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[Rubicon 1.3] T1 Frigate and Cruiser Balance Pass

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Author
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#21 - 2014-02-26 12:25:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Garviel Tarrant
This will do nothing to help the punisher, its still going to be utter garbage.

The rifter will be a bit better... Could you also make it possible to fit arties on T1 frigates? The fitting differential between small arties and small AC's is batshit insane.

One big flaw with both these ships is that utility highs are about as useful as half a extra midslot/lowslot.. so they effectively have less slots than the ones that don't have ****** utility highs.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

sytaqe violacea
Circus of midnight
#22 - 2014-02-26 12:26:34 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:

RIFTER:
Removed +7.5% Small Projectile Turret tracking bonus
Added +10% Small Projectile Turret falloff bonus
+10 m/s velocity
+0.01 inertia


Yes! This is what I have been waiting for.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#23 - 2014-02-26 12:26:55 UTC  |  Edited by: TrouserDeagle
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
This will do nothing to help the punisher, its still going to be utter garbage.

The rifter will be a bit better... Could you also make it possible to fit arties on T1 frigates? The fitting differential between small arties and small AC's is batshit insane.

One big flaw with both these ships is that utility highs are about as useful as half a extra midslot/lowslot.. so they effectively have less slots than the ones that don't have ****** utility highs.


just like medium and large.

edit: also, I hear nos and neut is really good for scram kiting.
Morwennon
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#24 - 2014-02-26 12:27:33 UTC
The falloff bonus is probably more useful than tracking for the RIfter, but I don't think that it's going to be enough to make it competitive in the current frigate meta.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#25 - 2014-02-26 12:28:48 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
This will do nothing to help the punisher, its still going to be utter garbage.

The rifter will be a bit better... Could you also make it possible to fit arties on T1 frigates? The fitting differential between small arties and small AC's is batshit insane.

One big flaw with both these ships is that utility highs are about as useful as half a extra midslot/lowslot.. so they effectively have less slots than the ones that don't have ****** utility highs.


just like medium and large.

edit: also, I hear nos and neut is really good for scram kiting.


Well its not AS batshit insane.

Also yes neuting that guy you're keeping at 7.5km works great.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Jason Itiner
Harmless People
#26 - 2014-02-26 12:29:23 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
This will do nothing to help the punisher, its still going to be utter garbage.

The rifter will be a bit better... Could you also make it possible to fit arties on T1 frigates? The fitting differential between small arties and small AC's is batshit insane.

One big flaw with both these ships is that utility highs are about as useful as half a extra midslot/lowslot.. so they effectively have less slots than the ones that don't have ****** utility highs.


I tested a Punisher fitted purely for neuts in PVP once. It worked, but our 3-man gang wasn't enough to capitalize on that against two opponents. We agreed that if it were a 3-1 or a 4-2 (another neuting Punisher), it would have been quite an effective little bugger.
scruff decima
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2014-02-26 12:29:57 UTC
Are the changes to logi frig cap recharge (ms I assume) significant? or just to offset the recharge from increased base cap? (ie, if I was cap stable before, will I be cap stable after?)
TAckermassacker
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-02-26 12:33:39 UTC
is the + cap recharge time in milliseconds?
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#29 - 2014-02-26 12:34:33 UTC
Jason Itiner wrote:
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
This will do nothing to help the punisher, its still going to be utter garbage.

The rifter will be a bit better... Could you also make it possible to fit arties on T1 frigates? The fitting differential between small arties and small AC's is batshit insane.

One big flaw with both these ships is that utility highs are about as useful as half a extra midslot/lowslot.. so they effectively have less slots than the ones that don't have ****** utility highs.


I tested a Punisher fitted purely for neuts in PVP once. It worked, but our 3-man gang wasn't enough to capitalize on that against two opponents. We agreed that if it were a 3-1 or a 4-2 (another neuting Punisher), it would have been quite an effective little bugger.


a neuting punisher is EVEN WORSE than a neuting tristan.
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#30 - 2014-02-26 12:36:14 UTC
scruff decima wrote:
Are the changes to logi frig cap recharge (ms I assume) significant? or just to offset the recharge from increased base cap? (ie, if I was cap stable before, will I be cap stable after?)


CCP have this crazy idea that larger cap pools with the exact same amount of cap/sec generated are actually better or something. even though sensible people use cap boosters.
BadAssMcKill
Aliastra
#31 - 2014-02-26 12:40:59 UTC
Punisher needs a total rework


Also glad to see you're actually keeping your word with constantly iterating on balance
scruff decima
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-02-26 12:42:12 UTC  |  Edited by: scruff decima
TrouserDeagle wrote:
scruff decima wrote:
Are the changes to logi frig cap recharge (ms I assume) significant? or just to offset the recharge from increased base cap? (ie, if I was cap stable before, will I be cap stable after?)


CCP have this crazy idea that larger cap pools with the exact same amount of cap/sec generated are actually better or something. even though sensible people use cap boosters.


Increasing the pool will also increase the cap/sec due to how the calculation is made.

Edit:
Edit2 (corrected):
Back of the envelope calculation, Navitas max peak cap recharge rate goes from 4.80GJ/s to 4.79GJ/s, not including any mods.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#33 - 2014-02-26 12:48:46 UTC
Interesting change for amarr

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.

TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#34 - 2014-02-26 12:50:37 UTC
MeBiatch wrote:
Interesting change for amarr


useless ships with no mids that now go slightly faster
Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance
Team Amarrica
#35 - 2014-02-26 12:52:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Zarnak Wulf
Punisher FW fit:

High:
Pulse Gatling II x 3
Small meta neut
Mid:
AB II
Scram II
Low:
HS II
DC II
400mm rolled tungsten
Adaptive Nano II
Rigs:
Trimark x 3

Right now you need a genolution set to fit this. After the PG buff you won't. The ship is fun if you avoid obvious kiters. 10k EHP is huge. The other lesser known strength of the punisher is that it's capacitor is sick. If you get into a neut fight with a slasher for example, the slasher will cap out while the punisher is still sitting at around 40% cap.

What do most pilots try to do against an Amarr ship? Neut it. Get under the guns. This fit plays to that strategy.
Amarisen Gream
Pleasant Peninsula Productions
Digital Vendetta
#36 - 2014-02-26 12:55:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarisen Gream
There is one Gallente ship in the whole group. Wheres the love. Or are our Federation ships just better than the rest of the so called Empires? :D

xoxo


Edit: Totally scrolled right past the cruiser part of the post.
So 2 this for Gallente

"The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger All of his fury and rage. He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels" - The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1

#NPCLivesMatter #Freetheboobs

TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#37 - 2014-02-26 12:56:29 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
Punisher FW fit:

High:
Pulse Gatling II x 3
Small meta neut
Mid:
AB II
Scram II
Low:
HS II
DC II
400mm rolled tungsten
Adaptive Nano II
Rigs:
Trimark x 3

Right now you need a genolution set to fit this. After the PG buff you won't. The ship is fun if you avoid obvious kiters. 10k EHP is huge. The other lesser known strength of the punisher is that it's capacitor is sick. If you get into a neut fight with a slasher for example, the slasher will cap out while the punisher is still sitting at around 40% cap.

What do most pilots try to do against an Amarr ship? Neut it. Get under the guns. This fit plays to that strategy.


trash
Trajan Al'Thor
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2014-02-26 12:59:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Trajan Al'Thor
Any chance of getting the Amarrian Tormentor changed to Drones/Missiles? This race already has 2 other turret laser ships in the ship class, and it would go in line with the other ships in the Amarrian lineup.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#39 - 2014-02-26 13:00:52 UTC
The cap recharge time increase on the Support Frigates was indeed listed in ms. I've changed it to seconds to match the rest of the post.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance
Team Amarrica
#40 - 2014-02-26 13:01:13 UTC
And yet I've used it to kill Firetails, Slashers, Tristans, incursi...