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EVE Launcher update on May 21, 2013

First post First post
Author
Korinne
The Partisan Brigade
#1921 - 2013-05-22 00:48:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Korinne
"The new login functionality that we deployed today is designed to start changing the way users log into the EVE Universe; whilst it is often true that one shouldn't change something if it isn't broken, such a cliché doesn't allow for changing priorities. "

That is some PR censored garbage if I ever read any. Tell me, just what exactly are the priorities for Eve, or do they not tell you that? Even if the launcher worked, all it is is a billboard to advertise to people WHO ALREADY GIVE YOU MONEY, any claims of added functionality is a thinly veiled lie. The only reason you would make a launcher like this is if you're already planning to try to roll out microtransactions yet again and pay to win as per the Dust model.

You say you as a company have changing priorities, and it is apparent that the priority has shifted away from making the best space sandbox imaginable, to making a fuckton of money off of 12 year old newfags, to put it candidly.

Edit: Want more evidence? Look at some of the recent UI changes that didn't need to happen. They changed the names of missles and prop mods for no reason, they've rolled out major skill overhauls several times and are about to again, they're making it easier to make babysitting cap alts, and they keep making pvp more cookiecutter by being EFT warriors, they even tried taking away ship spinning, and when that didn't work they changed the hangar. Now they're making the game itself work more like every other game, and introducing a console shooter (a market dominated by minors and people generally deemed undesirable to the Eve community).

We as Eve players have always prided ourselves on some level for being ahead and above the rest of the gaming community in intellect, competence, and maturity; these changes only detract from that, making Eve easier by giving it the nerf treatment under the guise of 'accessibility to new players'.

All of that would even be fine if for the fact that it didn't detract from Eve's bread and butter, being internet spaceships, which it clearly has. The past few expansions and patches have had little to no new content, and were merely filled with recycled and regurgitated content, thus making it obvious that overhead is being shifted away from Eve development.

Given all of this evidence, the only conclusions one can draw is that CCP no longer cares about Eve as much as they should, if at all (at best), or that they're about to scrap the subscription model and go all out with the selling of pay to win and bunny hats in a free game (at worst, and vastly more profitable in the short term).
CCP Atropos
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1922 - 2013-05-22 00:49:59 UTC
Calathorn Virpio wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:
Also, in case it needs reiterating, we really need the detailed logs that the Launcher writes out to it's cache folder to be able to help diagnose what's gone wrong in the situations where people are still failing to log in/update/patch or whatever. Please, please, please file a bug report and attach the logs.




not everyone knows what these logs are or where to find them......

Yea, I just edited my original post to highlight that, thanks for the tip Blink
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#1923 - 2013-05-22 00:50:35 UTC
Madlof Chev wrote:
I'm not sure if this is a technical limitation, but the only way in which the new launcher would actually make it faster for me to launch multiple clients than it was before would be if it were possible to launch another client that you've signed in while a client is launching. This is pretty terrible to explain, so I'll do a FORUMDIAGRAM(tm)

Previous

>open launcher
>spam return key
>speed log in while alt-tabbing


New Launcher

>open launcher
>log in
>click play
>switch user
>log in
>wait for the client to launch fully

^^^^ This is where it gets slow - I can log in faster than the launcher will let me launch clients. I really don't want to sit through this if I need to log in a cyno chain quickly and from what I can tell, you want to remove the login screen, so going through ExeFile.exe won't work around this for long.


does this mean that having own installation to every account is fastest way to log in all accounts?
Deka Soong
Lurkers Of The Shadow
#1924 - 2013-05-22 00:50:42 UTC
concerning this launch I thoguht it was a bad idea to begin with. The only think i liked was that it made accessing the updates and newest ccp posts easier to find.

I run 6 accounts as of right now and it totally DEFUNKED this toons settings witht the new launcher i had to reset everything all my defaults. WHICH IS BS! It's an update no a patch so things should change drastically like that. It also makes it very difficult to turn all my accounts on so i can go mine/mission. Im a care bear its what i do. And you just made it harder for me to do it. roll the launcher back and im sure a lot of people will shut up.
Perramas
DreddNaut
#1925 - 2013-05-22 00:52:56 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Also, in case it needs reiterating, we really need the detailed logs that the Launcher writes out to it's cache folder to be able to help diagnose what's gone wrong in the situations where people are still failing to log in/update/patch or whatever. Please, please, please file a bug report and attach the logs.

*EDIT*

The logs can be found under the launcher/cache folder inside your EVE installation.


The logs show nothing.

Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people- Eleanor Roosevelt

Yogsoloth
Fliet Pizza Delivery
Of Essence
#1926 - 2013-05-22 00:54:28 UTC
Just make it so I can have different graphics settings for each instance open, and have them be saved or remembered for each account.
acordn
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1927 - 2013-05-22 00:54:55 UTC
rather than focus on this stupid sso BS. why dont ya focus on allowing us to export every little setting in eve with a few clicks. so that way i can have a hard copy when you decide to go crazy and screw everyone
Vhaine Vhindiscar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1928 - 2013-05-22 00:57:16 UTC
What is the point of testing if you people NEVER listen to the feedback?

It's a pile. I logged in to find all my settings reverted. I had to go out to reddit to quickly find out how to fix it. Then I reopen the launcher and am greeted with 20 minutes of Validating Client.

Also, If I have already hit BUTTAN to login...why must I press another one to 'play.' Why did I just login? To admire the graphic design work that went into the second button? CCP mouse kick fiesta continues.
mechtech
Ice Liberation Army
#1929 - 2013-05-22 00:59:06 UTC  |  Edited by: mechtech
I just lost settings for 8 accounts. Wonderful. There's nothing like an 8 year vet getting the "new game" movie again.

C'mon CCP, don't. delete. user. settings.

New launcher is a logical step, but seriously...

(and please implement log out to char select and better multi-account support)

I'll probably be slightly pissed off for the next 30 minutes, could have been worse I suppose Straight
Korinne
The Partisan Brigade
#1930 - 2013-05-22 00:59:33 UTC
Vhaine Vhindiscar wrote:
What is the point of testing if you people NEVER listen to the feedback?

It's a pile. I logged in to find all my settings reverted. I had to go out to reddit to quickly find out how to fix it. Then I reopen the launcher and am greeted with 20 minutes of Validating Client.

Also, If I have already hit BUTTAN to login...why must I press another one to 'play.' Why did I just login? To admire the graphic design work that went into the second button? CCP mouse kick fiesta continues.


It's the illusion of input/power that 'feedback' gives you, it tricks you into thinking you have a real say in stuff, just like when you go to vote for your representative.
Crexa
Ion Industrials
#1931 - 2013-05-22 01:04:18 UTC
I sincerely hope this is not what to expect come June 4th. As this launcher is garbage.

A. I lost all my logins, (multiple accounts) . I had them written down so not huge at first, but then I start logging in characters only to find all settings reverted,

B. all chats gone.

C. audio, graphic and that clusterfrack station environment all at max and on. One of my PCs had a panic attack from the resource starvation this caused. Ok its a piece of junk, but still.

D. All characters are in this state, thanks for letting me play organizer today, I really had that planned! sarcasm off.Evil

"F=ma, so obviously they're putting mouths against arses to produce a force." "...its breakfast time and i am very hungry. may i have some of your paint chips?"

Anonymouse Reporter01
Doomheim
#1932 - 2013-05-22 01:06:53 UTC
Perramas wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:
Also, in case it needs reiterating, we really need the detailed logs that the Launcher writes out to it's cache folder to be able to help diagnose what's gone wrong in the situations where people are still failing to log in/update/patch or whatever. Please, please, please file a bug report and attach the logs.

*EDIT*

The logs can be found under the launcher/cache folder inside your EVE installation.


The logs show nothing.

In my case not quite true, I have an hour of file validations, followed by two lines of 'client validation plus SetClientUpToDate set True. The last line of the log file has Sending the following JavaScript code to the browser setPlayButtonEnabled 'Client is ready'. No further log entries for the next hour after trying to login. Log submitted in bug report but I suspect more log information is required. There was mention that there had been an update to instructions but I didn't see a link on the posting that said there had been an update/correction. Where are the instructions for creating a more detailed Log?
EI Digin
irc.zulusquad.org
#1933 - 2013-05-22 01:08:58 UTC
I like the new launcher.
Zh'Khraag
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1934 - 2013-05-22 01:11:14 UTC
Since a picture is worth a thousand words, I had the idea that the current state of CCP could best be expressed as a Meme. It seems they are more interested in pleasing their masters at Sony than pleasing the thousands of customers that made them worthy of Sony consideration. As I racked my brain to remember a meme that would show CCP's borked strategies and Sony's mastery over them, I remembered a meme that was popular in my nullsec days. During the latest war in the South, there was a fairly popular meme. I redid it some, and believe it shows the current state of Eve, CCP and Sony rather well.

Eve Sony and CCP

What do you think?
Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1935 - 2013-05-22 01:12:17 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Calathorn Virpio wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:
Also, in case it needs reiterating, we really need the detailed logs that the Launcher writes out to it's cache folder to be able to help diagnose what's gone wrong in the situations where people are still failing to log in/update/patch or whatever. Please, please, please file a bug report and attach the logs.




not everyone knows what these logs are or where to find them......

Yea, I just edited my original post to highlight that, thanks for the tip Blink


These are not words you say to people who payed money for a working game. These words are the ones you tell the testers so that by the time it gets to us people paying money, it runs smooth and we don't have to check forums, file reports or attach logs.

Is that not obvious?
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#1936 - 2013-05-22 01:16:09 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Regarding the slow startup time of the new EVE Launcher: the first time the new EVE Launcher starts up, it needs to determine the state of your client installation. This requires it to analyse every file in your installation. This will take some time, since the EVE client is somewhere around 12Gb in size. However, after this point, the checksums will be saved in the Launcher's cache folder. Clearing out the Launcher's cache folder will obviously delete this file, requiring you to re-analyse your installation.

If people are finding that they need to spend a lengthy amount of time analysing their installation every time they start up, I would beg them to file a bug reporting, and provide the logs that their Launcher is generating, and saving into it's cache folder.



Definitely continued to take a long time on 2nd, 3rd, 4th use of launcher. I'm not using the launcher beyond this - so meh.
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#1937 - 2013-05-22 01:16:40 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Drosera Capensis wrote:
This thing wasn't working on Singularity properly either, I had to remove all the spaces in the EVE folder for it to work properly there.

Anyway, my wife wants to extend her thanks to CCP for rolling out a launcher that is successfully preventing me from playing EVE.

It would be great if you could supply us with your logs, or file a bug report with them.



sorry but our logs show nothing. Twisted

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Xamiakas
United-Empire
#1938 - 2013-05-22 01:17:49 UTC
Korinne wrote:
"The new login functionality that we deployed today is designed to start changing the way users log into the EVE Universe; whilst it is often true that one shouldn't change something if it isn't broken, such a cliché doesn't allow for changing priorities. "

That is some PR censored garbage if I ever read any. Tell me, just what exactly are the priorities for Eve, or do they not tell you that? Even if the launcher worked, all it is is a billboard to advertise to people WHO ALREADY GIVE YOU MONEY, any claims of added functionality is a thinly veiled lie. The only reason you would make a launcher like this is if you're already planning to try to roll out microtransactions yet again and pay to win as per the Dust model.

You say you as a company have changing priorities, and it is apparent that the priority has shifted away from making the best space sandbox imaginable, to making a fuckton of money off of 12 year old newfags, to put it candidly.

Edit: Want more evidence? Look at some of the recent UI changes that didn't need to happen. They changed the names of missles and prop mods for no reason, they've rolled out major skill overhauls several times and are about to again, they're making it easier to make babysitting cap alts, and they keep making pvp more cookiecutter by being EFT warriors, they even tried taking away ship spinning, and when that didn't work they changed the hangar. Now they're making the game itself work more like every other game, and introducing a console shooter (a market dominated by minors and people generally deemed undesirable to the Eve community).

We as Eve players have always prided ourselves on some level for being ahead and above the rest of the gaming community in intellect, competence, and maturity; these changes only detract from that, making Eve easier by giving it the nerf treatment under the guise of 'accessibility to new players'.

All of that would even be fine if for the fact that it didn't detract from Eve's bread and butter, being internet spaceships, which it clearly has. The past few expansions and patches have had little to no new content, and were merely filled with recycled and regurgitated content, thus making it obvious that overhead is being shifted away from Eve development.

Given all of this evidence, the only conclusions one can draw is that CCP no longer cares about Eve as much as they should, if at all (at best), or that they're about to scrap the subscription model and go all out with the selling of pay to win and bunny hats in a free game (at worst, and vastly more profitable in the short term).

have you got any idea how long it`ll take our dear ccp to understand what you have typed here? google.translate isn`t perfect you know.. :D

<-- unbelievably low tollerance to stupidity in people. That + you being your mother's child might aswell be the main reason why i am NOT your father.

Kblackjack54
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1939 - 2013-05-22 01:17:50 UTC
''The new login functionality that we deployed today is designed to start changing the way users log into the EVE Universe; whilst it is often true that one shouldn't change something if it isn't broken, such a cliché doesn't allow for changing priorities. Our goal was that by rolling out the new login method, and supporting the single sign on service, we could lay the groundwork to start moving people away from the messy multiboxing setups that have traditionally never been supported by us as a company, and towards something that makes more sense for CCP and the services we provide.''

Will you justify the above paragraph to the players, you have for years promoted multiple accounts, in fact in the upcoming iteration of EVE you have stated that players will be allowed to train multiple characters on multiple accounts, yet if I read into what you have written the correct message you wish to convey CCP is now backing away from allowing players to use multiple accounts at one and the same time by making such a method of play so difficult as to become useless, rather goes against the historical ethos of EVE in my view.

There is no Clich'e in this thread that I can detect, you took what was a fully functional and perfectly acceptable log in procedure and replaced it with one that you were fully aware was broken, not only that but even if by chance you got it to work was by it's very nature going to reduce functionality and degrade performance for players, this was explained to you in detail when you introduced it to SISI by players that found it problematic on multiple levels and yet here we are again on TQ with more broken and badly thought through aspects of the game forced onto players for no good or fully explained reasoning.

Again it does not look very good for the next iteration of EVE if this is the state of CCP Devs coding and design does it really.

CCP Devs seem to take exception to the term ' if it is not broken then do not fix it ', but the phrase developed through sound and logical thinking into one of ' Only make change if is for the better not simply because you can '. in this case the later seems better to fit what CCP is doing currently and failing at miserably.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#1940 - 2013-05-22 01:18:18 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Valeria Crossroads wrote:
The launcher only remembers the last 7 accounts. I have way more than that. I really hope you guys do not expect me to type the account names over and over again. Ugh

How many accounts do you have?


Assume a large power of 2 and implement it. CCP has never worried about disk space before, why start now?