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In defense of the SoE ships
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Scorpionstrike
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-10-09 11:32:31 UTC
I have been waiting for a Tier one cov ops cruiser for a long time, though i can also appreciate the Tier 2 , Tier 3 cov-ops crowd concerns over ship bonuses, i think it could be fair having the +5 hacking strength (as a Tier one ship) however if that is the case, there should be lower LP and isk cost for the ship, just like the low isk cost cruisers, there has to be some give and take.

I agree with the introduction of these ships, its versatile, it will fill the lower tier cov ops gap, and most of all it is a new feature to stealth game-play.
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#2 - 2013-10-09 11:34:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Debora Tsung
If you write a post in defense of SOE ships, does that mean You think that there's a valid argument that speaks against them?

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.
Scorpionstrike
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-10-09 11:37:33 UTC
Have innocent people ever been tried in court ?
Trii Seo
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2013-10-09 11:41:52 UTC
If nothing changed since the first iteration then yes, there's actually plenty of flaws to them. The covops crowd seems to be saying "look, if you release this in the current state we'll break it and you'll drown in tears.".

There actually isn't much novelty to those ships, I guess there's the fact that Astero may be the first affordable cloaky that can get into frig-on-frig action. Anti-frig bombers and covert ops frigates were usually hilarious troll fits that died to anything but a T1 logi frig/explorer/a bomber that thought they'll be lobbing torpedoes and wound up eating a handful of rockets.

Other than that it gets laughed at for 2 turret slots, 2 high slots and the aspirations to be a cloaky combat frigate.

Proud pilot of the Imperium

Arek'Jaalan: Heliograph
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#5 - 2013-10-09 11:43:43 UTC
The fact that they're bonused for everything and really are true all-in-one exploration ships speaks to why they should not be offered at a "low cost" or "entry level" price. The fact that they are not Tech II speaks to why they should not have Tech II bonuses. In order to have Tech II bonuses they would need to be specialized in the way that Tech II ships are, meaning that they'd no longer be bonused for or capable of proper "all-in-one" exploration and thus have no reason to even exist.
Scorpionstrike
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-10-09 11:55:45 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
The fact that they're bonused for everything and really are true all-in-one exploration ships speaks to why they should not be offered at a "low cost" or "entry level" price. The fact that they are not Tech II speaks to why they should not have Tech II bonuses. In order to have Tech II bonuses they would need to be specialized in the way that Tech II ships are, meaning that they'd no longer be bonused for or capable of proper "all-in-one" exploration and thus have no reason to even exist.


Thankyou Alvatore Dimarco, you made a good point, Tech 2 is specialized and the new Tier 1 are more flexible in what they can do which i think it a fair trade-off - so in fact the tier 2 crowd should not be complaining, however i don't agree that just because they are able to do a few roles (in order for it to function for its purpose) it should have a High cost for a tier one ship.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#7 - 2013-10-09 12:02:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Velicitia
Scorpionstrike wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
The fact that they're bonused for everything and really are true all-in-one exploration ships speaks to why they should not be offered at a "low cost" or "entry level" price. The fact that they are not Tech II speaks to why they should not have Tech II bonuses. In order to have Tech II bonuses they would need to be specialized in the way that Tech II ships are, meaning that they'd no longer be bonused for or capable of proper "all-in-one" exploration and thus have no reason to even exist.


Thankyou Alvatore Dimarco, you made a good point, Tech 2 is specialized and the new Tier 1 are more flexible in what they can do which i think it a fair trade-off - so in fact the tier 2 crowd should not be complaining, however i don't agree that just because they are able to do a few roles (in order for it to function for its purpose) it should have a High cost for a tier one ship.



What are these "tiers" you speak of? Those (thankfully) got ripped out over the last few patches/expansions ...

As for the cost, it's a "pirate faction*" ship, with the BPC only available via SoE LP ... which means it's gonna cost you if you want one.



* Yes, I know SoE aren't pirates, but their ships operate in the same manner skills-wise.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Rengerel en Distel
#8 - 2013-10-09 12:08:09 UTC
Some reason this couldn't have just been posted in the dev sticky about the ships?

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Kenpo
The Guardians of the Beam
#9 - 2013-10-09 12:08:49 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Scorpionstrike wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
The fact that they're bonused for everything and really are true all-in-one exploration ships speaks to why they should not be offered at a "low cost" or "entry level" price. The fact that they are not Tech II speaks to why they should not have Tech II bonuses. In order to have Tech II bonuses they would need to be specialized in the way that Tech II ships are, meaning that they'd no longer be bonused for or capable of proper "all-in-one" exploration and thus have no reason to even exist.


Thankyou Alvatore Dimarco, you made a good point, Tech 2 is specialized and the new Tier 1 are more flexible in what they can do which i think it a fair trade-off - so in fact the tier 2 crowd should not be complaining, however i don't agree that just because they are able to do a few roles (in order for it to function for its purpose) it should have a High cost for a tier one ship.



What are these "tiers" you speak of? Those (thankfully) got ripped out over the last few patches/expansions ...

As for the cost, it's a "pirate faction*" ship, with the BPC only available via SoE LP ... which means it's gonna cost you if you want one.



* Yes, I know SoE aren't pirates, but their ships operate in the same manner skills-wise.


Swap the word Tier with Tech, I'm sure thats what the OP meant Blink

Caution, rubber gloves and faceshield required when handling this equipment.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#10 - 2013-10-09 12:35:31 UTC
Kenpo wrote:

Swap the word Tier with Tech, I'm sure thats what the OP meant Blink


Probably, but he went from "Tech 2" to "Tier 1" in the span of one sentence ... so ...

Either way, SoE "pirate ships" are probably fine whereever they end up. Yeah, they'll cost an arm and a leg on patch day (remember Tier3 [Attack] BCs? got 220m a pop for the first run of them ... for ships that cost like 80m to produce)

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia