Player Features and Ideas Discussion

So.... Damage control 2+Basion = 60-90% ?

If you're talking about hull resists it's 72%, otherwise you need actual resist mods to get anywhere near those numbers.



This is rather ambiguous. Which cruiser for a start?

1. rattlesnake
2. any t3? for what it matters most hacs, neut will kill this things.
3. whatever navy or missile ship suits you.
4. guristas are the worst npcs to run, and if you do, t3 or any normal missile battleship, or well I dunno, I do it on a dominix? who cares about jamming.

having more tank makes them NO more usefull for pve, unable to be logied, means they are coffins in fleet fights, look, capital ships that go into triage or siegue often die with multimillion hp, a battleship with 350k ehp and active tanked is paperthin in a fleet fight.

I can already imagine the laughs in any low sec or null sec system, when any idiot goes into bastion mode at a gate after jumping mid camp, the sound will be deafeaning, more or less similar to that of a titan jumping by accident and getting caugh by a hic.

have you owned a marauder? I have owned 3 of 4, maxed skills for all of them, and I can tell you this changes does not address anything at all of their problems, nor for pve nor for pvp, we don't need more tank, we need more firepower, having a trillion tank will not make a golem finish missions faster than a half cost CNR. for what it matters, a normal raven or navy scorp will be as good.

and for pvp having more projection wont help, when what we need is more application, most fights are already at short range, due to hics and bubbles, having blasters reach 100000 kilometers does not help, when I need to hit the battleship orbiting me at 3km

the same applies for all the other ships, paladin is just a overtanked apoc, kronos is an armor tanked rokh, and vargur is just a slow tempest pretty much.

Keep in mind, people said that about T3s, but for a little T3s were in, Tengus becoming essentially "Super Drake" fleets. The same could certainly be said of capital fleets that number in 100+. If it wasn't for the bad tracking of dreads, you could easily see them in a fleet doctrine.

EvE has shown that you cannot count on players to be the limit but rather the mechanics. Larger alliances certainly could sponsor a push towards pilots getting marauders if they happen to be the best doctrine ship. Granted, the skills and cost will put up a limit, but only to some people.

I'm glad some other people "get" this.

Ok that's it... I must be really ****** up if a goon says I m right...

Gee, it's almost like this was intentional on CCP's part so as not to create a new skill-intensive and super expensive "I-win" button for fleet fights



Then that's his fault for not scouting ahead and jumping a lone ship into the middle of a camp. You could just as easily see the tables turned on a small camp using a small group of these akin to a Black-Ops gang. If they can't kill the target then they can be at least forced off the gate.



I think you're under-estimating the benefits of solid damage application over raw firepower and the time lost warping out of some missions. If you're blitzing through things and barely killing anything then sure, but that's arguably a problem with how some missions are setup, not with these ships and it's definitely your choice to play in a way that these ships don't cater to.

Making these things mini-DPS gods just makes them flat better than T1 and faction ships, which isn't supposed to be the role of T2 ships. The HACs and AFs being something of a deliberate exception due to their history in Eve. These are supposed to be situationally better which seems to be about where they've landed.



Having more inherent tank allows you to fit more damage application. If I don't need to run a second Armor repair module I can fit another damage mod or tracking enhancer. If I don't need a Shield Boost Amp I can fit another Tracking Computer or Target Painter.

I certainly wouldn't say no to a tracking bonus from Bastion but I also don't think it needs it since that seems like it could get a little ridiculous.

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On a closing note if you want more damage it looks like that's where the Pirate Battleships are going to land, at the expense of tank and utility.

If you want more agility then that's probably where they're going to stick the Black Ops when they separate them into support and combat hulls.

I feel this only reinforces my point about them not being that skill intensive.

Also somewhat curious by what you mean when you say "multiple fleets" because I've seen a smattering of those T3 battle reports and the most I ever saw in one fight was maybe 100. Fully willing to stand corrected here, I'm just curious.

Also is this null-sec or W-space? (assuming Null, just figured I'd ask)

Null. We would fill at least two fleets with tengu (150 to 200 in each fleet not counting logi, booster, brave newbee rifters etc). We did this for years. T3 fleets are far from rare.

I'm thinking that a few Carriers and Dreads at all IV, and able to be fully insured, will be preferable to an equal number of Marauders (even at all V), in the eyes of most 0.0 alliance leaders or FC's.

Honestly, I'm not sure why CCP feels the need to go in this direction. There has been ample need for a higher-end PVE ship for years, as evidenced by the way these ships are used. There are any number of hulls that are very good at PVP, but absolutely suck rocks at PVE. If you're okay with that, it stands to reason that you should be equally happy with a bare few ships that are too expensive for true PVP, but work well as a PVE investment.

If you want a way for your Goon buddies to grief hisec carebears, how about simply creating a new hull category, like you did with Tier 3 BC's, and leave what had been a marginally successful hull series focused upon its original purpose - turning rats into ISK.

Unless you're going to revamp the gate-to-gate footprint of half of the mission maps, your proposed changes are worse than useless. Micro Jump Drives will put you 40 kilometers PAST the gate, decreased mobility makes getting to the next gate an even more lengthy proposition (but I'm guessing you're okay with that, since it gives the mission gankers more time to scan down and kill those evil mission runners), you take away the drone bays (REALLY? ONE flight of Medium Drones for a Gallente battleship? At long last, have you no shame?), no added CPU (meaning that your gankers will still get sexy drops), and you expect the mission-running player base to be happy?

The only ones happy with this are your true target audience - Goons, and those like them, who hate everyone they refer to as 'carebears', and who go out of their way to grief them. You've given them the perfect platform with which to grief small, non-aligned, 2 & 3-man industrial corps doing T2 invention in a hisec POS.

The Law of Unintended Consequences - look it up.