Player Features and Ideas Discussion

look at this for the old discussion about it: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=308944

now, from the feedback given i propose the following:

1. active hull tanking:

active hull tanking will use active resistance modules along with hull repair modules. the modules used for this all cover midslots, so they're more oriented for ships that use shield like those used by Caldari and Minmatar.

-about hull repairers:

taking it from the feedback of the old thread, hull repairers will retain the current requirements they have, but their statistics will be the following:

-small: 12s cycle, reps 120 HP
-medium: 24s cycle, reps 480 HP
-large: 30s cycle, reps 1440 HP
-capital: 60s cycle, reps 14400 HP

there will be two skills that will enhance hull repairers one is the repair system operation skill that benefits them right now with a 5% reduction in cycle time (its tied to armor reppers too). aditional to it there will be a new skill called "hull repair optimization" which will increase the amount repped by 5% too... the new hull reppers (T2 like the ones above) will have the following stats:

-small: 9s cycle, reps 150 HP
-medium: 18s cycle, reps 600 HP
-large: 22s cycle, reps 1800 HP
-capital: 45s cycle reps 18000 HP

-about active resistance modules: (AKA "hull hardeners")

hull hardeners will give an aditional 55% of resistance and will have the same fitting requirements and cycle as shield hardeners, stack penalized, there would be an adaptative version "adaptative nanolayer" that gives 30% to all resistances...

-the damage control issue:

originally i was gonna nerf DCU modules, but i think they're essential for hull tanking, so the idea will be to have DCU as the fundamental item for this, it is already too popular for PvP and some PvE content, so i dont see the need to nerf them. they will remain as they are right now.

2. passive hull tanking:

passive hull tanking is more oriented to be similar to buffer tanking, using passive resistance modules along with the extant Reinforced Bulkheads, but there will be an option to use a passive repairer that will work as the shield regen instead of active armor reppers. most of these modules cover lowslots, except the regen one which is a midslot.

-about passive resistance modules: "AKA hull coverings"

hull coverings consist of a dinamic layer of nanobots that will enhance the structure to give it resistance to certain damage types. there's no adaptative version, but there will be a reactive version.

single resistance hull coverings will give up to 33% , the other module, the "reactive layering", will have the same fitting requirements as a reactive armor hardener but will give only up to 60% of resistance boost.

notes: stack penalized

-about Reinforced Bulkheads:

they will be the same as always, but they will have an skill called "aeordinamic hull" which reduces its inertial and max velocty drawbacks by 5% per lvl

-about passive hull regen modules: (aka robotic autorepairer)

a new type of repair system that uses flights of robots for reppairing the internals of the ship, this modules will cure 0,25% of the hull HP by second, it occupies a midslot so it doesnt interfere with the other passive modules.

there will be an skill called "rapid reparation" that increases the percent repaired by this module by 0.25% per lvl. the T2 version of this module would repair 0,75% percent base.

at skills lvl V this leaves the module repping amount in 1,25% for T1 and 2% for T2.....feedback is appreciated if this sounds overpowered.

3. hull tanking rigs:

adding a set of rigs that help to cover both resistances and amount like the armor rigs for bot the drawback will be cargo capacity instead of armor like other astronautic rigs do.

-resistance rigs: each one will give an aditional 15% and 20% of resistance to the hull, at the cost of a 10% in cargohold. the astronautic riggin skill will reduce the drawback of course to 5% for both T1 and T2 versions. stack penalized

-hull extension rigs: similar to trimarks, they will give 15% and 20% extra of hull at the cost of 10% of cargohold.....

they consume -50 of calibration points.

why so much effort in hull tanking:

some of the modules exist, and buffer hull is sometimes used for lolfits and in some large ships as the Orca, aditional to that, its a cheap way of tanking that while unbonused, could give interesting results. its a danger endeavor yes, but armor and shield ships have the same chance of being destroyed. a hull tanking ship would be a hard nut to crack, but the player would be playing hardcore by gambling its ship internal HP....Gallente would make use of their extra hull HP bonus here so it isnt crazy to think they would be good in hull tanking. also, CCP has released hull repping drones to the mix, so its another oportunity for real hull tanking.

I would suggest not modifying this module at all.

It is a fitting choice already in use by other tanking forms, specifically intended to increase the quality of the buffer provided by the hull itself.

If you need to take it into account, and I think you intend this, then I would build on it as a foundation.
No serious hull tank would be complete without a DCU, so build around it

deleted, hull hardeners and DCUs wont suffer changes.....

it differs in several things:

1. you decide how will you distribute the resistances, a hull tanking ship has a blank resistance config of 0/0/0/0, while armor and shield have defined resistance distributions, with the hull you can play with the resistances you want to focus, the DCU will leave them in 60% of course, but you can decide if you want to expand other resistance holes, you could get a large omnitank but would limit the avaliable slots you have.

2. active hull tanking uses midslots while passive uses lowslots. i made it that way so people is forced to decide to use either one or the other, and maybe go hybrid with ships with equal distribution of slots (the Nestor being an example with its 7/6/6 config)

3. hull repairing modules are less capacitor intensive than shield boosters or even armor repairers, and are an all around cheap platform, but their long cycle would represent a test for the player. this is maintained by having the largest repping amount. this is intented because no ships in the game have hull bonuses so it needs to have better stats to compete with specialized armor tankers and shield tankers.

4. it could be an interesting alternative for ships that doesnt have resistance or repping bonuses, for example the Megathron or the Armageddon.....

5. active hull tankers will be fast and will have the same advantages as shield tankers, passive hull tankers will be a bit slower and less agile but will compensate with a massive buffer......Gallente ships could prove to be hard brawlers with their bonus structure, they have the most hull of all the 4 empires....

deleted, double post

So... what was wrong with shield and armor tanking? I get the gist, but concentration of your tank in the top or mid layer makes better sense than in the last layer. If the opponent has neuts on you, you are overly humped.

Hull reps are useful in deep space with a mobile depot, not in combat.


edit: and... you are still using mid or low slots, so there is no real advantage to hull tanking versus shield or armor tanking.

you picked the wrong races of ships for hull tanking that's the gallente job

i have posted about gallente in every of my post about hull......i used caldari as an example because it doesnt have an structure HP bonus like gallente ships do. Gallente will be the master race in terms of hull, at least in buffer amount. the idea is that gallente and amarr ships along with their derived pirate hulls (SoE, Serpentis, Bloodraiders) will have the means to use passive tanking. while caldari and minmatar, and by that extension Sanshas, Guristas and Angels will be able to use active hull tanking..

but.....hull tanking must keep the ideal of being a non standard doctrine, i mean, being optional for ships that doesnt have resistance bonuses or repairing amount bonuses....

the Raven is an example of a ship that could use hull tanking without too much requirements.......i will put a gallente example soon

Key feature of hull is that resistances are across the board even. That property should be kept at the expense of maximum hull resistance percentage which should not be higher than what you could get from a well-fit shield or armor tank.

Otherwise, the pieces are there. Change the penalty for reinforced bulkheads. Add hull rigs.

bumping doesnt hurt ....