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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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[Odyssey 1.1] Warfare Links, Mindlinks, Gang bonuses

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Tsubutai
Perkone
Caldari State
#101 - 2013-08-01 15:09:56 UTC
The nerf to POS boosting is good, but it will be circumvented by having heavily tanked linkships right on the edge of the forcefield so they can duck inside to safety if threatened. It might be good to have the link-suppressing effect extend out to say 40 km from the tower to prevent that sort of thing.
Buhhdust Princess
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#102 - 2013-08-01 15:10:20 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.


Um, you do know the definition of "solo" don't you? Cause I'm thinking you don't right now.


What, you think Solo is buzzing around highsec in an incursus? I think you need to start getting real, especially if you actually think RvB is :goodpvp: because let me enlighten you:

it isn't.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#103 - 2013-08-01 15:11:33 UTC
Maximus Andendare wrote:
Are T2 mindlinks going away, or are they just being supplemented with T1 and Navy mindlinks?


By mindlinks I mean the slot 10 implants, not the warfare link modules.

Technically there are no T1 mindlinks, the normal ones are T2.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#104 - 2013-08-01 15:12:03 UTC
Alice Saki wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.



+1

We knew this was coming we warned them not too do it... but meh... they only care for the big Entity


You have to remember what ingame group he came from.
Is it any surprise he ruins the game for all others?
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#105 - 2013-08-01 15:12:22 UTC
Michael Harari wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.


Suddenly spaceships talking about solo LolLolLolLolLolLol



Hey, we gotta do something with our time between BLopsing your stuff.


The answer to Links isn't to Nerf the existing links.


If anything it was to BUFF T1 links, and definitely add in those navy and T1 mindlinks

If I'm going to be in a ship that is going to have SHOOT ME!!!! All over it, I better be doing it for a good reason. Nerfing T2 links takes away a good portion of that reason. So... command ships will still be used about as much as they already are. Why? T1 BC with navy Mindlink. Job's good.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#106 - 2013-08-01 15:14:16 UTC
Tsubutai wrote:
The nerf to POS boosting is good, but it will be circumvented by having heavily tanked linkships right on the edge of the forcefield so they can duck inside to safety if threatened. It might be good to have the link-suppressing effect extend out to say 40 km from the tower to prevent that sort of thing.


Much like off-grid T3s, just being able to probe them out, or warp in on them to force the links off is huge improvement.
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#107 - 2013-08-01 15:14:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Zappity
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.


Um, you do know the definition of "solo" don't you? Cause I'm thinking you don't right now.


What, you think Solo is buzzing around highsec in an incursus? I think you need to start getting real, especially if you actually think RvB is :goodpvp: because let me enlighten you:

it isn't.


Nope, I think buzzing around lowsec is. Until you get to Kourm. or similar and run into 40km point Condors. Just pathetic.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#108 - 2013-08-01 15:15:16 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:
Michael Harari wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.


Suddenly spaceships talking about solo LolLolLolLolLolLol



Hey, we gotta do something with our time between BLopsing your stuff.


The answer to Links isn't to Nerf the existing links.


If anything it was to BUFF T1 links, and definitely add in those navy and T1 mindlinks

If I'm going to be in a ship that is going to have SHOOT ME!!!! All over it, I better be doing it for a good reason. Nerfing T2 links takes away a good portion of that reason. So... command ships will still be used about as much as they already are. Why? T1 BC with navy Mindlink. Job's good.


I personally don't think they nerfed them enough!

As for the BC with a gang link... it would be a very welcome change if they became widely used! And I think that's what CCP wants!

Dez Affinity
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#109 - 2013-08-01 15:15:34 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Alice Saki wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.



+1

We knew this was coming we warned them not too do it... but meh... they only care for the big Entity


You have to remember what ingame group he came from.
Is it any surprise he ruins the game for all others?



Cool
Gypsio III
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#110 - 2013-08-01 15:17:41 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
A bonus that will be easily erasable when they must stay in grid. A ECM boat or a Dampener boat can do as much effect on a small gang as a commadn ship. THe command ships only become VERY powerful when on large fleets. And that is EXACLTY their main purpose.. otherwise no one woudl ever use them if their final bonus was pathetic 5%


There's more to links than CS. A T1 BC in a small-gang environment can fit a link without any great difficulty or significant compromise, and can realistically expect to survive on-grid. This ease of use, combined with the sheer magnitude of the bonuses, makes them as close to mandatory as any module.

On the fleet scale, defining the argument in terms of erasing link ships easily, thereby emphasising the importance of getting rid of them, is a tacit acknowledgement of their power. It causes a bad, binary mechanic, with the gulf between having links and not having them so large that it's absurd not to primary them in fleet. If the bonuses were small (not 5%, that was your number, let's just say 50% of current bonuses), then the decision to primary link boats would not nearly be so obvious and predictable, resulting in a less binary mechanic and less of a difference in fleet power between the haves, the have-nots and the hads.
Sven Viko VIkolander
In space we are briefly free
#111 - 2013-08-01 15:18:53 UTC
Fozzie has done more to help newbros compete in EVE than anyone. Just wow. I am nervous about the boost to gate camps coming, though. Also, interceptors now more than ever will need some love.

Also, the tears in this thread are already glorious.
Fewell
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#112 - 2013-08-01 15:19:11 UTC
Do the lowering of effective bonuses you're proposing here put links in a place where you feel comfortable leaving them off grid, or is work continuing to move them on grid?
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#113 - 2013-08-01 15:21:43 UTC
I think these are a great set of changes.

Where I am.
Buhhdust Princess
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#114 - 2013-08-01 15:22:37 UTC
Zappity wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Zappity wrote:
Buhhdust Princess wrote:
Congratulations Fozzie you have just:

1. Reduced the chances Soloers have actively fighting small gang.
2. Stopped Small gangs fighting Larger gangs without using bombers, or snipers @ 200km.

But heh, I guess no one cares about the small guys when you run a business, as they don't bring in so much revenue.

I actually thought when you first released these "ideas" that you were all high.


Um, you do know the definition of "solo" don't you? Cause I'm thinking you don't right now.


What, you think Solo is buzzing around highsec in an incursus? I think you need to start getting real, especially if you actually think RvB is :goodpvp: because let me enlighten you:

it isn't.


Nope, I think buzzing around lowsec is. Until you get to Kourm. or similar and run into 40km point Condors. Just pathetic.


..this confirms everything for me lol Lol
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#115 - 2013-08-01 15:22:46 UTC
Fewell wrote:
Do the lowering of effective bonuses you're proposing here put links in a place where you feel comfortable leaving them off grid, or is work continuing to move them on grid?

Hopefully they will be moved to being ongrid still

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#116 - 2013-08-01 15:23:22 UTC
Fewell wrote:
Do the lowering of effective bonuses you're proposing here put links in a place where you feel comfortable leaving them off grid, or is work continuing to move them on grid?


Nothing would make me comfortable with optimal gameplay for some characters during a battle being for them to sit at a safespot.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#117 - 2013-08-01 15:23:28 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
MainDrain wrote:
Obviously there won't be a navy version of the mining links, but will there be an Ore version of the mining links with the same increase in bonus as the Navy links?


The navy links give the same bonus as the normal mindlinks, but they give it to multiple disciplines at once.

We may add an Ore link at some point, if so it will probably give Mining Foreman and Siege Warfare bonuses.
Oh ok, good. It wasn't clear, because in the post you mentioned you were having "normal" mindlinks (and Navy ones). The "normal" mindlinks language (and the "more of a slope" language) made me think you were adding a T1 variant (for cheap and less-than-Cybernetics V) in addition to the currently existing ones and new Navy variants.

Enter grid and you're already dead, destined to be reborn and fight another day.

>> Play Eve Online FREE! Join today for exclusive bonuses! <<

Buhhdust Princess
Mind Games.
Suddenly Spaceships.
#118 - 2013-08-01 15:26:28 UTC
If you are going to do this, then you really have to look at the claymore as an armour tanker AS WELL AS a shield tanker, without making it too OP. Otherwise Loki/Claymore links are going to be utter shite, and you're just going to have the Nano age back again where everyone kites everything with no big deal.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#119 - 2013-08-01 15:26:39 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Fewell wrote:
Do the lowering of effective bonuses you're proposing here put links in a place where you feel comfortable leaving them off grid, or is work continuing to move them on grid?


Nothing would make me comfortable with optimal gameplay for some characters during a battle being for them to sit at a safespot.


QFT!!
Ziv Erth
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#120 - 2013-08-01 15:27:33 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:

We may add an Ore link at some point, if so it will probably give Mining Foreman and Siege Warfare bonuses.


Yes. Yes, please.