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Tlat Ij

Hedion University

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 72

#4001 - 2013-09-23 14:01:45 UTC

Jasper Blanch wrote:

I think that there have been some really interesting ideas proposed and I suspect at least a few of them are being vetted for next proposal and I'm interested to hear what CCP has to say about some of them.

I am, unfortunately, not as optimistic as you are. From the past threads i have read, once CCP goes silent that seems to be what ends up on TQ. And sure, the winter expansion may be ~3months out, but that just gives CCP long enough to finish up the new art/models and toss them onto Sisi so they can ignore all the feedback about it there before sending it off to TQ unchanged, like they nearly always seems to do. What?

Kane Fenris

NWP

Likes received: 160

#4002 - 2013-09-23 14:15:35 UTC

Cade Windstalker wrote:

Kane Fenris wrote:

TehCloud wrote:

Even if you check your d-scan there is a chance that within those 60+aligntime seconds you'll lose your ship to some nados, just because you weren't able to warp away or even align due to being immobile.

as i understand it you can not move but you can align

If you aren't moving then there is no difference in align time based on direction of your align.

there is....

you can use mjd after mjd finished you are at 100% speed if you were already alinged and can warp instantly
this would not work if you could not alingn while not moveing

TheFace Asano

Caldari Provisions

Caldari State

Likes received: 47

#4003 - 2013-09-23 14:23:59 UTC | Edited by: TheFace Asano

Cade Windstalker wrote:

TheFace Asano wrote:

How often is this going to be 1v1? The local tank won't mean much when the ship is completely neuted and can't receive RR. Dual XLASB fits are going to be harder to crack but not impossible. PVP is rarely fought evenly in this game so you can't balance on 1v1 only.

You can get around neuting with NOS in the highs and a Cap Booster. Plus, as you said, this game is rarely 1v1 only which makes the 1v1 vs a Mach example even more irrelevant.

TheFace Asano wrote:

In PVE you barely need a tank once your dps is high enough. When your energy skills are high enough even cap boosters start becoming less necessary as well (or cap re-chargers). All the battleships dps cap at around 1 -1.2k (minus the Gallente ships). Your not going to get more performance out of tank at this point, your performance is limited by DPS. I can't personally get better isk / hour than in a cruise CNR with Fury / Precisions. 1x Rigor rig and a single TP on a BS and your pretty much maxed on applied damage. A second TP only helps with Frigs / Cruisers, and then its really not a big difference. The Golem is not going to do more damage than the CNR within either of these proposals without using torps and increasing rigor rigs and using multiple tps. There is no Pirate ship that will do more dps either, unlike the Mach within the Minmatar lines Tempest Fleet and Maelstrom. Most of the other BS in Faction and Pirate can field 3-5 Sentry drones, which will increase damage over the currently proposed Marauders because of their direct lack of BS sized drone bays. I really don't personally like drones, so make the racial weapon system higher damage than the rest of the BS while keeping drone damage low or utility based and keeping a focused difference in what the ship is. They should be the gunships (or missile) of sub-cap ships, owning damage, application and projection, and let the faction / pirate ships be faster and more drones / options for fitting / better buffer setups.

This example is somewhat specific to missile ships though, which generally have better damage application in missions than turret based ships. For turreted ships how well you apply your DPS is just as important as your tank or your overall DPS is.

For example in Incursion Vanguard sites a Blaster fit Rokh actually does equal DPS to a Megathron at the ranges the incursion rats orbit at and can project its DPS much further as the ships are coming in making it an overall slightly better ship despite having lower maximum DPS.

It doesn't make sense to give Pirate Battleships more tank since these are already tank focused ships and T2 resists of any sort are going to represent a pretty big advantage in that respect. Plus a combination of top tier DPS with damage application and projection would be, to put it mildly, a bit over-powered. Every ship in Eve trades raw DPS for application in its bonuses, there's no reason that these should be an exception.

TheFace Asano wrote:

I don't know what direction CCP is going take past this, but I bet they are testing both on the internal servers and maybe a few other ideas. Maybe there is something else going on with the winter expansion that these marauders mesh well with we don't know about. Maybe we will find out next week.

Well, Black-Ops Battleships are on the block as well, as are EWar Frigates and then Pirate Ships after that. It's possible but somewhat unlikely that they may try and tackle all four (Marauders, Black-Ops, EAFs, and Pirate Ships) for the Winter expansion but it's pretty likely that they have at least some idea of where the other Battleship hulls are going that they've been balancing around.

Even with turret ships your only going to have so many options before diminishing returns makes your gain so small that it makes little or no difference. My toon with a mach has 1200 or so dps with tech 1 gardes and Tech 2 Gyros. Armor tanked it has 3x gyros. A fourth would be workable, it just doesn't add enough dps to argue using it and with a burst aerator in the rig slot diminishing returns have you pretty capped 3x republic fleet gyros would add some dps, and I will add them sometime maybe. It has 2x tracking computers as well, and again adding a third does little to applied dps with diminishing returns unless you add a tracking script and 2x optimal scripts. Personally I just use an afterburner to speed to target if need as the thing is faster than most battlecruisers and some cruisers. People faction / deadspace / officer fit to squeeze out that little extra dps, but it really only means much in long term isk building for PVE. PVP you will have more of a cookie cutter build with tech 2 mods. 1 billion for the hull and another couple hundred million for modules is more than most will spend to pvp at all, and then your not able to min/max because of isk limitation.

Honestly my kids in the background who are always needing something deter from that extra little performance from being realized anyway. There are other external factors to take in as well, but unless your a robot your probably going to make a mistake, look away from the screen for a few minutes or seconds and miss reactivation of a module losing all that min/max anyway.

A meaningful amount of extra damage through bastion makes sense. I haven't seen a valid arguement for the isk / sp investment these ships take as to why they shouldn't have more dps than everything else other than "CCP said so".

Kenpo

The Guardians of the Beam

Likes received: 63

#4004 - 2013-09-23 14:28:55 UTC

Heh a wild thought popped into my head, why not give the maurader 15 high slots, 4 large, 4 medium, 4 small, and 3 utility. The other eight slots are only available in Bastion mode. You activate Bastion mode and the medium and small turret/launchers are now available and fitted with the appropriate guns/missile launchers to handle frigates and cruisers, while the big guns/launchers take on battleships. The extra high slots are only available in Bastion mode, if you are not in Bastion mode you get your standard 7. Yeah I know, the "but it will be overpowered" crowd will be screaming. If anything make it 2 large, 2 medium, 2 small, and 2 utility, give the turret/launchers xxx% damage bonus Big smile

What I never understood was why battleships in this game are so gimped on weapon variety/loadout. I mean look at the old naval battleships, they had primary guns consisting of 9 breach loading 16in(406 mm)/50-caliber Mark 7 Naval guns, secondary batteries consisting of 10 dual purpose Mark 28, Mod 2 twin gun mounts, and anti-aircraft batteries. 80's modernization saw the removal fo those AA batteries replaced with a phalanx system along wtih surface to surface missiles. How come this game is lacking that kind of variety for weapon loadouts after 10 years? Battleships should be feared, and rightly so. Bah I should stop ranting now LOL.

Caution, rubber gloves and faceshield required when handling this equipment.

JetCord

Science and Trade Institute

Caldari State

Likes received: 52

#4005 - 2013-09-23 14:30:03 UTC

hmm now all the marauder look generic with almost the same skill bonus , making the choice of which marauder to depending on which large weapon system you manage to get to T2

my hope is that:

the bastion mode with give a bonus depending on what racial marauder that it is fitted into (or you could make a racial bastion modules - more things for industrial to build)

paladin - cap regen bonus and local rep bonus

golem - increase max shield capacity and resist bonus

kronos - ROF bonus and cap regen bonus

vargur - increase max shield bonus and shield boost bonus

give the bastion a role bonus - 5% per level to reduction in overheating damage to mod

Shivanthar

Likes received: 171

#4006 - 2013-09-23 14:34:19 UTC | Edited by: Shivanthar

Cade Windstalker wrote:

Shivanthar wrote:

Yes, this was my point :)

I did some calculations. Since it is early morning right now, my head hasn't booted up fully yet. But as far as mjd travel time/time spend ratio goes on @ lvl 5, creating a bonus to increase MWD bonus by %1000 and including some agility after transforming into "X mode", does what ccp's design wants to do on Marauders anyway.

MJD @ lvl 5, posts you to 100km in 6 seconds which is something ~14000 meters/sec

My test is on Vargur, so it goes with 163m/s raw speed and 1138 m/s with mwd @ lvl 5. In order to make that 1138 close to 14000, boosting mwd speed bonus by %1000 does the trick. But agility is also needed to fully get that potential.
Cut the mwd cycle time and cap usage in somewhere half, so it is now more controllable. During X mode, since vargur's weapon systems are working half, damage output is halved and internal tracking is not working well on that speed so tracking is also halved.

What this does?
pve: tons of cool stuff, very enjoying mission running.
pvp: during fleet battles, ppl need to think twice on getting their ally pilots' wrecks faster, look WHO is coming to maraud those wrecks. Including its cargo bay size, now, I call this as a unique role for marauders on the battlefield.

Becoming a perfect raider for wrecks, in-game description for marauders now become a reality: "... Nevertheless, these thick-skinned, hard-hitting monsters are the perfect ships to take on long trips behind enemy lines."

See?

Just brainstorming ;)

I'm going to assume you mean a +1000% velocity bonus, aka multiplying the current velocity bonus of ~500-615% by three rather than multiplying it by 10...

Oh, no, wait you really meant 1000% increase. Okay then...

The ways this can be abused are too many to name but I'm going to list off the ones that come to mind immediately:

Hilariously abuse-able bump ship.
Uncatchable kiting Battleship
Able to almost completely ignore bubbles unless scrammed and use of the MWD + cloak trick means that the ship will likely be out of the bubble in one cycle anyway.

Seriously, not in any way balanced. There's a reason we have a MJD on a cooldown instead of a hilariously oversized MWD module.

I got your point. However;

Hilariously abuse-able bump ship. - No agility at that speed will turn you well towards your moving target. Even if so, I wouldn't mind paying billions of isk to do so for a special ability.

Uncatchable kiting Battleship - kite for what? Since damage and tracking is halved, there is no way he is shooting back to you. Increasing mwd cap usage to nullify its 3th or 4th cycle will make it stop @ 40-50km away, you need to use cap boosters to compansate until 6th or 7th cycle, which sends its pilot to 100km. There is very small to no difference between MjD and bonused MWD.

Able to almost completely ignore bubbles unless scrammed and use of the MWD + cloak... - You're missing the part that it needs to transform first...

"Oh, no, wait you really meant 1000% increase. Okay then..."
It will put you at the same speed of mjd travel/time.

_Half _the lies they tell about me **aren't **true.

Edora Madullier

French Kiss Singularity

Likes received: 48

#4007 - 2013-09-23 15:17:19 UTC

Metal Icarus wrote:

In granting it the ability rep others in bastion mode, instead of an ewar immunity, maybe it should increase the sensor strength and lock range.

No. The ewar immunity is fine. It will allow the marauder to be the only mission/plex/anom ship able to tear through enemies without worrying about TD/damp/ecm.

Serpentis : The Blockade, The Assault, without damp : amazing
Guristas : No lock loss : amazing
Sansha/Blood : No TD : amazing

Don't ruin it for the sole purpose of a PvP ship you'll almost never get out of its station because of its price tag, please.

Joe Risalo

State War Academy

Caldari State

Likes received: 1,261

#4008 - 2013-09-23 15:30:12 UTC | Edited by: Joe Risalo

Edora Madullier wrote:

Metal Icarus wrote:

In granting it the ability rep others in bastion mode, instead of an ewar immunity, maybe it should increase the sensor strength and lock range.

I also feel that cap war immunity is a necessity, as these ships already suck on cap usage.
This would go a long way for these ships, and would really help the Paladin, who has to deal with cap war NPCs.

Edit.
I feel this is balanced, as these ships can't receive cap transfer while Bastioned either.

Debora Tsung

Perkone

Caldari State

Likes received: 1,487

#4009 - 2013-09-23 15:37:02 UTC | Edited by: Debora Tsung

Can't say it often enough, with the latest iteration (a.k.a. almost a webbing ship) the EWAR immunity in bastion mode is the only thing that makes the marauder halfway interesting.

I personally liked the first iteration of the marauder better, but I guess that's up to preference and what you want to do with it (I still won't believe that it's totally useless in incursions, but whatever) and most importantly which marauder you fly.

If CCP is hell bent on keeping that web bonus, so be it, I might even fit one webber just for the giggles.

Actually, let me clarify my first sentence a bit: Right now the EWAR immunity is the only thing that makes the bastion module interesting.

Yup, EWAR immunity makes the bastion module interesting, not the marauder itself.

In that regards I'd (given the opportunity) even vote for making the bastion module available for all battleships and assign a whole new role to the marauder, might be more interesting than the "every marauder is the same now" update.

I've read some interesting ideas lately:

Maraduers with bubble immunity and faster lock time for e.g.

EDIT: The mining Marauder... that made me laugh so hard, I'd vote for that just to read the comments if CCP did that. Lol

Marauders as they are now but with some skill level depended bonus on bastion modules (presuming the bastion module would be available for all battleships).

Stuff like that, nothing to outlandish but still interesting.

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

Cade Windstalker

Likes received: 1,631

#4010 - 2013-09-23 16:03:43 UTC

chaosgrimm wrote:

I lol'd at this. If you are trolling I applaud you. Otherwise you should reconsider the viability of your mission fits / general mission strategy. Frigs are not a big deal on marauders / mission runner toons. Again, most r no more than 1 volley, some r 2, and very very few are actually r required to be killed by drones even on turret based marauder hulls. Also, additional lol for whining about cruisers.

The lvl 4 missions I can think of off the top of my head are Buzz Kill and maybe room 1 of Vengeance. Both r no trouble not only to complete, but steamroll.

Concerning your point about tank, even without significantly sacrificing dps for tank when fitting (by this I mean a potential additional dmg / dmg app mod offers so little it might as well be replaced with a tanking mod), your tank is still enough to handle all 4s. On missions which can break your tank, they won't b/c of your gank. This also contributes to the support of a direct dmg inc over dmg application.

Might I ask you to post your marauder mission fit?

If possible please post a fit to back this up. To put it rather bluntly this doesn't match my experiences for many missions at least for a predominantly T2 fitted ship.

Certainly some missions are fairly light on frigates and cruisers but many are not. Buzz Kill isn't even particularly heavy on overall ship numbers and they spawn in relatively small waves.

A small list of missions that come to mind:

Anything with Rogue Drones, these tend to be about 2/3rds frigates and cruisers by ship volume.
Mordu's Headhunters - This one probably has the majority of EHP in the mission in the form of various frigates and cruisers. They spawn at fairly long range which makes additional damage projection desirable and the number means that anything letting you consistently one-shot them decreases completion time noticeably.
The Assault has, at the least, an appreciable number of frigates and cruisers.
The Blockade - Again, distant spawns but a large proportion of frigates and cruisers.
Silence the Informant - Has a good number of frigates and cruisers and drops several of them right on top of you in a few of the pockets.

In general anything that lets you pop frigates and cruisers in fewer shots will shave a noticeable amount off your completion time, whether it's because of improved tracking or because of increased range letting you use higher damage ammunition.

Tlat Ij wrote:

I think you may be reading a different FaID Forum than the rest of us. Yes, if they go silent right before an expansion that generally means things are finalized, that's sort of to be expected since they're going to be working on final polish and pushing things live. This is months out though and our last word was "we'll have more for you later but nothing new for a bit".

I don't know how you're getting "this is what's going to Live" from that... Ugh

Kane Fenris wrote:

Cade Windstalker wrote:

If you aren't moving then there is no difference in align time based on direction of your align.

there is....

you can use mjd after mjd finished you are at 100% speed if you were already alinged and can warp instantly
this would not work if you could not alingn while not moveing

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say here. Some of this is inaccurate though. The MJD does not place you at your destination at 100% speed it places you there at whatever speed you were at when the jump occurred.

Also there is no difference in align time to any point if you are moving at 0 meters per second. This can be easily confirmed by jumping through a gate and then aligning in a random direction and timing the warp with a stop watch. Variance of ~1 second is expected due to server ticks and communication lag.

Cade Windstalker

Likes received: 1,631

#4011 - 2013-09-23 16:10:12 UTC

TheFace Asano wrote:

Hull bonuses aren't stacking penalized though, for one, and for two you already concocted a situation where additional slots for tracking would be useful.

Besides a fourth Gyro could free up that rig slot for cap regen, speed, or something else entirely.

TheFace Asano wrote:

Honestly my kids in the background who are always needing something deter from that extra little performance from being realized anyway. There are other external factors to take in as well, but unless your a robot your probably going to make a mistake, look away from the screen for a few minutes or seconds and miss reactivation of a module losing all that min/max anyway.

This is a logical fallacy. If that happens you're going to lose the same amount of time to it regardless of how min-maxed your fit is which means the better option still shows gains, they just may represent a smaller percent gain due to the time spent getting a toddler off the top of the Fridge or something of the sort.

TheFace Asano wrote:

A meaningful amount of extra damage through bastion makes sense. I haven't seen a valid arguement for the isk / sp investment these ships take as to why they shouldn't have more dps than everything else other than "CCP said so".

If the existing arguments don't convince you that it's a bad idea then just about nothing I can say is going to. The best I can say is that from a game design perspective CCP are entirely correct in wanting to prevent power-creep and sticking to the T2=specialization framework since this prevents overall power-creep.

Overall having great DPS, tank, and damage application/projection on one ship is just going to turn it into a god battleship that everyone needs to have if they want to be the best. That's not what T2 is supposed to represent. No ship in Eve should have a combination like that.

Cade Windstalker

Likes received: 1,631

#4012 - 2013-09-23 16:15:50 UTC

Shivanthar wrote:

I got your point. However;

Hilariously abuse-able bump ship. - No agility at that speed will turn you well towards your moving target. Even if so, I wouldn't mind paying billions of isk to do so for a special ability.

Agility is relative, at that speed your target is going to have a hard time dodging and things like Freighters and other capital or "pseudo-capital" class ships can't dodge something going that fast.

Shivanthar wrote:

Able to almost completely ignore bubbles unless scrammed and use of the MWD + cloak... - You're missing the part that it needs to transform first...

None of that was mentioned in the post I quoted. Plus you could potentially use a faction MWD and/or cap transfers to get around the entire cap drain problem and then you're back to god kiting.

Shivanthar wrote:

"Oh, no, wait you really meant 1000% increase. Okay then..."
It will put you at the same speed of mjd travel/time.

But with no cooldown and far more potential for edge-case scenarios where it creates a broken set of mechanics.

Overall you're not making any sort of coherent case of why this is a better idea than the existing MJD bonus beyond "I think this is cooler" and there are plenty of reasons not to go with this over an MJD bonus.

Xequecal

Ministry of War

Amarr Empire

Likes received: 361

#4013 - 2013-09-23 16:48:29 UTC

Joe Risalo wrote:

Edora Madullier wrote:

Metal Icarus wrote:

In granting it the ability rep others in bastion mode, instead of an ewar immunity, maybe it should increase the sensor strength and lock range.

The Paladin as currently spoiled has 12,500 base capacitor. It really doesn't need much help in this area.

TheFace Asano

Caldari Provisions

Caldari State

Likes received: 47

#4014 - 2013-09-23 17:07:43 UTC

Cade Windstalker wrote:

TheFace Asano wrote:

You can swap a script for up close, the optimal is pretty useless up close anyway. The fourth gyro would replace tank, and I do sometimes depending on the situation. It makes a small difference at most, very small. I usually rig 2x tank 1x damage (or tracking) depending on the ship.

Cade Windstalker wrote:

TheFace Asano wrote:

It would only be power creep if it was outside Bastion Mode. Bastion Mode, like Siege mode, has drawbacks. I am not promoting any damage increase outside of the mode, only inside Bastion Mode. Again make the drawbacks more severe, just make the mode worth the risk of a 1 billion+ isk ship being locked in place for a minute and not being able to dock or jump system for another minute past that.

The class has several key drawbacks. First they require a ton of SP to fly. Second is the hull and mod pricetag. This limits them in pvp use without anything else. Lets say they can do 2 battleships worth of dps in Bastion Mode. Your still at an exponential isk pricetag for a standard T1 Battleship (lets say a modest 250 million for hull and fittings to pvp in). Thats around 5 times more isk for twice the damage performance. T2 HACs can do 20-50 percent more damage than their T1 counterparts......

For MIn/Maxing the percentage will be measured in long periods of time, not the short term. The Bastion Module should give a large gain in the short term for it's large downsides. This should be true for both PVE and PVP applications. Anything else is really not worth locking yourself in place for bombers to easily hot drop you. We can figure how many bombers it would take to easily one-shot any one of these marauders, as the reps will make little to no difference in that scenario....

I am also going to ask for what fit you have that is having a hard time with frigs or cruisers in missions. Outside of them getting under your guns, drones are "usually" not needed. With precision cruise, even elite frigs will die within a volley or 2 at any range. 5 hobgoblin 2's are enough to quickly make work of those that are close, and you should be able to tank a whole mess of them with a single shield boost or armor rep for quite a long time. On my other toon I use Auto cannons, blasters, rails and arties. They all work well at killing frigs at mostly 15k or more. Autocannons its more like 6k or under. 1400 Arties will one-two shot most cruisers at all ranges down to 15k or so and one shot frigs at ranges above 25k or so. Swapping scripts on TC's will improve this. I also use sentry drones to take out frigs. 3-4x unbonused sentries will make pretty quick work of a frig down to 15k. Using a MJD once in a while will help you pull away from them on long range gun fits. Cruise ships don't need one usually because the precisions make quick work of them no matter the range.

chaosgrimm

Synth Tech

Likes received: 203

#4015 - 2013-09-23 18:01:18 UTC | Edited by: chaosgrimm

Cade Windstalker wrote:

chaosgrimm wrote:

Anything with Rogue Drones, these tend to be about 2/3rds frigates and cruisers by ship volume.
Mordu's Headhunters - This one probably has the majority of EHP in the mission in the form of various frigates and cruisers. They spawn at fairly long range which makes additional damage projection desirable and the number means that anything letting you consistently one-shot them decreases completion time noticeably.
The Assault has, at the least, an appreciable number of frigates and cruisers.
The Blockade - Again, distant spawns but a large proportion of frigates and cruisers.
Silence the Informant - Has a good number of frigates and cruisers and drops several of them right on top of you in a few of the pockets.

lol, just lol. I will no longer be replying to your posts. You remind me of little kids going not knowing the definition of a word and saying things like "I know what it means, im just not going to tell you". To be fair, I was going to try to help you with applications probs you are having..... and i cant believe you are still whining about dmg application to cruisers... *troll suspicions rising*

w/o giving my full fit info, an 800mm II vargur with 2 tracking computers (w/ tracking scripts on small that is close) and 1 tracking enhancer is what I used for application.

Of all rogue drone missions that I can think of off the top of my head, the only one where frigs have a chance of getting under your guns is the one with the mother drone.... the gate unlocks after you kill it. I dont see why anyone would want to kill these to begin with. It isnt worth the time and wont be worth the time no matter the dmg application bonuses, just blitz it lol. You gain nearly nothing for killing them. (for the record I can kill all the frigs with little trouble on this one so long I as dont approach the gate/wait at the gate, the cruisers are at best a minor nuisance on the maelstrom but no trouble on the vargur as the quicker ones dont have as good of a tank as the rest, so the vargur can pop the quick ones in a full volley with autocannons. even so, on the maelstrom you can still get them easily, start shooting at stuff you know you can hit while aligning the proper direction, once angular is low enough, pop it. rinse and repeat). If you dont align for angular, dont cry about dmg application on the forums.

I cannot take you seriously anymore. I nearly died you when you mentioned mordu's headhunters xD *further increasing troll suspicion*. If you have problems with this one, you have done something wrong. If not the fit, then target priority / general clear strategy. It will take more than just a dmg application bonus to help you on this mission if you are having probs... cannot believe you said buzz kill is not a problem, then listed headhunters xD.

The assault. To give you a little credit, there are frigs that sometimes get under your guns and like to attack your drones.... to take all that credit back, whether this guristas or serp, there are only like 2-4 frigs that are capable of this and plenty of other stuff to shoot while you drones deal with them. dmg application would not speed up the progress of this mission. It's not like they're are going to hamper you from getting to a gate. Having the frigs come in close is also nice cause ur drone dps stays relatively constant and you dont waste alot of drone dps by having them travel from target to target.

The Blockade.... I am now convinced of your trollery

Silence the Informant, come on man, this joke got old 4 missions ago... Not only are they easily killed... but you dont need to kill them, even if they web you you can just tractor the mission item. "but but what about loot and salvage!!!"... its full of frigs and you can loot and salvage the BS's on the marauder with no trouble..

Joe Risalo

State War Academy

Caldari State

Likes received: 1,261

#4016 - 2013-09-23 18:34:20 UTC

Xequecal wrote:

Joe Risalo wrote:

Edora Madullier wrote:

Metal Icarus wrote:

In granting it the ability rep others in bastion mode, instead of an ewar immunity, maybe it should increase the sensor strength and lock range.

The Paladin as currently spoiled has 12,500 base capacitor. It really doesn't need much help in this area.

The Golem does... It has terrible cap, even after you consider the weapons don't use cap.

Lair Osen

Likes received: 114

#4017 - 2013-09-23 18:54:25 UTC

What do you think about replacing the 100% rep bonus with just 50% non-stacked resistance? It would be the same as +100% reps, but fix issues with having to get down to low shields/armour before repping if you have very bonused reps. it would also double the EHP which would help stop them being massive gank targets in Bastion due to the strangely low HP.
And the resistance increasing logi effectiveness wouldn't be a problem since they can't be remote repped.
It could also make hull tanking viable if the resistance buff is applied to hull as well :) or just mean you dont need a DCU.

Joe Risalo

State War Academy

Caldari State

Likes received: 1,261

#4018 - 2013-09-23 19:06:47 UTC

Lair Osen wrote:

This would also help to reduce the amount of cap usage, which I keep stating the Golem suffers with.

This is the initial reason why I preferred iteration 1 over 2.
More resist means less boosting, which means less cap dependancy.

Ministry of War Amarr Empire 328
Bastion Arzi Ministry of War Amarr Empire Likes received: 328	#4019 - 2013-09-23 21:42:41 UTC i'll ask again. Does anybody know if the range bonus (25%) extends to all modules? ie disruptors, webs etc?


Shivanthar Likes received: 171	#4020 - 2013-09-23 21:54:19 UTC \| Edited by: Shivanthar please delete this post, session timeout ruined my day :) _Half _the lies they tell about me aren't true.

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