EVE General Discussion

Entirely missing the nature of systems in EVE (they are not all equal, a system with a high number in your model will not necessarily have high traffic or connectivity).

Entirely missing the reason trade hubs become trade hubs (the network effect).

You can't derive any conclusions about "natural hubs" from your data or your pretty clicky web toy. What you can derive is that when you mash Data X through Process Y you get Result Z. Result Z might be pretty according to some people, but it is meaningless.

If you want to derive information about "natural hubs" you would need to demonstrate what you mean by that term, then produce some models to illustrate how your technique can locate these "natural hubs" and then apply that technique to the network of interest.

Relevant data that you haven't accounted for:

• Mission hubs (easy to find, look for NPC kills in last 24 hours)
• Production hubs (harder to find, look for volume of ore mined in last 24 hours, there are proxy values available)
• Industry hubs (look for S&I jobs completed in last 24h)

And then there's the network effect which you can't account for: everyone goes to Jita because everyone goes to Jita. That's as natural and organic a trade hub as you are ever going to find.

Posting in a thread I have absolutely no idea what the OP was saying and even less so what these 3 are arguing about. But I can say it sounds like Miilla is having a bad day or something.

On the other hand, OP sounds like he's having fun. (though how any of that hubla dubla wada wada could be fun i dunno but more power to ya )

All I can say is, it looks pretty!

Why did you, right from the start, ignore the possibility that she might be right and you might be wrong?

Your response being "look up that book at page 2" is completely pointless. Most people in here, including myself, have no clue about what you are doing and we absolutely deserve that it is explained to us in a proper manner, considering that you want us to take you seriously. And that's what you want, else you wouldn't have posted.

Of course I do recognize that another reason is that you wanted attention, but I do not care about that.


So, instead of giving others reasons to make fun of you, which is then leading to you seriously giving them forevermore reason to actually rightfully make fun of you, prove that you can debunk their claims and actually
know what you are talking about.



Thank you very much.

I admire the attempt to provide some investigation of the structure of the Eve universe and link it to matters like gate camping and appropriate trade hubs.

However this analysis does not seem to provide much for Trade Hubs.

Oursalaert III is the largest of the 2nd rank trade hubs (ie 6th overall) yet has a relatively small EVC value and on the face of it ought to be a classic candidate for your proposition given that networking and word of mouth drag most off to the largest hubs, theoretically leaving more structural effects to be shown in the 2nd rank hubs.

The 7th largest hub VFK-IV has a tiny EVC, but presumably also suffers from popularity due popularity's sake.

Am I the only one that noticed that Miilla spent like 3 pages posting damn near every other post, saying the exact same thing (it's not a directed graph!!!!), and no one listened?

Fun fact, Miilla: a directed graph where both directions are weighted equally is, by definition, an undirected graph.

I don't know what's crawled up Miilla's ass that made them what to troll the thread, but don't feed the troll I guess.

Daeniika's absolutely right that an undirected graph is a special subclass of digraphs (to be precise, it is a symmetric (all arcs have a matching return arc) unweighted (all arcs have equal weight) digraph).

Having the digraphs features available may yet turn out to be useful if you wish to use the asymmetric weighting. For example, you may wish to take in the average distance between stargates if you get that data available (especially considering the recent changes to warp speeds) or even map them all the warps and jumps individually (probably best to collect the distances and calculate time to warp for weighting based on the ship type).

It is most curious that the regions closely align with the regions CCP chose. Given that the recent blog on balancing the universe they disclosed that the constellation used to be the atom of node balancing and that a region is a collection of constellations, you're quite right that they probably did some similar static analysis (lacking any real data) when creating the universe.

My eve graph.

probably should get out more.

Hilarious!! You know if I had just thought ahead enough to just do that there would've been no complaining...:)

I would love to pretend that I understand any of this thread, but in attempting to do so, I would only make myself look even more foolish than I normally do.

As far as i can tell, OPs pretty picture measures system connectivity and provides no useful info other than that. Factors like the difference in sec status (that Rancer workaround hurts trade routes) and number/type of agents/stations/belts in each system all affect how systems are used.
Or not.
Such a pretty pattern would be thrown up from any complex map measured this way, telling us the most efficient WHATEVAH.

Humans on the other hand are not efficient, physically they are modified from an earlier form and full of terrible inefficiencies and redundancies. Optic nerve passing through retina? Pshaw!
Neurologically they are replete with spare backups, terrible inefficient if the human brain is seen as either a machine or as a computer. From an engineering perspective, it's a receiver.
Socially, humans are awful as far as efficiency goes, logic doesn't apply to a mess made up of units that can change roles to become parent to children that aren't theirs, provider to strangers and guardian to enemies as the need arises.

Systems theory used to be applied to the ecology, hoping to describe an underlying order that never existed. Ecological balance has been force fed to us and we still use it as a comforting description of the actual ocean of chaos we live in.

Factor in laziness, fear of combat, availability of services and friendship, then we'll have a more credible graph we can throw away.