These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Odyssey 1.1] Tech 1 Industrials, Round 2

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#741 - 2013-07-17 00:59:46 UTC
B aalzamon wrote:
Do cargo expanders and rigs affect the ore holds on Orcas, Ventures, Mining Barges, or Exhumers? No.
Correct. But, only because the specialty bays on these ships were also introduced long after the cargo expanders and rigs were first developed (at that time, there was only the standard cargohold). It is very likely that had the cargo expanders and rigs been developed *after* the specialty bays, the CCP devs would have included the bays in the bonuses. After all, there really isn't any reason not to do so.

Players who are carrying stuff should always have the option of sacrificing tank/speed, ie. becoming more vulnerable, in favor of more cargo space - it simply makes the game more interesting. Funny thing is... I believe this is one point on which the haulers/miners *and* the gankers would agree. :)

B aalzamon wrote:
Did the mining botters cry foul when CCP gave them massive ore holds and made them throw away their cargo rigs? No. Why? Because they aren't idiots.
As a matter of fact....

I guess you didn't follow the thread on the changes to mining ships. Many of the old exhumers were fit with T2 cargo rigs and the mining community was quite vocal in "crying foul", since these very expensive rigs no longer contributed substantially and they could not be removed without being destroyed.
Jabolex
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#742 - 2013-07-17 07:45:01 UTC
The Epithal will have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities
Primae have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities.
Galmas
United System's Commonwealth
#743 - 2013-07-17 09:43:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Galmas
If i have had a word in this decision i would have voted for saving the costs for all that and hire someone to to help with coding the personal ship hangars for POS...

edit: or maybe finally give all the t2 cloaky haulers a second high slot...

As i read all this you will need several haulers to do several things most efficiently... sounds tedious, over-complicated, waste of time, no new content added. I don't like.
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#744 - 2013-07-17 09:46:37 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:

Is the specialist ammo bay accessible by fleet? I guess you kinda answered that in your original post about "pushing the boundaries" but I figure it's worth asking :)


That would be awesome. I'd probably never use it, but it'd be awesome.

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.
Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#745 - 2013-07-17 11:10:28 UTC
Jabolex wrote:
The Epithal will have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities
Primae have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities.



The Primae doesn't count as anything more than a hangar decoration.
Beofryn Sedorak
#746 - 2013-07-17 15:10:04 UTC
Jada Maroo wrote:
Jabolex wrote:
The Epithal will have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities
Primae have a dedicated bay for planetary commodities.



The Primae doesn't count as anything more than a hangar decoration.


Or a ship for launching your single Planetary Command Center on a trial account.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#747 - 2013-07-17 15:55:42 UTC
poor primae will need a buff now and maybe a extra unique element perhaps..

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
B aalzamon
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#748 - 2013-07-17 17:02:31 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
... had the cargo expanders and rigs been developed *after* the specialty bays, the CCP devs would have included the bays in the bonuses.

So, you're a mind reader? Also, which lottery numbers should I play?
Based on the simple fact that the Devs chose not to have the specialty bays affected by cargo rigs and expanders, I would assume that they made that choice intentionally, which throws your failed attempt to pretend to be a dev out the window.

Sizeof Void wrote:
I guess you didn't follow the thread on the changes to mining ships. Many of the old exhumers were fit with T2 cargo rigs and the mining community was quite vocal in "crying foul", since these very expensive rigs no longer contributed substantially and they could not be removed without being destroyed.


I stand corrected. I had assumed they were not idiots, but I have been proven wrong. Wouldn't a T2 cargo rigged Exhumer still have the most combined ore + cargo space than any other Exhumer fit? And didn't the Exhumer rebalance give them more storage space, so that after the rebalance, a T2 cargo rigged Exhumer had more combined storage space than before the rebalance? If so, why were people whining, other than the fact that they are hisec carebears who can't handle change? CCP gives them MORE storage after the rebalance and yet they still complain. So, yeah, apparently they are idiots.

-B aalzamon
Scuzzy Logic
Space Spuds
#749 - 2013-07-17 18:09:53 UTC
Beofryn Sedorak wrote:
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
CCP Rise:

What I find astonishing is, that the art team is too busy to change a few haulers - and it wouldn't even have to be a complete redesign, you could move one each of the spare Iterons to Amarr, one to Caldari and simply use recolored versions of their existing haulers, so every faction has 3 haulers, one for tank, one for cargo and one with a special bay.

Yet at the same time, that very same art team finds the time for the identical job - recoloring/retexturing 2 existing hulls - for two ships that only a handful of people will ever benefit from - and only as a trophy, not to fly them.


P.S. From a player's perspective I like the fact that i will only ever have to skill into one race's industrials. As a designer the lack of any balance therein makes me cringe.


Your astonishment surely arises from your absolute and total ignorance of size, man hours, and current work load of the art team. You arrogantly assume to know more about what the art team can and can't do in any given time frame and also know more about what they are or aren't doing with their time currently.

Please accept that this will always be true and stop being whiney about CCP not currently dedicating time on new industrial ship models and be happy that even after 10 years, EVE Online is still an amazing game and that maybe, JUST maybe, CCP has a clue how to do the whole game development thing.


CCP has no clue how to balance anything. They do know how to tether players to the sunken cost fallacy so hard their e-testicles turn blue though.

Also, the 3d models in EVE are notoriously lazy. Yes, ships designed avter the V3 revit like the Corax are much better in this regard, but it doesn't change the fact a single individual can likely make a full ship's polygon and then put the textures for it in about 3 days' time. Stop licking CCP's boots.
Muffcobb
737 Incorporated
Unforgiving.
#750 - 2013-07-17 18:52:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Muffcobb
Is it too generic to just have each race have a max haul/min tank - min haul/good tank industrial and then make all of these specialty ships ORE industrials?

This way you can be a racist and train up your own type of industrial because you think it's cool and if you want some specialized hauler, than you train up the ORE industrial skill. Seems like it would fit into your system pretty well and prevent some of the cross training confusion.
AstraPardus
Earthside Mixlabs
#751 - 2013-07-17 21:17:52 UTC
Fire Ships: Now with real fire! :3
Every time I post is Pardy time! :3
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#752 - 2013-07-17 21:30:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Scuzzy Logic wrote:
Beofryn Sedorak wrote:
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
CCP Rise:

What I find astonishing is, that the art team is too busy to change a few haulers - and it wouldn't even have to be a complete redesign, you could move one each of the spare Iterons to Amarr, one to Caldari and simply use recolored versions of their existing haulers, so every faction has 3 haulers, one for tank, one for cargo and one with a special bay.

Yet at the same time, that very same art team finds the time for the identical job - recoloring/retexturing 2 existing hulls - for two ships that only a handful of people will ever benefit from - and only as a trophy, not to fly them.


P.S. From a player's perspective I like the fact that i will only ever have to skill into one race's industrials. As a designer the lack of any balance therein makes me cringe.


Your astonishment surely arises from your absolute and total ignorance of size, man hours, and current work load of the art team. You arrogantly assume to know more about what the art team can and can't do in any given time frame and also know more about what they are or aren't doing with their time currently.

Please accept that this will always be true and stop being whiney about CCP not currently dedicating time on new industrial ship models and be happy that even after 10 years, EVE Online is still an amazing game and that maybe, JUST maybe, CCP has a clue how to do the whole game development thing.


CCP has no clue how to balance anything. They do know how to tether players to the sunken cost fallacy so hard their e-********* turn blue though.

Also, the 3d models in EVE are notoriously lazy. Yes, ships designed avter the V3 revit like the Corax are much better in this regard, but it doesn't change the fact a single individual can likely make a full ship's polygon and then put the textures for it in about 3 days' time. Stop licking CCP's boots.

Well great, get right on that sweet cheeks. Put your money where your pixels are. Big smile
Do be sure to only do it in your spare time, as they already have other projects slated for their normal 8hr. shift.
See you in 3 days.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#753 - 2013-07-17 22:12:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Mara Rinn
*snip*

Wrong thread Oops

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Trinity Griffin
Clann Fian
#754 - 2013-07-18 00:17:58 UTC
What about the Bustard, you know the one that aligns slower than an Orca?
The tech2 ship that has +2 warp strength but gives the aggressor enough time to fly 5 jumps to Jita, buy a faction +3 scram, fly back and point it before it enters into warp.

The description reads:
Deep space transports are designed with the depths of lawless space in mind. Possessing defensive capabilities far in excess of standard industrial ships, they provide great protection for whatever cargo is being transported in their massive holds. They are, however, some of the slowest ships to be found floating through space.

The only thing that's true for the Bustard in that description is the last sentence.
kal ho
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#755 - 2013-07-18 05:40:08 UTC
What will happen to the ship that we have already? Will they get changed automatically to new version?Question
Anthar Thebess
#756 - 2013-07-18 07:46:39 UTC
What about http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Primae
Can ccp add an BPC to some LP store , and buff this ship?

I know this is special edition ship but right now it is useless and tbh i like the hull.

Maybe it could be buffed to cheep mining/boosting ship ( 1 link ) .

Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists

Show your support to The Cause!
Oraac Ensor
#757 - 2013-07-18 07:57:39 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
"Iteron Mk. IV" to "Miasmos"

This one carries ore, which means ice, minerals and gas. We've pretty much covered the first two with the Kryos name, so we decided to have some fun with gas. A "miasma" is a gaseous contagion - actually one of the first on record, from Greek mythology; and as we tend to sometimes mythologize Gallente ship names, it was a good fit. Another candidate was "Atreus", the dude who actually caused the plague by doing some horrible things (seriously, look him up), but it's far too similar to the Atron; so "Miasmos" it is.

What about the special edition versions?
Orakkus
ImperiaI Federation
Goonswarm Federation
#758 - 2013-07-18 14:58:28 UTC
Trinity Griffin wrote:
What about the Bustard, you know the one that aligns slower than an Orca?
The tech2 ship that has +2 warp strength but gives the aggressor enough time to fly 5 jumps to Jita, buy a faction +3 scram, fly back and point it before it enters into warp.

The description reads:
Deep space transports are designed with the depths of lawless space in mind. Possessing defensive capabilities far in excess of standard industrial ships, they provide great protection for whatever cargo is being transported in their massive holds. They are, however, some of the slowest ships to be found floating through space.

The only thing that's true for the Bustard in that description is the last sentence.


They haven't started their balancing run on the Tech 2 ships yet, in which the Bustard will also be addressed.

He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
Razefummel
Unknown Dimension
#759 - 2013-07-18 20:38:19 UTC
tl:dr (whole Threadnought)

2 questions wich i have atm...

1. Why renaming an Group of Ships witch have almost the same Design, ecept of the length, and wich is the Reason (probably) it was consecutively numbered ?

2. Why don´t just give all Races an equal Number of Industrials, probably 5 or 6 ?

(That would be an nice ISK-sink because of the BPO´s, AND an Player would´t be forced to train Skills of an second or third Race to get the benefits of the "special-usage Industrials" like the Iteron II, III and IV or the Hoarder.)

just an thought...

Greetings

Raze

250.000 Skillpunkte gratis zum Start:

Buddyinvite

Unknown Dimension Forum
Silivar Karkun
Doomheim
#760 - 2013-07-19 02:09:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Silivar Karkun
Anthar Thebess wrote:
What about http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Primae
Can ccp add an BPC to some LP store , and buff this ship?

I know this is special edition ship but right now it is useless and tbh i like the hull.

Maybe it could be buffed to cheep mining/boosting ship ( 1 link ) .



i agree with the LP thing, but not convert it to a mining command ship, instead make it an specialized gas harvester, the venture can serve as a first step for new players and then jump to that one.

TBH there are 3 ships that would go really nice as specialized faction ships for mini professions:

-primae, now that the Epithal will be the dedicate PI ship, it could be transformed in an improved gas harvester.

-echelon, specialized in hacking, better performance than the common exploration ship

-zephyr, instead of keeping it as a shuttle, make it an archaeology ship, with improved analyzing capabilities.

the primae would be bought as BPC from the ORE LP store, the Echelon would be from CONCORD and the Zephyr from the Sisters of EVE or the Intaki Syndicate LP store....

it isnt so hard to do.

adding to that, it would make sense to put Transport ships in the rebalance board right now, a change to the industrials cant come without a rebalance for their T2 counterparts, it is a must, DSTs need some love.