.

This is one of the problems with modern society: no one expects grown folks to take care of themselves anymore.


I hate how people equate this to cyber bullying. You know whats so bad about being bullied? you can't make it stop. They come after you day after day. Its the fear more then anything else, the sick anticipation of more pain and humilation that you just cant prevent being inflicted upon you. The shame you feel and self loathing can become crippling too.

Thats not what happened here. Its not even close to what happened here. Im surprised so many dont understand that.

Will gank for food
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#3666 - 2014-03-26 20:56:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Xuixien
Warmonger Murderalt wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Warmonger Murderalt wrote:


That's the problem with this community though, it's so isolated that it seems to have lost touch with what's acceptable and what is not. It has stewed in its own toxic pool for so long that people seem to have accept such behavior as the norm.


Acceptable in what setting? I can suicide gank/pod you all day, but IRL if I destroyed property or hurt someone I'd be in jail pretty fast.

So really your statement... is nonsense without some context behind it.

The fact is: If it's not against the EULA/TOS or any laws... it's acceptable in EVE.

Sorry if you don't find it personally acceptable - but that's your failure, not EVE or EVE's community.


Let me make things simple on this point:
You can suicide gank/pod me all day if you like as that is an in game mechanic, and in real life if you hurt someone you'd be in jail, because one is a supported in game mechanic that has benefits and consequences and the other is in real life exactly as you said. While there are many things to be argued about the behavior involved, as stated, when he took it out of the game and into real life an obvious line was crossed where now we find the community in this mess.

And there are many things that are not allowed in EVE that are neither illegal in most countries nor specifically stated in the EULA/TOS as being forbidden but are covered by more general terms. But that's besides my point, which is that the behavior is being dragged into the public eye against the wishes of those who believe this is acceptable and that should it be dragged into the public eye it will hurt the image of EVE and CCP will be forced to react and everyone involved will end up much worse off than they would have had they responded correctly in the beginning.


He didn't take it "to real life". It was on TeamSpeak. Is TeamSpeak "real life"? Is the Internet "real life"? He used an out of game communication tool, but everything was still within the context of EVE Online.

Had it been on EVE Voice vs TeamSpeak your argument would be invalid. Your argument is based on something that's just incidental. This is why you're argument is weak and falls apart.

If anything, Ripard Teg should be punished for creating so much bad publicity for CCP out of an event that goes on in the game... pretty much on a weekly basis that has never drawn so much inter-media attention.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Navi Annages
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3667 - 2014-03-26 20:56:22 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Whose fault is it that he gave all his stuff away?


The greedy racists fault thats who.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8-JfK-wwFU
Jill Chastot
WE FORM BL0B Inc.
Goonswarm Federation
#3668 - 2014-03-26 20:56:39 UTC
Oh my, This sure is a threadnaught, Maybe when i come back it will have evolved into a Thritan...

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=298596&find=unread OATHS wants you. Come to the WH "Safety in eve is the greatest fallacy you will ever encounter. Once you accept this you will truely enjoy this game."
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#3669 - 2014-03-26 20:57:18 UTC
Navi Annages wrote:
He knew he had been scammed the moment he entered the channel whatever happens from that moment on is is own falsified vet self fault.

Why does the situation being his fault make the actions of Erotica 1 and his cohorts acceptable?
Could have have avoided the scam? Of course he could.
Could he have left the room? Of course he could, but he'd never get his assets back.
Did he think he could get his assets back if he endured the bonus round? Of course he did.
But that's not the purpose of the bonus round. The only purpose is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#3670 - 2014-03-26 20:58:23 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Whose fault is it that he gave all his stuff away?


Obviously he was coerced under the duress of being on TS3!!!!!

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#3671 - 2014-03-26 20:58:35 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
The only purpose is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.

Completely false. It's about ISK only.

Oh god.
Faenir Antollare
For Ever And Ever
#3672 - 2014-03-26 20:59:02 UTC
You Guy's n Gal's mostly all be a workin on da railroad, ever the yonder..

RiP BooBoo 26/7/1971 - 23/7/2014 My Lady My Love My Life My Wife
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#3673 - 2014-03-26 20:59:54 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
The only purpose is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.

Completely false. It's about ISK only.

There's no ISK benefit to them continuing with the mark after they've already taken everything he had.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#3674 - 2014-03-26 21:00:01 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
He wasn't "free to leave" at any time. His leaving would mean instant forfeiture of all of the assets he'd previously handed over. Of course at that point he was never getting them back, but him not realizing that doesn't suddenly justify what was done.

That in no way implies that he wasn't free to leave at any time if he decided things had gone too far.

He's an adult, quit assuming you need to do his thinking for him.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#3675 - 2014-03-26 21:00:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
He wasn't "free to leave" at any time. His leaving would mean instant forfeiture of all of the assets he'd previously handed over. Of course at that point he was never getting them back, but him not realizing that doesn't suddenly justify what was done.


Imaginary video game assets. If he can't understand that those things meant nothing, then how is that someone else's problem?

If they mean nothing to you then you're free to hand all of yours over to me.
I'm sure if you got duped into giving all of your assets away you'd shrug it off instead of trying to find any way possible of getting them back.


You know thats a very bad fallacy right? My items mean something to me...UP TO A POINT. A healthy person has a dividing line between virtual and real.

So when thos XXPIZZA guys killed my ratting mach in Fountain when I was in TEST, it hurt...like a paper cut. It wasn't like my car was repossesed lol.

I've lost billions of isk being dumb before, like my JF that I lost in jita autopiloting while drunk. But at no point did I lose my mind over things that, at the end of the day, don't really mean anything. I felt bad last week and a dude I was playing chess with knocked my rook off.

I don't know why you are being willfully obtuse James. You know better.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#3676 - 2014-03-26 21:00:02 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:

Did he think he could get his assets back if he endured the bonus round? Of course he did.


He could have. People do win the bonus round.

The "no other purpose but to humiliate" - don't really see how much weight this has. People regularly gank in EVE just for the sake of tears. It's an acceptable thing, as is making someone sing for a ransom.

Sorry, again, no weight.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#3677 - 2014-03-26 21:00:50 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Riot Girl wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
The only purpose is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.

Completely false. It's about ISK only.

There's no ISK benefit to them continuing with the mark after they've already taken everything he had.


There's an ISK benefit to the client if they win the bonus round.

"For profit" does not always mean for your profit.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Hans Zwaardhandler
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#3678 - 2014-03-26 21:01:26 UTC
Anomaly One wrote:
if Erotica 1 gets banned
****. this. game.

You're gonna tell me that an idiot who willfully stays that long singing songs and humiliating himself deserves any kind of sympathy, so now we're gonna protect idiots? oh how sad..

and holy **** seriously 180 pages??????


The issue isn't protecting idiots (enough of them buy into scams on the market on a daily basis to fund a small African nation off of RMT). The issue is harassment of an individual. Scams are not the issue, it's people who drag stuff like this out in order to get kicks to it, which in most cases if they did this in real life, many would agree that they are "not the best person around".

Scams are a business. Harassment and public shaming of a victim via recordings of him and such should be where we draw the line in this game, if for the simple fact it makes the rest of the playerbase look terrible and nothing else. How Erotica 1 can be defended for this I fail to see as it is a detestable action to publicly name, shame, and have your recordings of people being tormented put online for others to laugh at and take pleasure in.
David Kir
Hotbirds
#3679 - 2014-03-26 21:01:38 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
The only purpose is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.

Completely false. It's about ISK only.


It may be, but it involves provoking and humiliating another player, recording all of it and making it public.

Friends are like cows: if you eat them, they die.
Danalee
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#3680 - 2014-03-26 21:01:46 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
The only purpose of the bonus room is to humiliate the victim for as long as possible. The assets are already taken so there's no other point to it.


Wrong, wrong and WRONG.

Asking someone to do silly things <> humiliating someone.

Being a racist bigot and having your wife fight your online spacebattles for you is humiliating yourself.
BIG difference.

D.

Bear

Proud member of the Somalian Coast Guard Authority

Member and Juror of the Court of Crime and Punishment