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Capital FLEET fix by skills and fleet construction. EASY??
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#21 - 2014-01-16 22:28:25 UTC
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Tchulen wrote:
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Full fleet of capitals - what we speaking about. Please hold this line or leave thread.


I don't know about that. From reading your OP it seems we're talking about how to make the most unnecessary and pointless changes to the game which would upset nearly everyone with capital ships and break a great deal of the balance. One might take that as a troll.

As I'm sure you're already aware, I do.

You can not into read.
All capital fleets over 1 squad.
Repping a pos will not need full fleet in one composition.



Which just means that people will jump in, drop fleet and co-ordinate everything through voicecomms, which will change absolutely nothing other than leadership bonuses.



Explain why corps with more than ten capital pilots should NEED titans to use their caps. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if most lowsec groups can throw out a dozen carriers these days, and where the hell would they get a titan from?

Explain why triage support of battleship gangs NEEDS to be removed

Explain why small corps are no longer allowed to use more than a handful of caps without a workaround, while bigger guys can still throw them around at will.
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#22 - 2014-01-16 23:51:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Lapata Kapata
Danika Princip wrote:

Which just means that people will jump in, drop fleet and co-ordinate everything through voicecomms, which will change absolutely nothing other than leadership bonuses.

Explain why corps with more than ten capital pilots should NEED titans to use their caps. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if most lowsec groups can throw out a dozen carriers these days, and where the hell would they get a titan from?

Explain why triage support of battleship gangs NEEDS to be removed

Explain why small corps are no longer allowed to use more than a handful of caps without a workaround, while bigger guys can still throw them around at will.

- 1 aquad capitals to rep in triage still OK, TRIAGE will allow you to use cap RR on other ship, still triage or sieged ship can not be repaired. Same vulnerability. Would you like to have more - you are a big guy and need to build capital fleet with titan in flagship mode.
- To coordinate separate squads need more skill.
- Eeach squad need its dedicated painter to assist drones t.ex. - more chanses for splitted drone focuse. More TP on grid, more misstake, also no RR modules on field.
- Sorry guys, RR modules in this idea will be activated without Titan and capital fleet only in Triage mode(more vulnerable for sub.capitals then mass RRcarrier). Or on structures. Will activate mass RR on fleet members - welcome your titan on grid in "FLAGSHIP" mode and build your Cap.Fleet with all bans and benefits.
- Bigger guys will take risks buy using capital fleet structure, fileding titan applying FLAGSHIP mode, using titan vulnerable for a while.
More risks using capitals and supers - more people will try to be a part of "killing party"
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#23 - 2014-01-16 23:54:36 UTC
But only the big guys will be capable of using caps in any meaningful way. How are 'more people going to be part of killing parties' when there are less caps being used, and ONLY the big coalitions are even capable of it?

Any lowsec or nullsec group can stump up ten caps now. Most cannot scrape up titans and supers in order to actually use them under yuor proposal.


Explain

Why

Only

Coalitions

Should

Use

Caps.
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#24 - 2014-01-17 00:05:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Lapata Kapata
You can not read?
Big guy will have their bans. Vulnerable titan, RR within squad, assist within squad, more valuable ships getting more vulnerable. It will make it easier target for bigger groups of subcapitals..
Small scale groups still can use capitals.
It is and idea, it can be evaluated, modified and fixed.
If you have something to be fixed in idea - provide your fix, otherwise stop crying about small scale. Right now i do not see any trouble for smaller groups. If you see - try to provide your opinion more carefully.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#25 - 2014-01-17 00:12:08 UTC
Vulnerable to WHAT? If you're the only group around with a capital fleet organised enough to actually be deployed under your system, nobody is going to be able to oppose you. There will be tops six viable capfleets in the game. (CFC, N3, PL, BL. Maybe one or two of the Russian groups I suppose. No-one else will have the numbers, ships and organisation. And any of these groups jumping on one of the others will just crash the node.)

If you are a small group with twelve carriers, you cannot use your twelve carriers in an effective manner.

If you are a lowsec group with twelve dreads, you cannot use your twelve dreads to bash a POS.

If you are the CFC, you have several hundred capital and supercapital pilots. You can use your caps.
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#26 - 2014-01-17 07:11:20 UTC
Dreads do not use a cap RR. Aren't?

If you thinking outside "we all die" - titan giving bonuses must be vulnerable. "Command link" affect normal bonus ship, Cap.Fleet command link will affect titan as well as cap.fleet bonuses based on supers... no full tank - risky to use. Generate more sub cap fleets.

Otherwise in current reality full cap fleet of carriers without any other ship is heavily uninterruptable.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#27 - 2014-01-17 09:00:33 UTC
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Tchulen wrote:
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Full fleet of capitals - what we speaking about. Please hold this line or leave thread.


I don't know about that. From reading your OP it seems we're talking about how to make the most unnecessary and pointless changes to the game which would upset nearly everyone with capital ships and break a great deal of the balance. One might take that as a troll.

As I'm sure you're already aware, I do.

You can not into read.
All capital fleets over 1 squad.
Repping a pos will not need full fleet in one composition.


I can read fine thanks. You just don't have a decent argument.

You still have yet to explain why only the large coalitions should be able to use capital ships. This is extremely unbalancing.

Why shouldn't a small corporation use capital ships? Please answer this question rather than ignoring it like you have most others.

One last thing; Please stop accusing people of not reading. It seems somewhat foolish for someone who can't write legible english to accuse others of not reading rather than consider the possibility that what they've written cannot be understood. If people aren't understanding what you say it isn't because they're not reading your comments. It's because your comments make no sense.
suid0
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2014-01-17 09:38:06 UTC
Tchulen wrote:

One last thing; Please stop accusing people of not reading. It seems somewhat foolish for someone who can't write legible english to accuse others of not reading rather than consider the possibility that what they've written cannot be understood. If people aren't understanding what you say it isn't because they're not reading your comments. It's because your comments make no sense.


^^ QFT.

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#29 - 2014-01-17 12:19:03 UTC
Tchulen wrote:
It seems somewhat foolish for someone who can't write legible english to accuse others of not reading rather than consider the possibility that what they've written cannot be understood. If people aren't understanding what you say it isn't because they're not reading your comments. It's because your comments make no sense.

Last argument for each who can not into topic - "turn ON" Grammar Nazzi mode. Good luck.

Read once again. Please.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#30 - 2014-01-17 12:24:17 UTC
Tchulen wrote:
You still have yet to explain why only the large coalitions should be able to use capital ships. This is extremely unbalancing.

Why shouldn't a small corporation use capital ships? Please answer this question rather than ignoring it like you have most others.

Please answer this question.

If you're incapable of answering this question please accept you're OP is flawed or admit to being a troll. Refusing to answer questions is a strong indicator that you are, in fact, a troll. Please prove otherwise by answering the question.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#31 - 2014-01-17 12:35:31 UTC
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Tchulen wrote:
It seems somewhat foolish for someone who can't write legible english to accuse others of not reading rather than consider the possibility that what they've written cannot be understood. If people aren't understanding what you say it isn't because they're not reading your comments. It's because your comments make no sense.

Last argument for each who can not into topic - "turn ON" Grammar Nazzi mode. Good luck.

Read once again. Please.

I'm not being a grammar nazi. I'm not even suggesting that you use any of the plethora of tools for checking your text for accurate language although it wouldn't hurt.

So, to get the meaning of what I've said, read once again, please.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#32 - 2014-01-17 12:37:46 UTC
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Dreads do not use a cap RR. Aren't?

If you thinking outside "we all die" - titan giving bonuses must be vulnerable. "Command link" affect normal bonus ship, Cap.Fleet command link will affect titan as well as cap.fleet bonuses based on supers... no full tank - risky to use. Generate more sub cap fleets.

Otherwise in current reality full cap fleet of carriers without any other ship is heavily uninterruptable.


This is from your OP.

Quote:
2.3. implement "FLAGSHIP" that is needed to "activate" capital modules/functions - a TITAN ON GRID with special skills and bonuses, probably some kind of "siege"/"flagship" mode module gives it less HP, it might be RISKY to use such fleet. Really risky.


Capital modules includes XL guns, seige mods and capital reps, does it not? Therefore, to use dreadnoughts in a gang, you would NEED a titan on grid and a super to lead every fleet.




Your idea does nothing but make capital fleets a toy for only the biggest of groups. Explain why that is good.
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#33 - 2014-01-17 16:41:19 UTC
Danika Princip

You know that it is a forum.
We are going to discuss and find out reasonable solution.
As i wrote later it thread - affects only RR modules activity against other ships.
I can fix previous post. NP.

You prefer "final" suggestion point by point, that is impossible here, because nobody here knows borders inside EVE code. Also a good idea can be evaluated thru discussion, since trolls will try to do what they can best - climing reasons, final solutions, detailed plans and so on.

When it will be more input on idea - it will be valuable to summarize and change first post.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#34 - 2014-01-17 17:59:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tchulen
Lapata Kapata: Why shouldn't a small corporation use capital ships?

I've asked this many times and you keep ignoring it. Please answer the question.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#35 - 2014-01-17 19:47:26 UTC
Lapata Kapata wrote:
Danika Princip

You know that it is a forum.
We are going to discuss and find out reasonable solution.
As i wrote later it thread - affects only RR modules activity against other ships.
I can fix previous post. NP.

You prefer "final" suggestion point by point, that is impossible here, because nobody here knows borders inside EVE code. Also a good idea can be evaluated thru discussion, since trolls will try to do what they can best - climing reasons, final solutions, detailed plans and so on.

When it will be more input on idea - it will be valuable to summarize and change first post.



Right. So, why should wormhole corps, lowsec corps and small corps not be able to use carrier reps? Why do you want pantheon setups removed? Why do you want triage support of battleship gangs removed?

Why should bigger groups gain the advantage of being able to use capital RR when smaller groups can't?
Lapata Kapata
AST Corpi
#36 - 2014-01-20 16:51:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Lapata Kapata
Triage make your cap vulnerable.
It is about "ban RR outside triage" for bigger groups of ships. And to "avoid ban" such fleet must risk their titan - Flagship mode make it vulnerable. You risk a flag ships and bonuse ships or risk your caps without RR.

Also, thought about Titan DD - it must be as triage - using DD make your titan unavailable to get RR. Hm..... how is it sounds?
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#37 - 2014-01-20 21:58:06 UTC
Why should wormhole corps, lowsec corps and small corps not be able to use carrier reps and fighters at the same time? Why are you insisting in nerfing everyone other than the larger nullsec alliances and coalitions?
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#38 - 2014-01-21 00:34:55 UTC
Tchulen wrote:
Why should wormhole corps, lowsec corps and small corps not be able to use carrier reps and fighters at the same time? Why are you insisting in nerfing everyone other than the larger nullsec alliances and coalitions?


I keep asking him that, he flat out refuses to actually answer it.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#39 - 2014-01-21 08:24:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Tchulen
Danika Princip wrote:
Tchulen wrote:
Why should wormhole corps, lowsec corps and small corps not be able to use carrier reps and fighters at the same time? Why are you insisting in nerfing everyone other than the larger nullsec alliances and coalitions?


I keep asking him that, he flat out refuses to actually answer it.


Yeah, I know. This is why I'm pretty convinced that the OP is either a bad troll or simply dumb. If he wasn't either of these you'd think he'd at at least try to answer it. The refusal to answer a repeatedly asked straight question is often a method of raising anger or rage in a forum user - ie trolling. Pretty sure you, like me, don't react like that so if he is a troll he's barking up the wrong tree.

@OP - Perhaps if you took the time and effort to answer the questions posed to you by the other players in your thread you might have some credibility. The fact that you haven't answered my or Danika's questions points to you either being a troll or an idiot. Care to answer which one it is? [EDIT] Alternatively, if I'm wrong on that, you could always answer the question as to why you think small corps shouldn't be allowed to use carrier reps and fighters at the same time.
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