Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Playing Kerbal Space Program, I discovered a parts pack that included the SABRE engine (if you're into rockets and spaceships, they're really cool, so read up on them on wikipedia). In essence, it's a unified air-breathing/oxidiser rocket engine, which switches at high altitudes when the air runs out.

So, it got me thinking to EVE, and how you do have a number of ships out there that want to have both the mobility of a MWD, but the AB for sig/speed tanking in close and how often they have to significantly compromise their shield tanking with the loss of two midslots for a dual prop setup. Why not have a unified MWD/AB device?

Basic concept- normal operation, it runs like an AB, overheat, it runs like a regular MWD, but no heat generation. Fitting- somewhere close to a MWD, maybe a little under or over, or maybe the CPU/PG of the two modules added together- the point isn't to compromise their tank by making them run out of fitting instead, but free up a mid, at a cost. Maybe slightly more cap usage than their normal counterparts is a better balance for the dual function?

Obvious downsides is you do not have the overheating function for either AB or MWD (that is, more speed for heat; the MWD mode gives you more speed for cap + sig bloom). The MWD mode is obviously still vulnerable to a scram, the AB to a web.

Also, it does totally turn a lot of PVP balance on its head, so I'll go ahead and admit, I have no idea how to balance this, but it feels like an interesting idea.

Had that idea in my mind too, but wanted to work it into some 'Buff Regular Lowsec' stuff.


So basically i'll just drop it here now.


Add OFFICER spawns to Lowsec \o/

But not the regular ones, add officer dessies.

Could drop certain officer modules on frigate scale, for example an officer 1mn propmod that can be scripted.

No Script: AB
Script: increased capuse, increased thrust, increased signature (just like, ya know, a mwd). Script might be drop, too, or obtained as drop from some structures in some DED 10/10, or via the pirate LP store for big chunk of LP, idk.

And a lot more stuff i haven't properly thought out yet.

I think it has utility in PVE... sniper battleships wouldn't mind an afterburner to sig-tank a bit, while an MWD means they can control range and burn through gates.

The trick to balancing them is to not make the AB and the MWD obsolete- if it doesn't have enough downsides, it will become a defacto module and the others will fall into disuse. A little extra cap and not being able to overheat is a fine trade off in most cases, so maybe it really needs to cost as much CPU/PG as the two modules to fit. Then it becomes about balancing the extra mid vs. the other downsides.

I like the idea of some of the MWD effects bleeding through into the AB- a small sig bloom, some mass gain. That could even be extended to be a permanent on-equip effect and would mesh especially well with ships that have a reduction to prop-mod based sig bloom effects.

I think the two modules are far more differentiated than that and end up being used for different purposes because of it, rather than being an interchangeable choice along a single dimension of risk vs. mobility. ABs are more used for sig tanking, MWDs are made for mobility. Webs mitigate speed tanking, scrams mitigate mobility.

A SABRE engine could allow some ships to do a bit of both- give typically AB fit ships a mobility option and MWD ships some sig tanking option, at the cost of neither being quite as good as the dedicated tank or mobility option.

If it had the fittings and max cap reduction of an MWD, it would be straight worse than an AB, so it would never overshadow the AB.

If it had 5% less speed + 5% sig bloom then a meta 0 MWD plus maybe a bit more cap usage, then it wouldnt overshadow the MWD either.

The only thing that might go the way of the dinosaur would be the dual prop setups, but even then, a dual prop setup would be more effective at either when running either prop mod, it would just take two slots and more grid/cpu

I think both prop mods are fine how they are- they don't need graduations between them, it's nicer to have two clear-cut points with distinct benefits and disadvantages, it makes for an interesting choice. However, it's quite viable to take one of both, which is a very difficult choice to make not just on the fitting front, but on the fact that it's taking a second, precious midslot- for ships that concern themselves with speed, these are already in short supply, as you have to consider tackle and tank (shields being better for speed). The result is that very few ships can justify dual-prop, so it's rare that it gets used.

Sigras is totally right, a SABRE module would have to contrast not only with single prop solutions, but also the classic dual-prop with dual modules approach. Is dual prop too hard to fit and would a SABRE module encourage more dual-prop playstyle? Is dual-prop too overpowered a capability and that fitting difficulty is justified? If so, the SABRE module would have to have significant, but different downsides that are on-par with the midslot cost.