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Blackops: messed up

Author
Elvis Preslie
NRDS Securities
#1 - 2014-03-02 02:40:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Elvis Preslie
Originally, ccp didnt have ability to put covert ops cloaks on black ops because they were able to do 500% speed when cloaked. NOw they've taken that away but didnt add ability to do covert ops.

Also, the panther has 6 mid slots and 6 low slots but, due to lack of cpu, you cant even fill the 4 mid slots when 2 more LOW slots, for a total of 8, would be more useful - if they dont add more cpu.

So, PLEASE, ccp:


  1. Add two (2) more low slots and take away 2 mid slots OR add more cpu.

  2. Add back the 500% cloaked speed bonus OR give us ability to fit a covert ops cloak device; if you go with the cloaking device, do the 99% cpu reduction and add more cpu in addition to what you decided to add in the first suggestion.


Of course, the above suggstions are based on the panther; whatever you decide, you need to make sure other black ops ships are changed fairly so they can utilize all the slots they have.

For a ship thats 1.2 billion, its ridiculous I cant get more hpe than any other BS and that I cant keep it alive easier than the othersr. 5 second cloak reactivation isnt that useful compared to covert ops. Seriously, I didnt train 6 million more sp to DOWNGRADE from covert ops to black ops.

An alliance member pointed out that speed bonus may be broken though; im using a "syndicate cloaking device" and I only get 70.1m/s speed, cloaked
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#2 - 2014-03-02 07:36:40 UTC
Elvis Preslie wrote:

An alliance member pointed out that speed bonus may be broken though; im using a "syndicate cloaking device" and I only get 70.1m/s speed, cloaked


There really might be something borked with this particular cloak. My BLOPs goes from 130+m/s to 180m/s with a Caldari Navy Cloak.

As for the other suggestion, especially the HP, I think that they are sufficiently tankable.They are supposed to be weaker than T1 BS in some way to compensate for their damage and their ability to jump on their own. I rather have a bit less HP than less jump range, to be quite honest.


UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Kal'el Nirukhi
Spartan Industries
#3 - 2014-03-02 07:42:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Kal'el Nirukhi
warping cloaked is overpowered? What about we only allow them to warp cloaked. This would gimp it considerably.

Edit: This means you can't warp when decloaked

Edit: a bs sized remote ecm burst might be handy so he can break lock to cloak and warp ( or a range and strength bonus to local ecm burst )
Anhenka
The New Federation
Sigma Grindset
#4 - 2014-03-02 07:50:31 UTC
A: CCP has said in the past making Blops less tanky than t1 was intentional, they didn't want them to be marauder levels of strong with jump drives and cloaks. This is very unlikely to change.

B: Blops rework is coming probably this summer. There's no point repeating the same complaints that people have had over and over and over again until we see how CCP wants to shape them post rework. They have already had years of input, and I'd expect they already have the basic outlines of how they want them to function after.

C: Being able to increase in speed when cloaked with a faction cloak has been a rather amusing side note to Blops for a long time. Don't sweat it too much.

Elvis Preslie wrote:
Seriously, I didnt train 6 million more sp to DOWNGRADE from covert ops to black ops.


If you trained all the fairly lengthy time to use a Panther without even knowing how they operated, then yes, you most certainly did train 6 mil SP to downgrade. Get over it.
Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
#5 - 2014-03-02 08:02:50 UTC
Enable them to use Afterburner or MWD while cloaked, class fixed.
Sigras
Conglomo
#6 - 2014-03-02 09:08:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Sigras
lol we found someone who fits their ship without even checking the stats of the modules he fits.

the improved cloaking device II gives you -75% speed
the syndicate cloaking device gives you -90% speed

You want to complain about the BOPS ship after you learn how to use the compare tool?

I mean seriously, its gotta take a special kind of person to drop 200 million on a module without even knowing why it's so much more expensive or if its worth it.
seth Hendar
I love you miners
#7 - 2014-03-03 09:13:44 UTC
Anhenka wrote:
A: CCP has said in the past making Blops less tanky than t1 was intentional, they didn't want them to be marauder levels of strong with jump drives and cloaks. This is very unlikely to change.

B: Blops rework is coming probably this summer. There's no point repeating the same complaints that people have had over and over and over again until we see how CCP wants to shape them post rework. They have already had years of input, and I'd expect they already have the basic outlines of how they want them to function after.

C: Being able to increase in speed when cloaked with a faction cloak has been a rather amusing side note to Blops for a long time. Don't sweat it too much.

Elvis Preslie wrote:
Seriously, I didnt train 6 million more sp to DOWNGRADE from covert ops to black ops.


If you trained all the fairly lengthy time to use a Panther without even knowing how they operated, then yes, you most certainly did train 6 mil SP to downgrade. Get over it.

tbh, judjing by the last 2 expansion, i just hope that CCP forgets about rebalancing the black ops and just keep them the way they are...... they are in bad shape, but still, at least they can be used
M1k3y Koontz
Speaker for the Dead
Stay Feral
#8 - 2014-03-03 11:29:35 UTC
Your problem is the syndicate cloak, its got a -90% velocity bonus.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.

Luscius Uta
#9 - 2014-03-03 13:50:34 UTC
Anhenka wrote:
A: CCP has said in the past making Blops less tanky than t1 was intentional, they didn't want them to be marauder levels of strong with jump drives and cloaks. This is very unlikely to change.


Nevertheless, it's silly that Black ops have less tank than stealth bombers (when you compare them with other ships in same category). Nobody wants them to be as tanky as Marauders, but nobody wants their use to be limited to ganking mining fleets in nullsec. They could also get few unique bonuses, like reduced scan resolution penalty from equipped cloaks and bonus to cap booster injection amount.

Workarounds are not bugfixes.

Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#10 - 2014-03-03 15:01:35 UTC
Hm... Not to brag, but you can gank a lot more than mining fleets in 00 with them. Cool

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#11 - 2014-03-03 15:13:42 UTC
Elvis Preslie wrote:


Also, the panther has 6 mid slots and 6 low slots but, due to lack of cpu, you cant even fill the 4 mid slots when 2 more LOW slots, for a total of 8, would be more useful - if they dont add more cpu.



how about fitting according to fitting resouces and deal with it?
The panther is fine for what it does, the equation is easy if its too bad for you dont use it.
It is a gank ship anyways so you shouldnt rely on tank anyways, hit and run, they arent for direct combat.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#12 - 2014-03-03 15:26:47 UTC
sounds like a bit of buyers remorse from someone that doesn't know what they're talking about.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.

Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2014-03-03 15:58:06 UTC
I'd be happy if they gave them a little more damage. I don't exactly plan to stay on grid long enough for my tank to really even matter.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-03-04 00:50:01 UTC
Batelle wrote:
sounds like a bit of buyers remorse from someone that doesn't know what they're talking about.



and this could have been avoided by talking with the blops who ran in their cyno gangs. I knew many aspects of the blops game I might get into as when slow I'd go to a widow pilot if in the crew "tell me about the widow" if a slow time in the op.


Also funny panther is not enough for him. In terms of gank potential panther and redeemer are top 2 choices really. They can fight for number 1 slot really. Could they use more love? Sure. But widow and and sin are in need of it more as they fight to not be in last place.
Elvis Preslie
NRDS Securities
#15 - 2014-03-20 01:49:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Elvis Preslie
moved down....ccp, give us ability to delete our posts or move them down correctly, so that a thread isnt clutter of replies from same person SmileBig smile
Ella Echerie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-03-20 02:02:00 UTC
Elvis Preslie wrote:


lol we found someone who reads but doesnt comprehend something.

WRONG< it does -69% instead of improved's -75%




Thats 69% fitted, incuding the BLOPS hull bonus. Syndicate cloak has -90% modifier.
Elvis Preslie
NRDS Securities
#17 - 2014-03-20 02:05:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Elvis Preslie
Sigras wrote:
lol we found someone who fits their ship without even checking the stats of the modules he fits.


the syndicate cloaking device gives you -90% speed

not worth it.


lol we found someone who reads but doesnt comprehend something.

even if it does -69% WITH the bonus.........shouldnt it be 125%-90%, to be +35%, instead of -69%? this bonus is still messed up. with the improved, it should be -75% + 125% to be +50% at the end.

Robert Caldera wrote:


how about fitting according to fitting resouces and deal with it?
The panther is fine for what it does, the equation is easy if its too bad for you dont use it.
It is a gank ship anyways so you shouldnt rely on tank anyways, hit and run, they arent for direct combat.


I wasnt complaining of the tank or that the tank is bad or anything. it does same as a t1 tempest fitted same actually. I was saying, DONT GIVE US 6 MID SLOTS THAT WE CANT USE, FOR LACK OF CPU!. The cpu is inefficient to fit even all t2 electronics modules that would fit on a RIFTER, in addition to 100mn afterburner and etc.

I was also saying, if you guys would read or comprehend what you read, that we NEED COVERT OPS CLOAK OR put back the 500% speed bonus that we had. The reason we didnt have covert ops was because of the 500% speed cloaked. Yes, this is a jump ship; we should have less tank and etc BUT we should NOT have slots you cant use no matter how you fit it. Even with NOT allowing more tank, by limiting cpu (after allowing mid slots to be filled snugly and have 6 tank modules), one or two more LOW slots to fit NANOFIBERS (or etc that dont take cpu or power) would be NICE on a blops!! Since we have an open mid slot, for lack of cpu, take it away and give another LOW slot....we cant fit anymore tank modules so only use of this slot would be for nanofibers, overdrive, or etc. that doesnt take cpu.

I dont know of the widow or the others but the panther cant fit 6 800mm auto's, the cloak, the bridge, the afterburner, the tank, AND have cpu for warp scrambler/disruptor, tech II, a stasis webbifier II, a tracking computer II. YOu cant even use meta 4 variants and not have one open mid slot, much less EXPECT to have open mid slot and use all tech II electronics moduless Someone said fit ECM and etc in thread above....thats really funny with the cpu it has (or doesn have)
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
#18 - 2014-03-20 04:49:34 UTC
Elvis Preslie wrote:
Sigras wrote:
lol we found someone who fits their ship without even checking the stats of the modules he fits.


the syndicate cloaking device gives you -90% speed

not worth it.


lol we found someone who reads but doesnt comprehend something.

even if it does -69% WITH the bonus.........shouldnt it be 125%-90%, to be +35%, instead of -69%? this bonus is still messed up. with the improved, it should be -75% + 125% to be +50% at the end.

Robert Caldera wrote:


how about fitting according to fitting resouces and deal with it?
The panther is fine for what it does, the equation is easy if its too bad for you dont use it.
It is a gank ship anyways so you shouldnt rely on tank anyways, hit and run, they arent for direct combat.


I wasnt complaining of the tank or that the tank is bad or anything. it does same as a t1 tempest fitted same actually. I was saying, DONT GIVE US 6 MID SLOTS THAT WE CANT USE, FOR LACK OF CPU!. The cpu is inefficient to fit even all t2 electronics modules that would fit on a RIFTER, in addition to 100mn afterburner and etc.

wall of shouty text - snip


quick question - this tempest fit - arty or auto?

For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.