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Hybrids + L4 missions
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Bane Hellblaze
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-06-19 20:56:45 UTC
wondering if rails are the best way to go on a megathron,

are t2 rails worth the sp investment? or will 425mm prototype gauss guns sufice?

kronos stronger then a vindicator on the high end of things?

when i get my skills a lil better anyone want to take me to lvl 4 mission to help me with standings? (FIO or Fed Navy)

t2 "javelin" ammo worth it if i do get the t2 rails?
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#2 - 2013-06-19 21:33:35 UTC
T2 rails get you an extra ~8% damage over meta 4, which is actually a pretty decent step up. It isn't absolutely critical for missions, but honestly why not go for it?

Vindicator will pretty much always outdamage a similarly fit Kronos, but the Vindicator has some major issues (tight fit, low native targeting range) that have to be overcome. The Kronos tanks harder and is generally more forgiving all around.

Javelin is useful where Javelin is useful. For better or worse, both the ships you mentioned don't really have much room for it because anything at a range where Jav is beneficial can get webbed down -- at which point the extra tracking is pretty pointless. NMega has uses for it though.

As to whether T2 ammo is cost effective: yes. Yes it is. So is faction ammo, and T2 is far cheaper.

The problem with all of the above these days is that the lowly Dominix -- not even the NDominix -- can get a ludicrous 800 DPS at 74+12. And it comes with frankly insane tracking. Which means that your cheap little Dominix is going to do more effective damage at any range under, oh, 82ish km (compared to the Vindicator, which has trouble targeting that far) or 84ish for the Kronos. Which kind of makes all hybrid battleship options look bad in a meta that allows you to instantly jump to 100km and drop sentries.
Bane Hellblaze
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-06-19 22:28:39 UTC
the reason i want a gunship is for the fun of it, the being an active part of the combat, my first toon was a ratthesnake pilot, drop drones and afk with an unbreakable passive tank,,, kinda like mining

i want guns for the fun of shooting stuff and i plan to pvp alot mainly using guns so i figure kill 2 birds with 1 stone sorta thing..

if t2 rails are that much better i might get them then =) and get a kronos since its more forgiving... just 100 days away rofl... guess ill stick to my pretty mega for now

anyone elses opinions are still apreciated tho, =)
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-06-20 00:55:47 UTC
just blaster fit it with a decent AB if you want funsies. By decent I mean deadspace

Art of Explosions
hmskrecik
TransMine Group
Gluten Free Cartel
#5 - 2013-06-20 09:04:03 UTC
What Zhilia said. With couple of additions/corrections/caveats/etc.

Zhilia Mann wrote:
Javelin is useful where Javelin is useful. For better or worse, both the ships you mentioned don't really have much room for it because anything at a range where Jav is beneficial can get webbed down -- at which point the extra tracking is pretty pointless. NMega has uses for it though.

I found Javelins and extra tracking to be much more important and useful than web bonus. Web works only on close quarters while tracking is useful at all ranges (better quality hits) and ammo can be switched. Javelins make short job of almost every orbiting cruiser and if they don't, you just move your ass around to keep speed vectors as parallel as possible and Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle.

Quote:
As to whether T2 ammo is cost effective: yes. Yes it is. So is faction ammo, and T2 is far cheaper.

Price per shot is quite similar. Bottom line is, it is more profitable to shoot faction than regular ammo, on Vindi most of the times, on Kronos always.

Quote:
The problem with all of the above these days is that the lowly Dominix -- not even the NDominix -- can get a ludicrous 800 DPS at 74+12. And it comes with frankly insane tracking. Which means that your cheap little Dominix is going to do more effective damage at any range under, oh, 82ish km (compared to the Vindicator, which has trouble targeting that far) or 84ish for the Kronos. Which kind of makes all hybrid battleship options look bad in a meta that allows you to instantly jump to 100km and drop sentries.

Yesno. Yes, after rebalance the Domi is a slick (or sick, if you prefer) monster with its sentry bonus. But in performace charts it's noticeably weaker than those railboats (about 3-to-4 ratio; do mind it's very rough estimate). Though on bang for bucks terms it may be probably the best ship out there. Like you said: no pimping at all, only T2 fit and 900-ish dps (with guns) at about 80km is something to be reckoned with.
Enochx Kaine
Doomheim
#6 - 2013-06-20 14:41:53 UTC
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?
hmskrecik
TransMine Group
Gluten Free Cartel
#7 - 2013-06-20 15:57:15 UTC
Enochx Kaine wrote:
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?

It means things are okay as expected, going according to the plan.
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-06-20 23:11:26 UTC
Enochx Kaine wrote:
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?


Like "Bob's your uncle". Except it's referring to Bjorn Stronginthearm of Burleigh & Stronginthearm, noted Ankh-Morpork crossbow makers since the Century of the Fruitbat.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-06-21 08:03:16 UTC
Bane Hellblaze wrote:
wondering if rails are the best way to go on a megathron,

are t2 rails worth the sp investment? or will 425mm prototype gauss guns sufice?

...

t2 "javelin" ammo worth it if i do get the t2 rails?


Faction guns are equal to T2 guns with 3 points in specialization, but can't use T2 ammo and cost a lot more. The T2 gun are not better then you support skill, especially with T2 ammo, unless you already have maxed out your support skills i would say you should get a set of faction guns. Unless you lose the ship, you can sell the guns when you are ready to use T2.

Bane Hellblaze wrote:
kronos stronger then a vindicator on the high end of things?

when i get my skills a lil better anyone want to take me to lvl 4 mission to help me with standings? (FIO or Fed Navy)


The vindicator does more damage then the kronos, the kronos has more tank then the vindicator. If you look a isk/hr from running missions i still think the kronos is the better ship because you can loot/salvage while running the missions.

If all you want to do is run missions i would say go with the kronos, if you also want to do incursions go with the vindicator.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Markus Navarro
Osmon Integrated Robotics
#10 - 2013-06-21 17:49:59 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
Enochx Kaine wrote:
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?


Like "Bob's your uncle". Except it's referring to Bjorn Stronginthearm of Burleigh & Stronginthearm, noted Ankh-Morpork crossbow makers since the Century of the Fruitbat.



I like you.

I sell drones and drones accessories.
Ginger Barbarella
#11 - 2013-06-21 18:37:20 UTC
Markus Navarro wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:
Enochx Kaine wrote:
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?


Like "Bob's your uncle". Except it's referring to Bjorn Stronginthearm of Burleigh & Stronginthearm, noted Ankh-Morpork crossbow makers since the Century of the Fruitbat.



I like you.


I'm fond of confusing inside jokes, too...

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2013-06-22 01:56:42 UTC
If you already have the Gallante + Minmatar BS and looking for a gun to train, make it AC instead of rails, and fly Mach instead of Vindi.

Speed and agility of a cruiser for that active playstyle you wanted, plus high dps, projection, and tracking for fast clearing.
I Accidentally YourShip
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2013-06-22 17:58:45 UTC
Ginger Barbarella wrote:
Markus Navarro wrote:
Marc Callan wrote:
Enochx Kaine wrote:
" Bjorn Stronginthearm is your uncle"

What in teh blue hell does that mean?


Like "Bob's your uncle". Except it's referring to Bjorn Stronginthearm of Burleigh & Stronginthearm, noted Ankh-Morpork crossbow makers since the Century of the Fruitbat.



I like you.


I'm fond of confusing inside jokes, too...


Discworld.